Boards›Gameplay

Why play anything not AD?

Niyume··3 votes·367 views

  • Best sustain in the fucking game, making actual DRAIN TANKS look like troll picks.

  • Best damage in the game (Burst and DPS)

  • No counterplay.

  • Minimal effort / skill.

  • No downsides, weaknesses or risks.

  • Resourceless autos.

  • Better DR than tanks, since you can't reduce PD / DD's effects.

  • An item for every fucking situation you could get into, an answer for every fuck up.

  • No cooldowns.

  • ADCs have the highest effective range in the game.

  • So much armor pen that tanks are better off building glass cannon.

... Like, why the fuck would you ever play anything AP that isn't just for CC? You can't out-burst an AD champ, you can't build tank against them, you can't out-sustain them, you can't CC them if they buy a mercurial, you can't even kill them with an AP champ if they buy the Maw of Invincibility, you can't out-DPS them, you can't build tanky like they do and still expect to do damage (BC into full tank = assassin?)... there's just no point.

The only thing you can do is LITERALLY one shot them (which is next to impossible because of all their fucking shields and passive DR) or to CC lock them until they die, but that doesn't work if they have a team around.

So, your game is decided by who has more AD champs, and which bot lane gets more fed.

And yet, Riot acts as if AD is not an issue at all, and continues to buff it while nerfing AP / mages continually. The best part is that they only get away with it because the fucking gimme generation is too lazy to get say anything about it, or is unable to recognize it with their vast intelligence. I've watched lots of games die because of the same thing, and it's starting to look like I'm goinna watch another follow suit.

15 Comments

k wìx2 votes

{quoted}

  • Best sustain in the fucking game, making actual DRAIN TANKS look like troll picks.

  • Best damage in the game (Burst and DPS)

  • No counterplay.

  • Minimal effort / skill.

  • No downsides, weaknesses or risks.

  • Resourceless autos.

  • Better DR than tanks, since you can't reduce PD / DD's effects.

  • An item for every fucking situation you could get into, an answer for every fuck up.

  • No cooldowns.

  • ADCs have the highest effective range in the game.

  • So much armor pen that tanks are better off building glass cannon.

I mean, as a support main that plays heavy AP, I think a few of your points are a bit off, though I do think you summarize the problem pretty well with the current meta.

1.) Yea, anything sustain-related is basically a joke unless it involves lifesteal, healing, or shielding in a major way.

2.) Yep. They don't really have to spend as much time in the early game waiting to ramp up, so they really only feel weak in the very early game, and some ADCs don't even feel this way - Thinking of Jhin and Xayah.

3.) Now here is where we have a major disagreement, I think there is a TON of counterplay options to a LOT of ADC kits, even when they are fed/ahead or its endgame status. Stun them. 2v1 them. Surprise them. kite them into their own doom. Shut them down, essentially.

4.) As a platinum support main, I disagree entirely. You give me a new ADC and i will absolutely destroy them at every level of the game. I do it all the time. I think this is more of a specific kit-to-kit issue, rather than a overarching class or role issue.

5.) Playing an ADC is very risky. Period. Bad positioning will put you out of the game on farm, especially when your playing against skilled opponents.

6.) Yea. One of the cruxes of the problem is that once your auto attack deals 600+ damage, and heals you for 300+ and happens 3 times a second, we run into some fundamental balance issues. If the 'carry' role is going to be able to get this unstoppable, what price are they paying? not enough, in my book.

7.) Eh. Item-specific and something that 'adds to the problem' .. but doesnt really create the problem. If other things were addressed this would be less of an issue.

8.) This is more because of Support meta and itemization, if anything.

9.) This is pretty much point 6 all over again.

10.) No. They do absolutely do not. Xerath and Velkoz are the artillery kings of league.

11.) I'll actually concede this point, its extremely hard to build effectively against a completely fed and skilled marksman. (From a tank perspective!) You need to catch or control them early, or gg.

Kai Guy1 votes

@1. Riots not to fond of Tanks that can drain, they tend to make it bruisers and try to prevent it from having solid itemization as when we have excessive sustain we see the game become mindless splitpushe grinds.

@2. Mid lane occupies highest damage to champions. Pretty much the only ADC you will see across any elo in a top 10 list for damaage is koggles, Ezreal pops up in a few.

@10 Ziggs feels left out.

