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Ahri Changes. How Much Did It Hurt?

ravenswolfy·1/22/2015, 8:01:45 PM·3 votes·1,815 views

Please let me know if I got anything wrong here but....

Old Ahri

Orb of Deception Cost: 55/60/65/70/75 Mana Range: 880 Ahri sends out and pulls back her orb, dealing magic damage on the way out and true damage on the way back. Deals 40/65/90/115/140 (+35% Ability Power) magic damage on the way out, and 40/65/90/115/140 (+35% Ability Power) true damage on the way back.

Fox-Fire Cost: 50 Mana Range: 800 Ahri releases three fox-fires, that lock onto and attack nearby enemies. Releases three fox-fires that lock on to nearby enemies (prioritizes Champions) dealing 40/65/90/115/140 (+40% Ability Power) magic damage.Enemies hit with multiple fox-fires take 30% damage from each additional fox-fire beyond the first, for a maximum of 0 damage to a single enemy.

Charm Cost: 85 Mana Range: 975 Ahri blows a kiss that damages and charms an enemy it encounters, causing them to walk harmlessly towards her. Ahri deals additional damage to recently charmed enemies. Blows a kiss dealing 60/90/120/150/180 (+35% Ability Power) magic damage and charms an enemy causing them to walk harmlessly towards Ahri for 1/1.25/1.5/1.75/2 second(s).Enemies hit by Charm take 20% more magic damage from Ahri for 6 seconds. Orb of Deception's true damage is also increased by this effect.

Spirit Rush Cost: 100 Mana Range: 450 Ahri dashes forward and fires essence bolts, damaging 3 nearby enemies (prioritizes Champions). Spirit Rush can be cast up to three times before going on cooldown. Nimbly dashes forward firing 3 essence bolts at nearby enemies (prioritizes Champions) dealing 70/110/150 (+30% Ability Power) magic damage. Can be cast up to three times within 10 seconds before going on cooldown.

Full Combo Total vs Single 'Charmed' Target: 336 (+ 84% AP) + 269 (+ 76.8% AP) + 180 (+ 35% AP) + 540 (+ 108% AP)

@ 100 AP Total Damage = 1628.8

@ 200 AP Total Damage = 1869.6

New Ahri

Orb of Deception (no damage change) Gained Movement speed.

Fox-Fire 50/80/110/140/170 (+40% Ability Power) Max Dmg vs Single Target 80/128/176/224/340 (+64% Ability Power)

Charm 60/90/120/150/200 (+50% Ability Power) Lost 20% Damage boost.

Spirit Rush (no damage change)

Full Combo Total vs Single Target: 280 (+ 70% AP) + 340 (+64% AP) + 200 (+50% AP) + 450 (+ 90% AP)

@ 100 AP Total Damage = 1544

@ 200 AP Total Damage = 1818

So At 200 AP the damage difference is close but still lower than the old version. (Disregarding penetration and magic resists)

Thoughts?

18 Comments

Drunk Rummate1/22/2015, 8:08:41 PM2 votes

the damage is extremely close to the same if you don't count the 20% damage amp boost.

the 16% lost AP scaling in her W has been shifted to her E which is probably okay. in season 4 they gave her a 2.5% scaling boost on her Q which probably makes up for her ult being nerfed awhile back.

i disagree with the loss in her charm mechanic though. they seem to think trading 1 second of movement speed burst on her Q is worth that huge loss in damage. I personally preferred her assassin archetype and I think this game has enough kite mages in it already. She is well balanced as a champion with her current kit and there's really no reason for them to be doing this other than "lol we changed our minds."

straight4free1/31/2015, 4:05:21 AM2 votes

It didn't hurt her, it just changed her playstyle.

disregardable1/22/2015, 8:04:02 PM1 votes

Surprised it's so close, really.

Frost the Reaper1/22/2015, 8:04:57 PM1 votes

I can't recall Ahri's Charm ever increasing MD that charmed targets take... Maybe thats the buff they are giving her for removing DFG.... Maybe your thinking Charm and DFG, but since they are removing DFG......

DanofDemacia1/22/2015, 8:49:54 PM1 votes

You did something wrong idk what but you did This seems more like it. Found it on the wiki. Personally movement speed for 2 seconds isnt worth the 2 seconds of movement speed

ahri no charm hit now 954+224%

ahri no charm+dfg now 1144.8+268.8%

ahri charm now 1324.8+268.8%

ahri charm now+dfg 1589.76+322.56

ahri no charm pbe 1002+239%

ahri charm pbe 1202+239%

ahri now max damage - ahri pbe max damage 387.76+83.56% (this is the damage and ratio ahri would be losing)

Im sure the balance team has already done these numbers themselves and has choses to compensate us mostly with utility in the way of mobility attached with her q, any thoughts?

MasticatingGrill1/31/2015, 4:03:28 AM1 votes

{quoted} So At 200 AP the damage difference is close but still lower than the old version. (Disregarding penetration and magic resists)

Thoughts?

Your math is a war crime? Let's start with that.

The combo comparison assumes MAX on all skills? Seriously. We're looking for the just-past-six point where Ahri tries to break out of laning phase.

And this is not just about AP scaling or Charm buff, this also resonates with removal of DFG.

So if she broke out of laning phase with a kill, and could B for rushed DFG at say level 8 if not sooner....

Then we are talking about much lower ability ranks, probably about 150 AP, and only one rank in Spirit Rush. And now Ahri is either going to counter gank a 2v1 retaliation mid, delete top, or come gank bot while jg goes top.

DFG was 15% health, so 150-200 dmg base? Then you have one rank in Charm for the 20% bonus PLUS the 20% DFG bonus. You have six points to divide between Orb and Fox-Fire. One in Charm, one in Spirit Rush and let's go with 150 AP?

Now this is a very lazy calculation but please bear with me, I'm in a hurry:

150-200 base %health magic damage 199.5 magic damage + 171 true damage with three ranks in Q (yeah bad example but..) [90+52.5] x 1.4 + [90+52.5] x 1.2 336 magic damage if you somehow have three points in Fox-Fire at this point... [90+60] x 1.6 x 1.4 135 magic damage from Charm itself with one rank [60+52.5] x 1.2 483 magic damage from Spirit Rush with one rank [70+45] x 1.4 x 3

So... 1300+ magic damage plus 171 True damage? A full DFG combo plus 1-2 auto attacks would delete 1500 EHP which at that stage of play is...

...pretty much anyone in the game unless tank went bonus MR early. But even the tank would almost surely die from any further damage.

NO ONE cares about 1800 EHP of damage at level 18 with a measly 200 AP that late in the game. But 1500 EHP at level 8 is damned scary.

With the combined removal of DFG and the Charm buff to damage, she'd be hitting more in the range of 1000 EHP damage at even 200 AP.

And guess what, the new less murderous mid-snowballer ahri now gets speed buffs on Q for more kiting. A very VERY different feel.

Please add your opinion and corrections if you will.

EDIT: Ahri's higher bases are nice but, at a glance the increased AP ratio on Charm is a miserable dogbone for the poor fox. Riot was quite serious about trying to move away from a combo assassin and more into a kite mage with solid poke.