What the fuck is the point of the Karthus nerf?

Xelvi·12/9/2015, 10:55:27 PM·8 votes·2,210 views

He wasn't that strong to begin with, even with the stupid Deathfire Touch Keystone. But so even if his damage was a problem (it wasn't) you nerf his WALL? His wall is absolutely VITAL to maximising his damage and you nerf the slow by 50% AFTER 1 SECOND?

ARE YOU SERIOUS?

So let me get this straight. You create a (really poorly thought out) Keystone that increases his damage to a level that wasn't even overpowered, but then nerf his personal and team fighting UTILITY? REALLY?

And Karthus isn't the only one of course. Poor Swain, easily the worst nerf the game has ever seen.

Riot balancing: create dumb damage mastery, nerf previously perfectly balanced champs' UTILITY to try to fix the most poorly thought out set of mastery changes the game has ever seen. At this point you're not even trying to balance the game; you're just changing things for the sake of changing them in ways that are mindbogglingly stupid.

13 Comments

Nekusen12/10/2015, 12:20:53 AM3 votes

Yasuo has 53% ban rate, so they decided to nerf Karthus

Danny DeVito12/9/2015, 10:59:34 PM2 votes

"Easily the worst nerf the game has ever seen"

Then you remember Irelia getting kneecapped

Itadaki Seieki12/9/2015, 11:01:47 PM2 votes

"easily the worst nerf the game has ever seen. "

Oh yeah like the Veigar rework wasn't that bad. Nor was the Morde rework.

Oh neither was you know, Irelia getting shot to the ground, uh. Remember Kha when he got nerfed to the point of not being seen unless the person played him almost all the time. Do you remember Xin? The champion who gets nerfed EVERYTIME he's seen to be really strong?

These nerfs aren't bad, they could be MUCH worse, please get over yourself.

Shac Norris12/9/2015, 10:57:30 PM2 votes

In the end, higher elo players decided that he needed that nerf and your low elo opinion means nothing to them.

That's probably how it is :)

IcyPepper12/9/2015, 11:12:16 PM1 votes

Bruh, there's already recent threads about this exact same topic. What's the point of making a new thread when you can just bump those?

Or downvote literally everyone in the comments instead of responding? Uh, okay I guess. Guess you weren't looking for actual discussion, otherwise you would have posted in one...

Aeszarck12/10/2015, 12:19:48 AM1 votes

I'm going to copy and paste my response on another one of the Karthus threads since I don't think anyone saw it. (That thread was kind of old. (Old as in day old and not very popular.)) "I'm silver II, so take this with a grain of salt, but I think that the preseason made Karthus quite strong. (I also have level 5 Mastery on Karthus, but take that with a grain of salt too since I have level 5 with a lot of champions.) His weak early game was improved slightly, his midgame power spike became much stronger, and his incredible lategame teamfighting potential became even better. Why? Rod of Ages got buffed, and that was generally a core item on him unless he got ahead in lane and decided to rush Rylai's instead. This is partly what made his midgame power spike greater, but the real buff that improved his performance during all parts of the game was the addition of Deathfire Touch. He has an incredibly high uptime for it due to his spammable Lay Waste and his toggleable Defile, and so he can be more of a threat in the early game and be even more ridiculous of a threat lategame. While I'm sad to say it, Karthus needed some nerfs to tone down his insane synergy with Deathfire Touch (and to a much lesser extent Rod of Ages), and I'm with Riot on the nerf. It won't allow Karthus to apply his sustained damage as easily, and this will decrease the incredible duration of Deathfire Touch that Karthus was once able to put out. Karthus is an unpopular champion, but being unpopular has no bearing on whether a champion needs a nerf or not. He became too strong with the preseason patch, and they nerfed him."

I don't main Karthus, but I play him enough to know how strong Deathfire Touch and Rod of Ages made him. He's been strong for awhile, just underplayed. Why is he underplayed? He doesn't have an interesting kit, his ultimate, while awesome, has an extremely long cooldown and some champions (and Zhonya's) can counter it, his early laning phase is weak, his autoattacks are atrocious, and he is extremely immobile. These facts does not mean that Karthus is weak. Karthus has many strengths to offset his weaknesses. He has an extremely poweful ultimate despite its counters, he has ridiculous damage on Lay Waste during the mid and late game for its low cooldown, Defile provides insane teamfight utility through its massive damage and zoning potential, and Wall of Pain ALSO provides insane teamfight utility as well as ridiculous catching potential (very difficult to maneuver around and slows for a ton if not dashed over). His passive is also extremely strong and gives him a counter to focus the carry strategies in that he can still contribute to a fight for seven seconds after his death. My point is, Karthus was in a good position at the end of Season Five despite his low playrate. When Season Six came around, Karthus got two relatively large indirect buffs. Though he might not have benefitted as much as Brand, he certainly benefitted, and the power that he gained from those buffs was enough to warrant a nerf. Why nerf his wall and not his damage? Because damage is what Karthus contributes to teamfights. Karthus is a teamfighting champion. He is not a catch champion. His wall let him be a catch champion, and his damage allowed him to be a catch and kill champion. His wall will still provide teamfight utility like it always did, but it's power while Karthus is alone is weaker, and that's what is important. If opponents get half their movespeed back after a little while, they can dodge more of Karthus's Lay Wastes and potentially get out of Defile range. His damage was oppressive, but nerfing it was not the way to go, since his damage was all he really brought to a teamfight besides a slow. He needed his slow nerfed so that he could still participate in teamfights like he always did, but not be able reliably apply his damage as he once did without team assistance.

E4T DA POO POO 12/21/2015, 11:26:10 AM1 votes

Me as higher gold elo Karthus main also agree that this nerf is pretty damn dumb...but if you look closely to it it is fully understandable.

Karthus was and will be always a niche pick, as he requires tons of good positioning on lane and has a very highskillcap all around (He is not just Press R for win)

In a way deathfire touch and even now thunderlords buff his early dmg extremly. Karthus should depend on farm and map awareness in early. It was rediculously easy before with deathfire touch. I went all in all day with lvl 2 or 1 with my slow and the DMG was enough to destroy everything easily in combination with exhaust. Karthus got benefited hard with the new Masteries. The slow is in lategame still insanely strong even if it decays after 1 sec for 50 percent of his maximum slow number. So if you slow them for 80 percent, after 1 second they are still slowed for 40 percent. It´s a needed balance change so Karthus stays that what he is: A lategame focused high sustained DMG-Monster with hypercarry abilities. And not an early game all in Lanebully. If you are just a bit skilled with Karthus, you know what i mean: I killed for 2 weeks all in 1on1 easily and Riot did quite ok in form of not nerfing his damage output. What i find absolutely fair....even a bit too fair.

But many people who gained mostly free-Elo with Karthus in Silv and Bronze will be now mad i guess.

Karthus is high risk and high reward in a way.

If you suck dick with him in terms of farming and positioning this champ is incredible useless most of the time. On the other hand he was always one of the best lategame-monsters with insane dmg-output and a mass slow of 80 percent which shreds MR.

Calm your titties guys, Karthus still strong in right hands.

Greetz..