@op, your exaggerating enough that its detracting from your argument mate. The reason to play other champions is because you enjoy them and/or win games by playing them. damage is not the end all be all. Adcs are a core part of a balanced team comp, but the class is not broken to the point that the other roles don't matter. Compositions is the core in mobas.

dunder kill2 votes

Yeah man ADCs have zero counterplay lol. Obviously wow when you put it that way none at all

Niyume2 votes

They right click, you take damage. This damage is either enough to kill you, or it's not and you kill them. They're the definition of a statcheck.

No counterplay involved.

Lauchmelder1 votes

{quoted} ... Like, why the fuck would you ever play anything AP that isn't just for CC?

Because Azir right now is plain out broken for anyone that mained him before the mini rework.

Niyume1 votes

Outliers are just that. ^^

Kai Guy1 votes

Mid lane has more champions that out damage adcs.

Mizaya1 votes

U right man, I'm just here waiting for one of the teams left at worlds to pick up on this and abuse it to win worlds without losing another game, literally 3-0 every series because of how op this strat is. Shit, if only TSM knew about this, they'd have gotten out of groups.

BTW, if there's anything about the "gimme generation" as you say on here, it's not their laziness as much as they expect the game to be balanced to their preferences. Not that your post would have anything to do with that though :).

iLBGAMing1 votes

If only things were that simple, anything can delete an ADC still unless you got supports who heal you/shield you.

Niyume1 votes

No, not really. Ever played an AP assassin or a juggernaut? You can't even touch an ADC for how fast you die and how hard they draintank you.

FatedSaviour1 votes

a list of champs i can burst adc's with Chogath Kayn Nami (full ap)Gnar Ekko Blitzcrank Bard Annie Lux Katarina Veigar Zilean Yorick Vi Ryze i guess its impossible to burst them then i didnt even go into marksmans or most assasins

as for the fact of juggernaut or ap assasin Darius Diana Ekko (again)Sion

Executioner1 votes

I cant tell you how many fucking times I've been deleted by a AD Vi. Or in general deleted from the face of the planet. Even in this meta now I still get deleted.

FatedSaviour1 votes

not even full ad, just like tri, guinsoos and a dead mans

Executioner1 votes

You, know what grinds my gears? Someone that spews nothing but nonsense.

Best sustain? No, they dont have the best sustain. And actual drain tanks like AAtrox were bad before any of this shit happening. Enchanters have the best sustain, any support that can build ardent. Infinitely better than any adc in the sustain department.

Best damage in the game is about the only thing you got. Even though Burst and DPS are different from one another. People getting these two dumb ass things mixed up. Burst is something that basically goes 100-0. Many champions have this kind of thing set in. ADC however do not, they have DPS. People get these mixed up because they are killing them late game squishy within 3-6 hits. Depending on crits or procs off static shiv. Very few times have I actually killed another squishy within 3 auto attacks late game. They have to have next to no armor items, and no exhaust for this to even happen. Or I get a proc off my static shiv, or rapid fire, doesn't matter either is fine. Then I have to crit them 2 or 3 more times to kill them. Of course this is happening within late game around 2 or 3 seconds.

No counterplay? Please with this little sad argument, what does a ADC always want? Peel! They FUCKING LOVE PEEL! This meta basically makes them thrive because of Ardent and the supports basically getting all these great items for themselves. They actually feel like they are truly making a difference. Of course I dislike the ardent meta, gives me aids personally. Any kind of burst murders them. You cant walk into a fight like you own them every time anymore. This time it actually takes something called... Coordination! If the support dies before the adc, and you used minimal effort in killing them. Well killing the adc is just all that much easier.

I cant believe you would even mention minimal skill / effort. Honest to god this actually annoys me. ADC is all about the right click! However you fuck up one right click you not autoing, or kiting, your walking towards the enemy with one simple fuck up. Any time you are in a late game team fight, ADC feel like they are walking on a tight rope. One misplay and you're going straight to the grey screen.

No downsides or risk? Holy shit this is most made up thing I've ever seen in my life. The downside to going full glass cannon is your brittle. Any damage that hits you does 1/3+ easy. That only way to even negate any of that damage is from the enchanter class #ardent censer. They give you the life you want to do these risky plays or give you confidence to install fear into the enemy team.

Resource-less autos? This is about the only thing you can say besides Jhin and graves. Since they are basically the only ones who have reloads.

