Maybe guinsoos/devourer arent the problem...

P0oHiHOhLh·Mar 15, 2016·17 votes·1,513 views

Maybe its that there are no good items that counter them. When high dps champions make those items, frozen heart hardly puts a dent in they're attack speed. Same with omen. And they arent using crit so omens damage reducition is useless. Thornmail is only good if your stacking other AD items, and even then it wont reflect much because so much incoming damage is magic from onhit that even IF you were stacking armor items its hardly marginally effective, while also requiring magic resist items to negate the onhit.

And then on top of this they just run warlords for free ( WAY TO MUCH) Free life steal. Like up to 20%? That keystone is worth like 1k in gold or more. So even if i build all these defensive items, i will lack the damage to duel someone with guinsoos/devourer because they will just out heal me because i had to buy nothing but defense.

21 Comments

Slamurai JackMar 15, 20164 votes

No one who builds Rageblade and Devourer also runs Warlords. Ever. So don't even make that argument.

WoonStruckMar 15, 20164 votes

Rageblade+Devourer is almost 100% Fervor.

Edit the Warlord's bit out. That's an issue with ADCs and Nasus near-exclusively. Completely irrelevant.

SaltyKrackaMar 15, 20162 votes

Haha, what shit-ass Nasus would ever run Warlord's?

He's far far far too reliant on the Tenacity and slow reduction from Resolve to ever even think of it.

Also, p.sure Warlord's just kinda sucks, even on ADCs.

WoonStruckMar 15, 20162 votes

{quoted}

Haha, what shit-ass Nasus would ever run Warlord's?

He's far far far too reliant on the Tenacity and slow reduction from Resolve to ever even think of it.

Also, p.sure Warlord's just kinda sucks, even on ADCs.

Because sometimes the Tenacity is of minimal use.

Warlord's Guarantees you will not be pushed out of lane as Nasus, no matter how hard people bully you. Unless you're charging in ahead of your team, you basically WILL get to someone. Tenacity/slow reduction aren't absolutely 100% required. Its a strong mastery on him, but what use will it be if you can't even lane?

Its the same concept as flash/ghost or flash/exh on Vlad. Ghost actually allows him to teamfight, but sometimes you need exhaust to make it through a match-up.

SaltyKrackaMar 15, 20161 votes

Thing is, Nasus already has built-in lifesteal. If he's not surviving laning phase and is regularly getting pushed out, it's because he's regularly getting zoned away from minions or straight up getting all-inned and ganked.

Warlord's doesn't help one iota with that.

And as a Melee character who is simply one of the most kiteable in the game, he really does need that Tenacity and slow resistance. It is never not useful on him.

P0oHiHOhLhMar 15, 20162 votes

{quoted}

Rageblade+Devourer is almost 100% Fervor.

Edit the Warlord's bit out. That's an issue with ADCs and Nasus near-exclusively. Completely irrelevant.

You can't be serious. Warlords is so broken.

vampric sceptar 900 gold. long sword = 10 ad for 350 gold, so the lifesteal portion costs you 550 for 10%. You can get up to 20 % life steal from warlords which is worth 1100 gold. Not only is that alot of lifesteal but it relieves you from buying a lifesteal item and gives you completely free sustain.

SithesisLordMar 15, 20162 votes

Most Xin Zhao, Jax, Kayle and Irelia's i´ve seen take Fervor. The stacking damage is better for them than the incresing lifesteal the lower their HP is. Nasus often takes GotU. ADCs either take Fervor or TLD.

Warlord's is fine now.

MyozthirirnMar 15, 20163 votes

its actualy 2-20% life steal vs champions and 1-10% vs minions so 110-1100 gold or 55-550 depending on your target and your life %

Compare it to fervor that ramps up to 112 damage on hit at max stacks max level (38,6 at lvl 6)

bobsenbobMar 15, 20161 votes

yeh, but at the point you get maximum lifesteal you're low enough that even if you're building "tank yi" or whatever you'll be bursted down

AnratonMar 15, 20161 votes

The problem (normally) is neither guinsoos nor devourer, but the synergy of both.

Another (not as powerfull) example is Rylais ans Liandys

WoonStruckMar 15, 20161 votes

A better example is any ADC item and any other ADC item.

Maw+Sterak's, defensively.

AnratonMar 15, 20161 votes

Well more trinity + steraks :-D

JayrettMar 15, 20161 votes

Throw in Morde's ult with DTF. G to the G.

AstôlfoMar 15, 20161 votes

I was expecting another blame-the-champions thread. That would have been annoying. Kudos to you for actually being more reasonable.

JQKAndreiMar 15, 20161 votes

Not tp say that those items synergyse perfectly with BotRK.

VekknaMar 15, 20161 votes

Right, soo....items without counters are a problem. Ergo, Guinsoo's and Devourer are a problem.

NazZomLordMar 15, 20161 votes

The best you can do to counter them is item 3110 item 3143 item 3075 And even then it does ALOT of damage. Personally when i see a Yi or other AA based sated Shen will have my teams back. TO THE SAFETY ZONE!

P0oHiHOhLhMar 16, 20161 votes

{quoted}

The best you can do to counter them is And even then it does ALOT of damage. Personally when i see a Yi or other AA based sated will have my teams back. TO THE SAFETY ZONE!

So the best i can do is build 3 defensive items just because one champion will come at me with devourer? and theres so much wasted stats.

NazZomLordMar 16, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Cold Fingers,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qLn2gqA1,comment-id=00070000,timestamp=2016-03-16T11:11:35.837+0000)

So the best i can do is build 3 defensive items just because one champion will come at me with devourer? and theres so much wasted stats.

Well really all you need is two, i like Randuins and Thornmail. I didnt mean to buy them all on Shen.

DengedenMar 15, 20161 votes

It's true, tank items (kind of like AP items) are geared towards teamfighting. Have you ever grouped during the mid game shortly after you completed your FH? It's brutal just how much of an unkillable CC machine you become (... in my elo).

The fighters' primary weakness has always been their inability to get to the backline without getting pinatad. Incidentally, the lifesteal from Warlord's is good, yes but stacking lifesteal usually doesn't do much for you. I.e.more damage will give you just as much sustain and ... more damage. Its primary use is for trading and sustaining back up.

I don't think armor items for 1v1 should exist (unless you give it something stupid like lower the armor per number of allies/enemies around you), it'd make top lane (and some bot lanes) incredibly toxic to play. I remember rushing a thornmail vs Riven and facetanking her damage, sure, it was fun but unfair.