Boards›Gameplay

As a 6 year udyr Main, i absolutely hate this rework for 2 diminutive reasons.

NA Darklarik··8 votes·1,933 views

Disclaimer: Udyr has been my Main since season 1 (My main account is in the LAS Server, this account is only for participating in the NA Forums). For those who havent seen it yet: Here When i first read the changes,** i was skeptical but i _liked _the direction**, god knows Udyr is struggling right now and needs some changes, and i liked everything i saw... until... I read 2 small things that horrified me, as they have severe reaching effects than it seems.

1. The removal of his AP ratios on Phoenix 2. The removal of his DOT damage stacking (or clipping) on Tiger.

It murders a lot of his 1 stance exclusive playstyles and completely removes any AP or Hybrid Playstyles. One of the beautiful things about Udyr is his versatility, and ability to build nearly any item and make use of it for its stats. But now, many of them are just plain gone, and worse, his 1 Offense stance playstyles will SUCK now. Im talking about opting to go exclusively for Tiger or Exclusively for Phoenix. I have always found it more optimal to for several reasons, to regardless the build, max W and E to their full potential. You NEED them. This lead to the know Phoenix and Tiger Playstyles, but now, riot is FORCING you to put points into BOTH if you want to have any semblance of damage on him.

Lets start with why this murders Tiger stance. Primarily Tiger stance, as Phoenix exclusive might actually still work. So first, Why? Due to Tiger Stance's damage being spread out over and no longer stacking.

  1. Tiger Stance's Dot damage is now spread over a ridicolous 6 seconds, but hasent recieved any significant short term DPS buffs.
  2. ** IT DOSENT STACK**
  3. Its heavily reliant on stacking your passive before it begins to remotely hurt. Udyr already has the problem of sticking to targets and being able to stay on them, he is so damn kitable it baffles me that they would go this direction. Even if you get a fully stacked DOT out its only going to deal 351 (1.17 Bonus AD) OVER SIX SECONDS. DAMAGE DOSENT STACK, ONLY REFRESHES. This is a MASSIVE DPS NERF Compared to the current Tiger Stance. This MURDERS Tiger Stance as a viable build. They are FORCING you to have to put points in both Tiger AND Phoenix if you want _ANY _sort of damage. Having to first stack your passive to 5 then having pitiful damage spread over 6 seconds lowers his DPS on a Pure Tiger stance build tremendously, especially when considering that Udyr already has trouble potentially getting to his targets.

AP Builds and Hybrid builds are gone. While not the most viable there are certain situations where an AP or Hybrid Udyr is a nightmare thanks to the scaling of Turtle stance, building AP also bolsters defenses. But now Phoenix no longer has an AP Ratio. This removes a lot of AP build paths that Udyr could make use of for Splitpushing or providing heavy magic damage fighter for his team, and in fact **makes his Phoenix exclusive build insanely Optimal over Tiger stance as well. **

Since both the AOE and Cone damage now scale with AD but still deal Magic damage, Udyr can now itemize both damage TIPES with a single Item Type. However, for starters, the Base damage reduction means that all his TANK HEAVY BUILDS ARE GONE. Currently if you build full tank on Udyr you will still have some semblance of decent damage as far as tanks are concerned, but with the new Scaling Tank builds are off the table as you will just be a fast moving sponge. Not to mention that Tiger has been nerfed so hard that it seems the ability is made to support his Phoenix stance rather than stand out on its own.

TLDR: This direction would be good if they werent Removing the Stacking from Tiger's DOT damage because it murders its playstyle, and removing the AP Ratio on Phoenix kills all his Hybrid and AP builds as well as cripples many Tank builds. **Rito Please. Dont pigeonhole Udyr into being a AD juggernaut who obligatory and only maxes out Phoenix to be optimal. **

> **Make his DOT damage have some form of Stacking/Clipping and give his Phoenix his AP ratio back. **

50 Comments

UnboundHades3 votes

I still fell like udyr needs a flat out rework since he has one of the lowest skill ceilings in the game

LostFr0st4 votes

Udyr actually has the highest skill ceiling based on Riot internal data. Second highest is Singed.

That's why they've been so hesitant to touch the two of them.