Better DR than tanks? But tanks are not "drain tanks" they are just tanks or all the other classes they fit. Also many adc dont build PD or DD at the same time. They really dont even build DD anymore. Only PD, even then is barely valid of a point anyways too.

If you going to say items, put them up so everyone knows WHICH items you are talking about. Also many ADC really buy if anything item 3046, item 3026, item 3139. I dont see really any ADC buy item 3072 anymore. Also item 3812 isn't good for many ADC and really good on like 3 ADC at best.

Cooldowns? What? You talking about the autos or the spells they have in the kite? Everyone has a cooldown, unless your talking about the autos again.

Artillery mages have the highest effective range.

So much armor pen? We only really have two armor pen items that we use. Lethality is only used on a select few champions. Also meant for mostly burst assassins. Very few adc build lethality at the moment. Also tanks are fine.

Niyume1 votes

{quoted}

You, know what grinds my gears? Someone that spews nothing but nonsense.

You know what grinds my gears? Delusional asshats who have their head so far up Riot's ass that they can't see reality and preach their fantasy world to everyone else.

Best sustain? No, they dont have the best sustain.

600-800 damage an auto, twice a second (or more). So 1200-1600 damage per second. That means up to 320 healing per second. No champion in the game heals that much.

Best damage in the game is about the only thing you got. [snip]

ADCs have this thing called Burst per Second. They 100-0 squishy champs instantaneously, and 100-0 tanks within 2 seconds. They burst harder and faster than actual burst mages and assassins.

No counterplay?

Right click > You take damage. There is nothing you can do to prevent that damage, you can not make them miss, they don't have to aim, they don't have a drawback, they just do damage. They're a statcheck.

... One misplay and you're going straight to the grey screen.

So... like LITERALLY EVERY CHAMP IN THE GAME? Wow.

Better DR than tanks? But tanks are not "drain tanks" they are just tanks or all the other classes they fit. Also many adc dont build PD or DD at the same time. They really dont even build DD anymore. Only PD, even then is barely valid of a point anyways too.

You can reduce the protection armor gives you to basically nothing. You cannot reduce the DR from PD / DD by any means.

If you going to say items, put them up so everyone knows WHICH items you are talking about.

Maw of Invincibility for an AP team so you can't fuck up, Mercurial if you get caught and CCd, GA if you fuck up and die (and it gives armor), lifesteal to make you a god, Frozen Mallet to kite easier / chase, DD / PD to take no damage whatsoever, Last Whisper to make tanks irrelevant, BORK to make tanks even more irrelevant, Executioner's Calling to make healing / sustain irrelevant (unless the target is an ADC, in which case it doesn't matter), BC to make tanks even more irrelevant, Essence Reaver to make sure you can spam all day without thinking and never run oom... AD champs have the ABSOLUTE highest item diversity, and can literally build to any situation with little to no drawbacks. Meanwhile, AP champs and tanks have very rigid builds and can't do much without gimping themselves.

Cooldowns? What? You talking about the autos or the spells they have in the kite? Everyone has a cooldown, unless your talking about the autos again.

Autos have no cooldown, and hit just as hard (if not harder) as any burst mage ability.

Artillery mages have the highest effective range.

Artillery mages have the highest POKE range. Effective range is full damage which, you guessed it, goes to ADCs.

So much armor pen? We only really have two armor pen items that we use. Lethality is only used on a select few champions. Also meant for mostly burst assassins. Very few adc build lethality at the moment. Also tanks are fine.

BC or Last Whisper means that tank will be taking damage as if they're full damage. Lethality is just even more bullshit on top of that.

More from Gameplay

3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay764 comments
7,167
votes
3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay156 comments
3,510
votes
UPVOTE FOR URF
Gameplay606 comments
2,440
votes
Yes plz.
Gameplay456 comments
1,721
votes
3 Refunds per season, up vote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay114 comments
1,716
votes
When is ANYONE at riot going to address the awful new player experience?
Gameplay634 comments
1,383
votes

More by Niyume

The guide on never losing to Zoe
Gameplay148 comments
39
votes
Hey Riot, can you just revert Poppy to where her rework put her?
Gameplay27 comments
13
votes
You know what bothers me most right now?
Gameplay17 comments
12
votes
So why do you make double standards for ADCs?
Gameplay24 comments
11
votes
So, I'm starting to burn out on League.
Gameplay24 comments
6
votes
So, um...
Gameplay4 comments
6
votes