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From a design (and not balance) perspective, I think that SOME keystones have failed

TeCoolMage··5 votes·653 views

In game, players are encouraged to make themselves unique through the keystone masteries they take. This worked definitely on a few keystones like Thunderlord's decree, which has a huge explosion every once in a while, but not on others like Warlord's Bloodlust.

Why? Because they're flat stats. Flat stats are the bane of identity. I honestly think, that Riot should put someone like CertainlyT to specifically make 9 unique masteries. The entire goal of masteries begs for it, while people have complained that some champs were broken compared to others as we all know CT does tend to sacrifice balance (and occasionally counterplay YasuoYasuoYasuoYasuo amirite jk jk don't hunt me down yasuo mains) for completely unique passives and abilities, masteries are accessible by everyone.

Things that make a mastery unique: Not easily accessible, Visual effects

Failed

  • Strength of Ages - Really just a limited Sion passive, flat HP per kill...
  • Fervor of battle - gain more damage on auto attacks if you use it more - flat stats,
  • Warlord's Bloodlust - a flat stat reliant condition (crit) that gants another flat stat (lifesteal),

Debatable

  • Windspeaker's Blessing - this one is really debatable, if intelligence (+5% CDR and its cap) was a keystone, it would be like Windspeaker's Blessing, it breaks the rules for flat stats. I really think it could be better but it's not the best example. It lacks a visual effect.
  • Stormraider's Surge - I really want to put this on succeeded but I can see a few arguments, but is seriously borders succeeded undeniably. On one hand it's just speed, on the other it has a cool visual effect and speeding up is noticeable.
  • Bond of Stone - Also very debatable. I think there's no visual effect, but extremely unique so it's also borders succeeded.

Succeeded

  • Grasp of the Undying - I may have never noticed it before but people say it has a visual effect and it's unique so that's pretty great.
  • Deathfire Touch - your enemies set on fire, that's pretty great, visual effect and all. However, it should be different, if not opposite visually from Corrupting Potion. Make it extremely noticable, like fire coming to life in a quick period of time, a blaze or explosion.
  • Thunderlord's Decree - Huge explosion, sudden damage, visual effect, sometimes I have trouble seeing the AoE clearly though and the AoE is kinda small but that's another discussion in itself.

When I heard about keystones (and they weren't released or revealed yet), I thought "Wow so there'll be more glowy stuff, projectiles and explosions in a game? COOL!" but it kinda didn't work out that way.

Maybe Windspeaker's should've had a sphere around you to represent more resistances, or even made the healing even more but made it a decaying shield. Maybe Bond of Stone should've looked like Kalista or Illaoi's visual effects with Oathsworn or pulled spirits. Maybe Warlord's bloodlust should've looked like Soraka's self healing from hitting Q and scaled with AP / HP. They should be as noticeable as Ashe shooting a volley not looking like Varus shooting his arrows.

I think they should've made Runaan's look like a mastery.

EDIT: Yay downvotes for trying to make a meaningful discussion!

DOUBLE EDIT: OMG the bandwagon voting has been defied, HOW?!

11 Comments

LankPants2 votes

Where would you say Grasp of the Undying fits in since you completely left it out?

Personally I'd say it's one of the best in terms of overall feel.

TeCoolMage1 votes

Oh damn I was wondering why I could only count 8

I haven't seen anything directly related to it in visuals, but if there aren't, there should be a Soraka or kindred like visual effect but otherwise, it'd be like bond of stone, unique but "ehhh I can't really see it in game helppp"

Ralanr1 votes

It's great on tanks. It's actually why I like the resolve tree. The ferocity tree feels like a tree I need to put points in to be offensive. But the resolve tree makes me want to experiment.

TeCoolMage1 votes

Well, yes, that's the point. It just doesn't have the excitement of a super flashy mastery, which is why it's a good balanced mastery but a badly designed one too.

I'm more of a cunning tree kind of guy myself, though ;)

Abyssphere1 votes

{quoted}

Oh damn I was wondering why I could only count 8

I haven't seen anything directly related to it in visuals, but if there aren't, there should be a Soraka or kindred like visual effect but otherwise, it'd be like bond of stone, unique but "ehhh I can't really see it in game helppp"

Grasp of the Undying has a visual of the health going from the enemy to you :) It's a weird green swirling thing.