TEA Nietzsche 2 votes

I highly doubt that: http://www.leagueofgraphs.com/de/champions/stats/udyr

LostFr0st2 votes

Found the comments to back up what I wrote: turns out they were on Reddit no wonder I couldn't find them on the boards

whole thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/5it89y/anivia_in_71/

select comments:

Zirene:

Back around a few months after Azir release it was Azir, Rumble, Udyr in the 1,2,3 slots. Imo the champions that usually occupy the top slots have unique mechanics that you can't learn by playing other champions. Sometimes playing something like a Skarner or Volibear could prepare you for Udyr's style, but a lot of people don't get the whole "no ultimate" 4 stance dancing. Rumble self silences and aiming his ultimate was always considered a highly rewarding ability when mastered. And Azir took a lot of time learning to control the soldiers and you got rewarded heavily for landing hits, but if you misplaced your soldiers you got dunked on. The other thing to consider when looking at mastery curve is that the champion may be hard to learn etc. but they are incredibly rewarding to learn! Which usually means they are incredibly powerful in the hands of a master. Difference between Azir being 35% first play and 53% 100th play and someone being 29%-49% with a 20% jump but the champion is still meh even when perfected. https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/5it89y/anivia_in_71/dbbcnnq/

Phroxz0n:

I don't believe there's an aggregated list anywhere, but champion.gg used to have some semi close graphs. Taliyah is showing 80% winrate for 125+ games though, which indicates sample size problems (they just don't have the same volume of data that we get). Off the top of my head in no particular order, top 10 is roughly udyr, singed, azir, ryze, Vladimir, taliyah, Anivia, rumble, asol, gp, tf. https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/5it89y/anivia_in_71/dbbm5bz/

TEA Nietzsche 1 votes

We have internal data on winrate based on number of games played for each champion, which is generally used as a stand in for mastery, but understood to not be the full picture

Difference between Azir being 35% first play and 53% 100th play and someone being 29%-49% with a 20% jump but the champion is still meh even when perfected.

Ahh, so they define skill ceiling as winrate difference between first and 100th play. Well I guess then it makes sense although I'd argue that the skill ceiling shouldn't be at 100 games.

Just take a look at Udyr's stats, his winrate stagnates at 100 games while other champions' such as Vayne, Azir and Riven still see improvement past the first 100 games.

But I guess it comes down to how you define skill ceiling..

LostFr0st1 votes

Yeah it "stagnates" but that curve is mostly just Udyr skillset. For Vayne, Riven etc. you can put games into a variety of different champions in order to "jump" some of that mastery curve.
Their data takes that into account while 3rd party sites' doesn't.

TEA Nietzsche 1 votes

Yeah but that proves my point even more. The mastery curve on champion.gg is the actual mastery curve which means that if people jumped some of that mastery curve by putting games in different champions then the actual mastery curve that takes that into account would look even steeper for Vayne etc.

LostFr0st1 votes

That's not the Vayne skillcurve though. That's the ADC skillcurve + Vayne (ie plz don't Ult tumble then immediately auto into the enemy team losing the stealth pocket).

TEA Nietzsche 1 votes

I really do not understand what point you are trying to make. Udyr mains do not need to be able to jungle? I don't get it.

LostFr0st2 votes

Udyr's play pattern--as a melee chmpion with neither true gapcloser nor ultimate-- is very unique. Due those things, the play-pattern skills from very few champs prepare someone for playing Udyr to the best of his ability. Someone needs to play Udyr specifically to get better at him, whereas someone could just play one of the many other ranged kiting champions in the game as prep for playing Vayne optimally.

If that doesn't make sense it's w/e, but that's the best way I can put it.

TEA Nietzsche 2 votes

I hear what you are saying but my point is that these specific play-patterns are apparantly learnt after 100 games as there is no progress afterwards.

And the people we see in the Vayne learning curve statistics are probably not all new to ADC - which means that Vayne's learning curve is even more impressive. Despite people being able to skip parts of it by playing other ADC's it still looks very steep and we can assume that it would look even steeper if people hadn't learned other ADC's before.

So in the end if you look at it it seems that Udyr doesn't have a high ceiling, he just has a relatively high skill floor as people can't really learn Udyr by playing other champions. However, once this hurdle has ben taken (after about 100 games) there is not much room for improvement left as opposed to the likes of Vayne where people can still improve after 100 games - even if they had learned other ADC's before.

