Lets nerf the shit out of Mana, and keep Energy the same. Real Fair Riot

Gorsz·1/19/2015, 3:49:12 PM·244 votes·10,952 views

I just played orianna for the first time after mana regen nerfs vs a yasuo. He can spam like a retarded monkey on crack, endlessly push, yet im incredibly gated by mana, and im limited to a few spells before I get to sit there OOM, even after chalice.

Good job destroying a previously real fun champion.

How can they make severe re-balancing changes like this after 4-5 years ? No wonder manaless champions are dominating mid.

How is it possible they make such huge sweeping mana regen nerfs and expect it to equally affect all champions fairly? For example; Orianna needs some mana reduction on her spells.

EDIT: My mistake Yasuo does not use energy, but fundamentally my argument is the same. Energy/zero resource lane push vs super mana gate is not fair whatsoever.

293 Comments

asktiks1/19/2015, 4:05:45 PM59 votes

cant have any champ that can actually play against zed or yasuo mid, nope cant have that

only syndra could stay in lane with them and actually do some dmg before going oom , so they nerfed her AND morollemicon , and tell us zed is a "healthy assasins" and that they WANT him to be able to one button delete you under turret

ive just stopped playing , period I ll wait for a few patches, play dota 2, hon, and other mobas in the meantime

if I wanted to play an instagib fest where first person to push button wins , id go play call of duty or some other bulshit gib-fest

riot has gotten too big for their own good and using LCS to balance WILL be their undoing, ive seen it before and Wow and I promise it will eventually happen here, im just waiting for this years lcs to be the most one dimensional, on rails, binary tournament we have ever seen, when people get tired of seeing the same champs over and over making the same plays...well see what riots left with

meantime ive taken to closing my wallet to riot and not spending one friggin cent on this game anymore, ill enjoy what skins I already bought , play aram and go play dota 2 in the meantime since I can actually counter shit IN GAME ( not onlyu at champ select) by actually building differently there

Auryiel1/19/2015, 5:26:22 PM37 votes

IMO making mana a relevant ressource again was a good move

Know what was not a good move, however? Not rebalancing (or at least taking a look at) literally every spell in a mage or assassin's kit.

Orianna's spells should be immensely stronger than Zed's, for example. Why? Well for one, the fact that Zed doesn't care about his ressource usage, but also the fact that he has nigh unlimited damage through his auto-attacks... OH AND F*CKING LIFESTEAL -_-''

It's impossible to both push as hard and harass through lifesteal AD assassins get infinite pushing power, sustain and the ability to gib you at 6 Mages get limited pushing power (rofl, wtf kind of game is this where assassins can push as well as mages ANYWAY?), no sustain and the ability to die at level 6 because fuck you I picked Zed

sigh

/rant

Yoella1/19/2015, 7:22:47 PM21 votes

The downside to manaless champions (energy or resourceless) is supposed to be that they're gated by long cooldowns and, in the case of energy champions, are vulnerable when they run out of energy entirely. However this no longer the case, as energy and resourceless champions continue to get stronger abilities on shorter cooldowns that no longer require full combos to do significant damage. Moreso they can spam abilities all day like it's nothing, allowing them to be more aggressive and take more risks than mana champions with very little drawback.

At level 3 as Veigar an E+W+Q combo at level 3 takes up a significant amount of mana, so much in fact that if I screwed up or had to use it twice I would be dangerously low on mana. Meanwhile, Zed can create an untargetable shadow clone, throw two long range shurikens at me, and slow me if possible constantly from level 2 on, never having to worry about running out of abilities. Once I hit 6 as Veigar my combos cost even more. Oh, I've gotta poke him down with my E+W+Q before I can kill him? Alright, now I'll just do it again and add my ultimate for the kill. WAIT I DON'T HAVE ENOUGH MANA LEFT FOR A FULL COMBO. Meanwhile Zed's laughing and spamming shurikens at me and ulting under my tower to kill me with his execute and teleport away with 0 tower damage before I can even say "ah fudge".

Gorsz1/19/2015, 7:09:49 PM20 votes

Going further, look at all the top mage win rates in the game.

Swain Heimer Cass Kat Malz

Swain has a passive that restores mana Heimer auto pushes lane with low costs turrets that enemy mages cannot keep up with due to mana gate. Cass has mana replenish on her twin fang. Kat - resourceless Malz - Auto pushes lane with mana regenerating space aids.

I wonder if this a coincidence..

Surr20plz1/19/2015, 7:40:38 PM9 votes

DONT NERF ENERGY

REVERT THE MANA NERF

SmokingPuffin1/19/2015, 4:21:34 PM8 votes

Are energy users really dominating mid? Zed and who, exactly?

DJ Siamak1/19/2015, 4:14:41 PM8 votes

The only real outlier here is Zed, mages shouldn't be able to mindlessly spam like they could last season.

Hyrum Graff1/19/2015, 6:11:54 PM7 votes

Mana regen nerfs were warranted -- you shouldn't be able to spam (in your words) like a retarded monkey on crack.

They just also need to nerf energy/manaless.

Bard in a Diaper1/19/2015, 6:00:08 PM5 votes

try playing galio brah, orianna is manaless compared to him

OperationDEEZ11/19/2015, 5:03:25 PM5 votes

Am I the only one who thinks the mana regen nerfs aren't that bad. With Anivia all I need are mana regen seals and my rod/chalice and I'm good to go.

Pudii Pudii1/19/2015, 7:30:55 PM2 votes

I feel like Riot just spoiled all you mage players with overwhelming mana regeneration items and now you guys are just not used to it. I'm pretty sure when riot first developed their game, their intent wasn't to just force mages to rush 1 mana item before their core build. Mana regen before this nerf was outrageous, you're suppose to use spells decisively and purposefully not every time they are off cooldown.