TeCoolMage1 votes

Ooh nice I never noticed it but I'll add it to the list

Abyssphere2 votes

I do think some of them should be more noticeable than they are. I'm seeing Thunderlord's constantly now and I think it's because it's got by far the best visual feedback of any of the masteries. It FEELS powerful, whereas a lot of them don't feel like anything at all.

TeCoolMage1 votes

Yes, power is all in the visuals and even wind speaker blessing on Soraka makes you think of Soraka being powerful, with no thought to the mastery. Even stormraider's surge looks more powerful even if it's not on some champs.

That's why I love Thunderlord over most other masteries and take it on ADCs for dem extra burst.

DeathBurst1 votes

There are a few mistakes in your post, I correct them below. But first a general reply.

I agree that Keystone should feel as powerful as they are (and damn, they are pretty powerful). This is not exactly the case for all of them. But you have to keep in mind that the game also need clarity, and that if you add too many particles and VFX, you can't really understand what's happening anymore. So yeah, I can see your point, but I can also see the other side of the issue, and I think the current situation is a good middle-ground.

So about these technical errors:

{quoted}

  • Windspeaker's Blessing - this one is really debatable, if intelligence (+5% CDR and its cap) was a keystone, it would be like Windspeaker's Blessing, it breaks the rules for flat stats. I really think it could be better but it's not the best example. It lacks a visual effect.

For this one, there IS a visual effect. A little yellow shield with a "+" on it, when you heal/shield someone.

  • Bond of Stone - Also very debatable. I think there's no visual effect, but extremely unique so it's also borders succeeded.

Once again, there is a visual effect, but it is less noticeable than windspeaker. There are some broad "arrows" at the feet of the champs involved in the damage exchange (not exactly arrows, but a broad, curvy, pointy shape to indicate the direction of the champs involved). But yeah, maybe a VFX à la Kalista/Illaoi would have been better.

I haven't seen anything directly related to [Grasp of the undying] in visuals, but if there aren't, there should be a Soraka or kindred like visual effect but otherwise, it'd be like bond of stone, unique but "ehhh I can't really see it in game helppp"

There is a really cool green essence flowing from your opponent to you when you proc the heal. That's the best part of these level 2 trades with Mundo toplane. :) Also, this one was of tremendous importance, because you absolutely need to end the trade just after this proc, and not just before, and you can't really look into your buff bar in the middle of a trade. So yeah, it's a huge success, on par with Thunderlord.

  • Warlord's Bloodlust - a flat stat reliant condition (crit) that gants another flat stat (lifesteal),

I'd be surprised if there was no VFX for the heal/AS buff, similar to the one on Grasp of the undying or Stormraider. But I do not play champ that use Warlord, and I must admit I never noticed the VFX if it exists on my ADC. Too many other things to look at :)

  • Strength of Ages - Really just a limited Sion passive, flat HP per kill...

Not sure about this one. There is a heal on canon minions once you reach the limit. Isn't there a visual effect for this heal?

TeCoolMage1 votes

Wait, so you're saying that 2-3k health Soraka that healed the ADC for more than 2/3 of his health on 1 w wasn't using wind speaker's blessing?

Holy sht man I don't know what to say about Soraka anymore.

And I thought arrows were from Zeke's herald ._.

I'm honestly not sure if this proves my point (I don't notice these masteries) or disproves it (they have a lot of visual effects)

DeathBurst1 votes

The shield from Windspeaker is a small icon, not a real bubble around the champion. Like the icons in the arcade skins for Sona powerchords or Veigar AP stacking, if you see what I mean? https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=P5ZUTgs9nnI#t=865 (timer 14:25, look Jana's shield on Cait)

The "arrows" from Zeke's and from Bond of Stones are very different. For Bond, it only flashes when damages are dealt. https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=0Qz05C2YHzg#t=733 (timer 12:13, when Thresh Flay MF, you can see a blue curve pointing from MF to Illaoi. There is another instance around ~3:00 when Vayne make a quick trade, but it's hard to see because it's hidden below Vayne silver bolts.)

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