LostFr0st2 votes

I think that's a decent middle ground. I enjoyed debating this with you btw.

NA Darklarik1 votes

{quoted}

I still fell like udyr needs a flat out rework since he has one of the lowest skill ceilings in the game

High mechanics dont dictate how difficult or skillful a champion is

{quoted}

Udyr actually has the highest skill ceiling based on Riot internal data. Second highest is Singed. That's why they've been so hesitant to touch the two of them.

THIS. Just becuase a champ looks simple dosent mean he is. Its very easy to see the difference between a skilled Udyr player and a Bad one, it comes down to game knowledge and experience.

{quoted}

For tiger it doesn't say we can't Tiger (apply DoT)---> insert stance---> Tiger again (apply DoT). Idk if I'd count out these changes just yet.

I went ahead and checked this with some people who have the PBE as well as its stated in Surrender at 20. The DOT simply refreshes the new instance of its damage but dosent stack or clip the remaining damage (just re-sets it). Considering how low it is, and how it applies over 6 Seconds, its a enormous DPS Nerf at any stage of the game or instance if you decide to only max tiger.

LostFr0st1 votes

[{quoted}](name=NA Darklarik,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=mymv5FU3,comment-id=000100000001,timestamp=2017-06-28T10:00:30.944+0000)

High mechanics dont dictate how difficult or skillful a champion is

THIS. Just becuase a champ looks simple dosent mean he is. Its very easy to see the difference between a skilled Udyr player and a Bad one, it comes down to game knowledge and experience.

I dug up the evidence I was looking for and linked it to them. I do wish they would actually make a written blog on it.

I went ahead and checked this with some people who have the PBE as well as its stated in Surrender at 20. The DOT simply refreshes the new instance of its damage but dosent stack or clip the remaining damage (just re-sets it). Considering how low it is, and how it applies over 6 Seconds, its a enormous DPS Nerf at any stage of the game or instance if you decide to only max tiger.

Thanks for checking that. Idk then... it's almost like they're trying to make Udyr do something cheesy like do a phoenix proc between his Tiger DoTs which would be hella awkward :S And both scale with inner beast stacks so...hmmm. Would also make him oom... and stuck there... I don't need to tell you that though do I ^^"

I also have no idea why they left the AP ratio on his shield then. Why not change it to part HP scaling like they did with Skarner?

So I did some rough calcs and idk really. These of course assume Tiger max. https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/9908555f15b9461b12c4e36a6298b611cc3c97f827c80e22ebe0480fb48c773f.png The top numbers are for "full tanky" Udyr building 0 AD, with just a standard 15 AD page. The bottom numbers are for if he goes for a full crazy AD build with some combination of: item 3153 item 3074 item 3026 item 3124 item 3812 item 3078 item 3071 item 3031 item 3072 item 3142 item 3156 item 3053 item 1412 ballparking it to ~270 AD (+30 from elixer) average build (average AD item's AD x5 'cause boots)

I'm well aware att spd and such would come into play here, but roughly speaking idk if it's a straight-up clean-cut nerf.

NA Darklarik3 votes

{quoted}

I think Riot is TRYING to kill 1 stance strategies on Udyr.

He would be a more interesting champ if you had to pay attention to his whole kit for him to be effective, no? I agree with your conclusion, I just don't see what that's a bad thing. That makes the game better for everyone, doesn't it?

still room to max various different skills and get items to help specific stances based on the game, no?

TLDR; yeah, he's losing something, but have you considered what he is gaining from the changes? I'm not an Udyr main, so I can't really comment on that, but from a design standpoint, looks good to me.

No. No. And NO. The whole point is that he is LOSING Room to max different skills, losing build paths, and LOSING entire playstyles. Verstatility comes from his adapatability, these changes are going to make only 1 real way of building him, and kill 3 of his know builds (Hybrid, Tank, and AP) whilist making his most popular playstyle (Tiger) weak as hell.

If you dont max Phoenix your screwed. The removal of the Cliping in his Tiger stance is the biggest problem. That, or the DOT being extended to 6 seconds... You clearly arent understanding these changes.

