Weekly reminder that Kog's Ult 'buff' nerfed Marksmen Kog

Rebonack·Nov 27, 2016·2 votes·411 views

And buffed AP Kog.

It's time for another Kog revert, Riot. A strong execute and a weak poke is much more useful to Marksmen Kog than a flaccid execute and a slightly less flaccid poke.

18 Comments

ShinkoMinoriNov 27, 20162 votes

holy shit you are one of those who don't use flash.

RebonackNov 27, 20161 votes

{quoted}

holy shit you are one of those who don't use flash.

Flash is for cowards.

######And people who want to win...

dunder killNov 27, 20162 votes

ADC Kog can rot idc. AP Kog is much more fun

RebonackNov 27, 20161 votes

{quoted}

ADC Kog can rot idc. AP Kog is much more fun

While I don't disagree, Riot apparently thinks that AP Kog is 'the definition of unhealthy champion design' and will nerf the shit out of him whenever he's decent. See: incoming AP Kog nerfs on PBE.

CerealBoxOfDoomNov 27, 20161 votes

if its an ult buff it didn't nerf marksman kog

which one is it? Actually just link to the notes youre referring to, why don't people just do this

Watch people come and tell me how it only takes 3 seconds then try to explain why they didn't bother to spend 3 seconds linking this

NodirjonSattarovNov 27, 20161 votes

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/news/game-updates/patch/patch-621-notes#patch-kogmaw

They added 30 magic damage to base damage and removed the execute amplifications between 25%-50% health and instead made the margins above and below 40%. So now when you're above 40% you do 150% damage + base damage. Look at how much of an execute the pre-change to the Ult was. 300% is definitely an execute, 200% is not.

CerealBoxOfDoomNov 27, 20161 votes

COST : 50 mana + 50 per cast (500 mana maximum) ⇒ 40 mana + 40 per cast (400 mana maximum)

DAMAGE: 70/110/150 ⇒ 100/140/180

MANA DEBUFF DURATION : 10 seconds ⇒ 8 seconds

EXECUTION THRESHOLD 1 : Deals 200% damage to targets between 25% and 50% health ⇒ Deals up to 150% damage to targets approaching 40% health

EXECUTION THRESHOLD 2 : Deals 300% damage to targets with less than 25% health ⇒ Deals 200% damage to targets with less than 40% health

[REDACTED]

See this is why you ask for and/or post your links

this is not a nerf to AD kog.

NodirjonSattarovNov 27, 20161 votes

Perhaps it wasn't a nerf but wasn't a buff either. They simply shifted numbers, favoring base damage (up by 30) and reducing the execute ratio by 1.

My favorite thing about the Boards is when people like you comment on champions you haven't played before. As much as it look like a clean buff on paper, it isn't in practice. And the fewer people that experience the severity on this change, the less likely it will get looked at. "Kog'Maw just has a high skill cap" Yeah, yeah whatever I've heard that way too many times. I also play AP Kog which is entirely skillshot oriented and I do just fine.

CerealBoxOfDoomNov 27, 20161 votes

xD they sensor unsavory brandnames now

So I guess you spent a long time going through several years of my gameplay to make sure I've never played kog or something?

Not that you need any experience at all to argue that more base damage, 20% lower reduction, and a shorter time between sets of volleys at elevated costs is a buff. you literally don't even have to know a damn thing about kog to say that this is a buff. Whether or not this is a good buff is always up for debate but it is a buff and one that can heavily impact how this champion is played. The lack of execute power just means he'll have to pay, urf forbid, more like he did back when he was going nearly undefeated in world's tournaments.

partial reversions to what he used to be is still a buff even if its a nerf in respect to some long past state where he was kindof strong as shit anyways.

People are so fixated on his execute when executing isn't even his job traditionally.

RebonackNov 27, 20161 votes

{quoted} See this is why you ask for and/or post your links

this is not a nerf to AD kog.

