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After playing as/with Neeko on PBE for a while, here are my thoughts.

Bârd··61 votes·18,131 views

Passive

For a moment, I'm just going to set aside the fact that calling this ability a passive is really stretching the definition of a passive. Over all, it's a really cool ability and it's damn near perfect as far as I'm concerned. There are only three things I'd like to see changed about this spell.

  • In the tab menu, enemies shouldn't see Neeko's icon change when she's glamoured in vision. It just gives away who she's playing as and it feels kinda cheap.
  • In chat, Neeko's champion name shouldn't change to the champion she's glamoured as. From allied POV it should be the champions name with an asterisk. From an enemy POV in all chat it should still just say Neeko. It can confuse allies who have summoner names turned off and it can give you away to the enemy.
  • If Neeko is glamoured as a champion with a visually obvious passive, she should appear to do that. If she's copying Yi, she should get a double strike (that does no damage). If she's copying Twitch, she should get poison (that does no damage and doesn't interact with the real Twitch).

In general the spell is cool, but they need to patch out a couple of the ways to see through it.

Q

A bit bland and does a little bit too much damage for too little effort. Seeing as it's really easy to land the first hit, it doesn't seem all that fair to have the first hit deal the brunt of the damage. I think the spell would be healthier if its damage was backloaded, having the first and second blooms deal the reduced damage while the third one deals full damage. That way it's less effective as noncommital poke/waveclear, but it's still a strong spell if you can land your E or R to guarantee the third bloom.

W

I really underestimated the active, but holy shit it's confusing to play against. I love it. Don't touch the active's functionality (maybe add a mana cost if she needs general nerfs, but yeah you did good Riot).

The passive is cool, and I love playing on hit Neeko, but it should not deal damage to towers.

E

Honestly, not a fan.

A 3 second root that goes through minions is never going to feel good to play against. Sure it's not as strong in skirmishes and teamfights but it's so annoying in lane that I honestly just don't care.

R

A lot of things about this spell feel weird.

  • Standing still during the jump feels clunky.
  • The shield being delayed is odd, but I can deal with it.
  • A self-centered wombo ult on a champion with no real mobility can be difficult to get off without burning flash.

...but at the same time, I feel like those downsides are necessary for a spell that slows/stuns in a massive AOE and deals 650 (+1.3 AP) damage. Pairing this ult with Kalista is one of the most brutal things you can do. Honorable mentions to Thresh, Bard, and Zilean.

If it were up to me, I'd probably take off some of the spell's raw damage and its slow in exchange for allowing her to move during the hop.

39 Comments

AquariusGine34 votes

I disagree about the ult standing still part.

Ult + W is deadly, and having Neeko stand still at the end of the cast is fairer for the opponent, otherwise it would be almost impossible to escape the AoE stun and damage.

Shield delay is weird though

Bârd3 votes

Oh yeah in its current state being able to move during your ult detonation would definitely be overpowered.

I'm just saying it'd probably feel better to use if you could do that, even if they nerfed it to compensate.

ModCaptainMårvelous33 votes

I actually like Riot moving "passives" to being a fifth active, provided it fits.

It frees up a lot more design space for things and allows you to do more with a kit without forcing your champ to have a "skill" that's an innate ability. Definitely don't want it being the norm though. just when it fits.

Nevrankroaton3 votes

To kinda go toward what you just say, for the ones playing heroes of the storm, it is very common that a hero passive is actually a 5th spell.

The question is when is it a kinda "gimmick" spell and when is it a core aspect of it. I feel Neeko is a good exemple of a "core aspect" without making it too bonkers.

SpaghettiVase1 votes

{quoted}

I actually like Riot moving "passives" to being a fifth active, provided it fits.

It frees up a lot more design space for things and allows you to do more with a kit without forcing your champ to have a "skill" that's an innate ability. Definitely don't want it being the norm though. just when it fits.

Have to agree, there's a lot of old champions who's passives are literally just stat boosters (Mundo, Jax, Vlad, etc.) There's nothing you can do about them and there's nothing interesting about them.

Ifneth16 votes

I like the change you propose to Q and R. The third bloom should deal the most damage, and she should be shielded and mobile during the ult.

Eleshakai10 votes

As far as the E goes, remember that in order for it to have the full duration it HAS to go through at least 2 minions. Similar to how you don't stand behind your creeps when fighting Lissandra, this may need to be a case where the enemy has to adapt and gets punished if they don't.

NineTailedMystic1 votes

But it's not like Liss where her Q will go through the whole wave, it's tedious to makes sure you're standing behind at least 3 minions and makes you feel like you're never really safe.