{quoted} erage AD item's AD x5 'cause boots)

I'm well aware att spd and such would come into play here, but roughly speaking idk if it's a straight-up clean-cut nerf.

Lot of numbers, a little difficult to understand. Still, you dont need a calcultator to know that in combat, having his damage spread out over 6 seconds and not refreshing vs the Clipping oh his current tiger stance is a massive nerf. Spread out damage means less damage per second, more damage perhaps over time. Still, if we were to have both udyr's constnatly standing still and refreshing Tiger stance, the current one would deal maybe a 1/4 of his current damage. Now take that into account in a teamfight and this playstyle is just completely unviable now.

LostFr0st2 votes

Just gonna reply to the part directed at me. The top bit was funny though XD

Lot of numbers, a little difficult to understand. Still, you dont need a calcultator to know that in combat, having his damage spread out over 6 seconds and not refreshing vs the Clipping oh his current tiger stance is a massive nerf.

After around 4~ish seconds the damage evens out. Basically you wouldn't sit in Tiger and instead switch to something else in between like with Phoenix at camps. Also don't need to go full AD squish to get some decent Tiger damage.

NOT SAYING THE CHANGES ARE GOOD- just that they do have some thought behind them.

Spread out damage means less damage per second, more damage perhaps over time. Still, if we were to have both udyr's constnatly standing still and refreshing Tiger stance, the current one would deal maybe a 1/4 of his current damage. Now take that into account in a teamfight and this playstyle is just completely unviable now.

Pretty sure the idea is to force him to switch stances. For every stance change stack he has, he gets 6% bonus damage on top. Idk if Udyr mains are taking that into account.

H4iDES2 votes

{quoted}

Just gonna reply to the part directed at me. The top bit was funny though XD

After around 4~ish seconds the damage evens out. Basically you wouldn't sit in Tiger and instead switch to something else in between like with Phoenix at camps. Also don't need to go full AD squish to get some decent Tiger damage.

NOT SAYING THE CHANGES ARE GOOD- just that they do have some thought behind them.

Pretty sure the idea is to force him to switch stances. For every stance change stack he has, he gets 6% bonus damage on top. Idk if Udyr mains are taking that into account.

yea. as an udyr main i was mad when i looked at this but it may be good i just wish they would let us get aleast 2 stacks with out being in combat

LostFr0st1 votes

Yeah, idk if people will realistically be able to get to 5 while in combat either. It's weird to go from "min-maxing monkey's agility stack falloff timer" to "don't get anything from tactical spamming." Jungle clear will be better for tiger now though. It'd also be nicer if turtle somehow scaled with stacks at least. Maybe that's a tuning lever so he's not indestructible after 5 stacks though, idk. Still think it would be more cohesive since he'd need to build to survive 'till then in the fight.

ZT Xperimentor1 votes

Yet he's played like sona, spam to win, lol. The only difficult part is which one first.

LostFr0st2 votes

That sounds like you play neither champion. The Sona stab seems biased towards her ARAM performance, where her weakness of overextending getting her killed due to her low MS without mana and CDR is erased.

ZT Xperimentor1 votes

Because they ruined sona for playing on the rift, only play her when I get her in aram, lol.

LostFr0st1 votes

No, they balanced Sona around playing Summoner's Rift. She is clearly overtuned in ARAM context, plus her weaknesses are minimized.

ZT Xperimentor1 votes

She's not as interesting as old sona, having to piggyback her teamates to give them any benefit, when she's one of the most fragile champions in the game prone to poke and dives.

Jorencice1 votes

So having weaknesses makes something uninteresting?

Man never thought I'd actually meet a bandwagoner.

ZT Xperimentor1 votes

No she was just more fun to play before her pointless rework. She used to be able to be played middle and top, can't anymore.

UnboundHades1 votes

Singed has a completely different play style compared to every other champ and that's why he is hard while udyr has a bland play style

LostFr0st2 votes

Singed has a completely different play style compared to every other champ and that's why he is hard

Same for Udyr.

while udyr has a bland play style a0

Bland to you...