Nah, it was a nerf. While it did improve Marksmen Kog's poke potential slightly (it's still awful compared to where it was before the rounds of nerfing that put him where he is now) it was a drastic nerf to his ability to finish off fleeing foes. I've got at least three instances every single game where the old Ult would have scored me a kill and instead someone prances off to safety.

If Riot was looking to buff Marksmen Kog they could have just given his Ult smooth damage scaling as the enemy has lower health, capping at x3 damage once it reaches 25% remaining.

CerealBoxOfDoomNov 27, 20161 votes

finishing off fleeing foes is not the job of the adc

riot gave him better "I didn't get fed and people are about to try and shit on me" scaling.

RebonackNov 27, 20161 votes

{quoted}

finishing off fleeing foes is not the job of the adc

riot gave him better "I didn't get fed and people are about to try and shit on me" scaling.

Finishing off fleeing foes has always been one of Kog's jobs.

CerealBoxOfDoomNov 27, 20161 votes

not at all. It is not the job of the artillery to pick off fleeing foes. If they are fleeing he has already succeeded in controlling a space, it is absolutely not kogs job to be trying to pick people off. His job is to set them up to be picked off in the first place.

RebonackNov 27, 20161 votes

{quoted}

not at all. It is not the job of the artillery to pick off fleeing foes. If they are fleeing he has already succeeded in controlling a space, it is absolutely not kogs job to be trying to pick people off. His job is to set them up to be picked off in the first place.

Can you read the name on Kog's Ult for me, please?

That would be great.

CerealBoxOfDoomNov 27, 20161 votes

why? you seem to know what it's called already. Just get to the point.

Like I said its not the job of the artillery to pick off fleeing foes. His ult is called living artillery. Kog wins by controlling territory from long ranges not chasing down and picking off opponents.

RebonackNov 27, 20162 votes

{quoted}

why? you seem to know what it's called already. Just get to the point.

Like I said its not the job of the artillery to pick off fleeing foes. His ult is called living artillery. Kog wins by controlling territory from long ranges not chasing down and picking off opponents.

Exactly. He doesn't chase down and pick off opponents. He nails them once, maybe twice, with his Ult once they disengage from them to polish them off. That's the whole design behind his new Ult.

This is like arguing that Jinx' Ult isn't for finishing off fleeing foes. That is exactly what it's for.

CerealBoxOfDoomNov 28, 20161 votes

Jinx ult is not for the same thing as kog's. It is absolutely nothing like arguing that jinx's single shot global range burst damage rocket is an execute. Jinx's rocket is and is meant to be an execute. Kog's is an artillery skill, a sustained artillery skill that may possibly kill something but really isn't designed to pick people off or it wouldn't be a broadcasted attack with a massive delay and not amazing radius. Kog is an artillery champ. Jinx is not an artillery champ.

kog is kog, jinx is jinx

a better example might be xerath or jhin but even these aren't used specifically for this unless teams want to lose. They start nailing people with abilities before the fight can even start which effectively counters your items and base stats before you can even go in.

Sightless66Nov 27, 20161 votes

It actually was a small nerf to ad kog. His winrate decreased slightly on the patch this came about, and there is nothing else in the data to explain it (like a suddenly increased playrate, or nerfs to his items). Kind of hard to justify an argument saying it was a buff when it had, at best, a small detrimental effect on his winrate.

The reasoning if why it would be a nerf makes sense too. Even after the change, it still does jackshit nothing when ad kog tries to poke with his ult. The difference between terrible damage and slightly less terrible damage rarely matters. However, it did significantly lower his ability to finish off anyone he was dueling, attacking or running away from, which gives them a greater chance to finish him off. I have definitely died more than once because I lacked that last bit of damage to finish off a diving Renekton or Talon.

It wasn't a very important nerf, given that he was already atrociously bad and that it wasn't a very large nerf, but it certainly didn't improve things.