H4iDES1 votes

{quoted}

I still fell like udyr needs a flat out rework since he has one of the lowest skill ceilings in the game

i dont think u play udyr and if u dont then u dont understand how hard it is to be and udyr i mean u try running at someone to deal damage and the whole time they they flinging everything at u. just so when u get into aa range they can flash

UnboundHades1 votes

Because his entire kit is just buffs to his auto attacks making him almost useless against skilled players.this can be a good concept for a kit but riot did a poor job with udyr

Aseeya2 votes

Awww come ON. ANOTHER rework? I just picked him up as my main! Guess i'll have to refund spirit guard... sigh

NA Darklarik1 votes

{quoted}

Awww come ON. ANOTHER rework? I just picked him up as my main! Guess i'll have to refund spirit guard... sigh

Its wouldent be a BAD Rework if it werent for those 2 small retarded changes :/

Darkdemon6532 votes

AP and hybrid (outside of a Trinity Force) never existed for Udyr. Yes, he's losing damage on Tiger, but as you pointed out, he's gaining damage on Phoenix. Parsing Udyr is always hard, so I'm not going to comment on whether or not he's getting buffed or nerfed, but his design will be better.

King of Demons1 votes

People are downvoting you, but it's true. Those playstyles were just not as good as the "normal" bruiser/AD one and removing them in favor of giving him more power where it actually matters is simply better for the champion on the long run.

SEKAI2 votes

First of all, I ain't no Udyr main, I am not even his player. So take this with a grain of salt.

I personally don't see them taking out the damage clipping on Tiger such a big problem tbh, it just doesn't seem like it's ever intended in the first place. I mean, they can always buff the damage if it turns out too low, now can't they? But maybe it's because I don't play the champ.

What I really don't get though, is why are they taking AP scaling away from Phoenix? I can not understand the reasoning behind such a change. Like, wut?

Isn't the point of Udyr is that he is supposed to be versatile, enough to at least support multiple distinct playstyles? It's always been like this, he could either go AD skirmisher and rush people down like no tomorrow, he could be the AP lawn mow and push and clear like no tomorrow, he could be that tank that makes you think there's no tomorrow, or any combination of those. They even altered his W just then so it strengthens that ideal, somewhat.

And now they're removing his AP build entirely? I don't get it. Unless it is a typo or some mistake, otherwise I really can not understand why they're removing AP oriented Udyr. Has there been a Udyr rampage lately or something I absolutely missed?

Please elaborate it a bit more, Riot.

H4iDES1 votes

{quoted}

First of all, I ain't no Udyr main, I am not even his player. So take this with a grain of salt.

I personally don't see them taking out the damage clipping on Tiger such a big problem tbh, it just doesn't seem like it's ever intended in the first place. But maybe it's because I don't play the champ.

What I really don't get though, is why are they taking AP scaling away from Phoenix? I can not understand the reasoning behind such a change. Like, wut?

Isn't the point of Udyr is that he is supposed to be versatile, enough to at least support multiple distinct playstyles? It's always been like this, he could either go AD skirmisher and rush people down like no tomorrow, he could be the AP lawn mow and push like no tomorrow, he could be that tank that makes you think there's no tomorrow, or any combination of those. They even altered his W just then so it strengthens that ideal, somewhat.

And now they're removing his AP build entirely? I don't get it. Unless it is a typo or some mistake, otherwise I really can not understand why they're removing AP oriented Udyr. Has there been a Udyr rampage lately or something I absolutely missed?

Please elaborate it a bit more, Riot.

Ya i feel yea but the q needs to be able to stack cuz udyr is played like this if you are using tiger Q>E>W>Q this all happends with in 3~4 sec not 6 so by doing this it will be super hard to kill people. also he cant stick to people so thats a huge problem. udyr cant gap close liek yi can or zed i think udyr is the only champoion besides rammums and voil who dont have a strong gap closer and get played in jung

SEKAI1 votes

{quoted}

Ya i feel yea but the q needs to be able to stack cuz udyr is played like this if you are using tiger Q>E>W>Q this all happends with in 3~4 sec not 6 so by doing this it will be super hard to kill people. also he cant stick to people so thats a huge problem. udyr cant gap close liek yi can or zed i think udyr is the only champoion besides rammums and voil who dont have a strong gap closer and get played in jung

Yeah either buff the Tiger damage accordingly as they see fit if the rework goes live and that it's too low, or keep the stacking aspect. One of those, maybe. It is also shown that the DoT duration is made triple from 2 to 6 second, maybe that helps already for when the clip damage is removed.

But idk.

What I'm really concerned, is the removal of AP oriented Udyr. Just seems so unnecessary and detrimental to a character in my eyes.

LostFr0st1 votes

I wanna know how they decided to scale the mana costs. It's no longer in his passive's tooltip.

For tiger it doesn't say we can't Tiger (apply DoT)---> insert stance---> Tiger again (apply DoT). Idk if I'd count out these changes just yet.

ModKnightsKemplar1 votes

I think Riot is TRYING to kill 1 stance strategies on Udyr.

He would be a more interesting champ if you had to pay attention to his whole kit for him to be effective, no? I agree with your conclusion, I just don't see what that's a bad thing. Many champs get changes aimed at lowering their power budget on one or two abilities in favor of making them utilize their whole kit. That makes the game better for everyone, doesn't it?

You'll still get to decide what to max based on what you need per game; it's not like he's fully losing ALL of his versatility; there's still room to max various different skills and get items to help specific stances based on the game, no?

TLDR; yeah, he's losing something, but have you considered what he is gaining from the changes? I'm not an Udyr main, so I can't really comment on that, but from a design standpoint, looks good to me.

Big Lincoln1 votes

it's weird that they'd kill his stance choices when a champion who chooses between assassin and juggernaut is on the PBE right now

ModKnightsKemplar1 votes

I can see that angle.

On the other hand, it's one thing for a champ to have two build choices and still get to utilize their full kit. It's another thing for a champ to use one or two abilities instead of their full kit to help min/max their play.

I can see both sides of the argument, but I'm definitely in agreement with the balance team on this one (I often am).

Big Lincoln3 votes

tiger isn't gonna be worth maxing at all with these changes

you'll put one point in it, for the AS steroid, and then phoenix will be what you max because why would you want 2 damage forms? and if tiger doesn't have the burst, there's no other reason to take it. 6 second DoT that doesn't stack or apply the remaining duration instantly gives way too much time to drain-tank him

NA Darklarik3 votes

{quoted}

I can see that angle.

On the other hand, it's one thing for a champ to have two build choices and still get to utilize their full kit. It's another thing for a champ to use one or two abilities instead of their full kit to help min/max their play.

I can see both sides of the argument, but I'm definitely in agreement with the balance team on this one (I often am).

The problem your not considering is the fact that you will NEED to put point in both Tiger AND Phoenix.

Udyr is heavily reliant on Turtle and Bear, he NEEDS to max these skills as he needs the defenses and mov speed to help him reach his targets without taking obscene amounts of damage and being kited to hell. One extra point i have to put into Tiger or Phoenix to have some form of damage is one point i have to wait to put on W or E.
Hes already a lategame-high XP level dependant champ, and this is only further pushing him in that direction. **If he falls behind now he is totally fucked. ** And of course he will now have only 1 real playstyle, where as before he had like 5 decent ones.

Im mostly pissed off at Tiger no longer being viable since that was my favorite and most successful way of playing him.

ModKnightsKemplar1 votes

It feels like we're still talking past each other to me.

I respect that these changes could have a strong negative impact on the way that Udyr currently plays. It could end up being a HUGE nerf to the current playstyle.

Having said that, this is reminiscent of the way that Aatrox mains reacted to the recent Aatrox changes. Many people didn't like them. Many people STILL don't like them. But, statistically, he's better off. I would argue he's a little healthier. That didn't stop him from getting put on the rework list after Eve and Urgot, though.

I could see something similar happening here. It could be that Udyr gets much healthier from a design standpoint, and that's mostly what I'm looking toward. That doesn't mean that your favorite playstyle will remain intact. Aatrox does not play the way he used to. At all. And it took some practice for people to figure that out.

You may be able to apply that to the new Rammus, too. Again, I wouldn't try to twist your arm and make you like it, but that isn't the same as being an objectively bad change.

WarHero541 votes

Get in Line, been a AP Shaco main since season 2 and now the simple change on his E cripples his AP build. Did they listen to good feedback that makes sense on why they shouldn't make E physical? nope. Honestly I used to be all for this "community", but now its more like a place to vent frustration and for Riot to steal ideas from creative minds.

Jorencice1 votes

EWWW AP Shaco.

Always wondered why people mained someone with a single spell especially when the AD version of the same champ had more sustain, burst, dps AND tank.

Torgal1 votes

Why still no ult for Udyr ?

SEKAI2 votes

{quoted}

Why still no ult for Udyr ?

He's never gonna have one, just like how Elise or Jayce are never going to have ultis, like how Yi is never going to have his Alpha Strike removed, or that how Heimer is never gonna have his turrets taken from him.

H4iDES1 votes

Also i def agree with this udyr they fucked up on tiger but i will say that also making his passive be in combat only is a bad idea also one of the key componets of udyr is to keep your passive stack and consrive mana. by chagning stances in a spfice way but now you will have to spam mana while in fights which is no good cuz this mean if they dont commit as hard as you do then they could poke you down. and WHY WHOULD U MAKE R SCALE WITH AD. I dont care how bad you want me to use the whole kit cuz i he doesnt have a true R he is a q that is and r. and so when you make it scale with ad all that ganna happen is people are ganna max r take one point into q and then build timate into tri and just one shot waves. If you want to make udyr good frist make his passive be stack able out side of combat. second make his q stack thrid give ap sacling to R. then last but not least if you are going to do this then GIVE HIM MORE MS than anyone in the game with boots at lvl 1 cuz he cant stick to anyone worth shit. ples doe dont do this to my champ to our champ. i love this champ too much and he just needs maybe some more on hit dps on his q u know but dont take him and remove this q from him. i love how i can go r or q and it makes the game fresh all your doing is making him be a ad tank that deals ap and ad , who only role will now be to spilt all game and try to win off of that.

H4iDES1 votes

you guys i said this looked bad but on 2nd look after my rage left my body. I dont think this is that bad. i mean the 6 secs dot hurts tiger but makes R way better. i think his combo will be W in bush E out of bush into lane land stun Q proc into R until dot runs out or u need to go back into w to survive. i think this is ganna make him also be even better at clear waves. Timate and R = dead minions. on top of all this if you go the stander 18/12 mastires as if you are playing tiger. the stack will buff your dps thought the roof, and you dont have to lose a point in w or e just at lvl 6 insted of upping your R put it into your Q. granted this doesnt fix the problem of the tiger being dead wichi is sad cuz i like many of you love tiger but in the end a skilled player who knows GATES will take this and be one shoting tower left and right on top of all this now you can afford to put MS qunit in there and not have to sacrifice ad or as for your reds now you can have them and just take a few ad reds with the red as. now you dont need cdr glphys. i mean you get get max cdr with a blue sheen and passive, but hint stiger will be better to build frist cuz it gives u more as and cdr. Again yes tiger is dead but i think this will be good not to mention that now that 15ms that would come from passive is now just on us.

A treespook nest1 votes

Honestly I think that this might be good for Udyr in terms of build diversity. I agree that removing the overlap burst from his Q is a bad idea though. Having a slight AP ratio, massively reduced from previous versions, on his R with the AD ratio and raising the AP ratio on his W would be the best for him. It would mean that rageblade hybrid builds would be very viable.

More from Gameplay

3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay764 comments
7,167
votes
3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay156 comments
3,510
votes
UPVOTE FOR URF
Gameplay606 comments
2,440
votes
Yes plz.
Gameplay456 comments
1,721
votes
3 Refunds per season, up vote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay114 comments
1,716
votes
When is ANYONE at riot going to address the awful new player experience?
Gameplay634 comments
1,383
votes

More by NA Darklarik

For the new BloodRazor enchantment, can we keep the wolf?
Story, Art, & Sound82 comments
223
votes
An age where a full AD team has nothing to fear from a team building Armor on everyone
Gameplay210 comments
156
votes
Duskblade is literally causing the same problems Deathfire's grasp did, yet it still exists.
Gameplay120 comments
114
votes
The lack of communication with Riot is a major part of the reason why the community is so toxic
Player Behavior21 comments
77
votes
Are you just looking to make Targon as unsympathetically hated as possible? The True Antagonists...
Story, Art, & Sound138 comments
64
votes
Why is no one mentioning Tryndamere and Yasuo with the new IE changes.
Gameplay65 comments
54
votes