SeaChange3 votes

... The E passes through any amount of minions. It's not the third enemy that gets the extra root, it's the last champ hit... just... uh read the ability. So, similarly to liss, you'd need to keep minions from being between you and the enemy neeko.

NineTailedMystic1 votes

Neeko slings a magical spiral in a direction, damaging and briefly rooting enemies it passes through. The last champion hit is rooted longer.

If Tangle-Barbs hits at least two enemies, it grows in size, speed, and root duration.

It's both, I'm pretty sure. Still cancer either way.

ÈvilMorty5 votes

The ult needs a damage nerf 1.3X ap? plus big base dmg? no no fucking no

5050BS3 votes

Im with you 100% here.

Her E is Zyra E just better

Her Ult I find I cant activate and flash. She needs to keep moving in the jump.

Bârd1 votes

You can flash+R, but you have to flash before the jump.

You're locked out of everything at that moment.

usul12023 votes

This is how the gameplay boards should look. Constructive feedback that points out the good and the bad, which is far too rare. Thanks op, as someone without a pbe account I've been unsure if she's actually op or not, so this was a good read.

Gilgayu2 votes

{quoted}

This is how the gameplay boards should look. Constructive feedback that points out the good and the bad, which is far too rare. Thanks op, as someone without a pbe account I've been unsure if she's actually op or not, so this was a good read.

shes pretty strong, will probably receive a small nerf the patch right after she comes out. like an usual new champion xD

Nausicäa 2 votes

You played Neeko for a while and didnt bother to properly read her E? Its only a 3 second root if it hits more than one unit. So no, its not a 3 second root in lane. Gj trying to spread false information tho.

Weiner the Pooh9 votes

Does it not affect minions? Because I'm pretty sure minions count as units, there by giving the extended duration.

Bârd9 votes

Minions work. This guy doesn't know what he's talking about.

Bârd8 votes

Come on. This is something you'd figure out after 3 minutes in the practice tool.

All you have to do is throw the E through a creep wave and hit your lane opponent.

Not only is it easy to get the empowered root in lane, that's the only time you can reliably get the root because, without creep waves being involved, it's somewhat uncommon for 3 or more champions to stand in a straight line.

I'd know, I'm a Bard main; I pay attention to when people are standing in line.

Naalith4 votes

Irony.

Beacon Academy4 votes

The irony.

Velasan1 votes

So, when playing against her how hard is it to tell which one is real?

I can imagine this champion being a nightmare just because you don't want to waste CC on a fake.

AquariusGine2 votes

[deleted]

5050BS1 votes

You can still juke people. You can also Run out of vision (bushes, a corner) and send the clone back the way you came.

Also it can be used to cancel targeted attacks as its a 50/50 they click the clone when you reappear.

Bârd1 votes

Lets just say it's a little disorienting.

Fun for Bard, though, since you can stun her against her clone if you hit them both while they're invisible.

mack91121 votes

{quoted}

So, when playing against her how hard is it to tell which one is real?

I can imagine this champion being a nightmare just because you don't want to waste CC on a fake.

Any damage will break the minick.

The Trent1 votes

Seems like she could be a decent support if her root is really as oppressive as you say it is in laning phase. Kalista Neeko would be a pretty amazing combo. A lot of Kalista's best duos are melee, which makes utilizing her w passive kinda hard. That passive does a ton of dmg btw. Not to mention she could throw Neeko for ult and Neeko could literally just block things like thresh hook, blitz hook, pyke hook etc with her w resulting in extremely easy trades. She actually seems like a really good support for a lot of annoying match ups. Seems like something people will try out. Neeko as an adc and thresh as support could be cool too, Lantern for the ult and tons of cc for her q to get all 3 off. Excited for neeko tbh.

Gilgayu1 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Trent,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jKLAeAYk,comment-id=0007,timestamp=2018-11-21T21:37:58.571+0000)

Seems like she could be a decent support if her root is really as oppressive as you say it is in laning phase. Kalista Neeko would be a pretty amazing combo. A lot of Kalista's best duos are melee, which makes utilizing her w passive kinda hard. That passive does a ton of dmg btw. Not to mention she could throw Neeko for ult and Neeko could literally just block things like thresh hook, blitz hook, pyke hook etc with her w resulting in extremely easy trades. She actually seems like a really good support for a lot of annoying match ups. Seems like something people will try out. Neeko as an adc and thresh as support could be cool too, Lantern for the ult and tons of cc for her q to get all 3 off. Excited for neeko tbh.

im seeing neeko more like a mid laner that roams as frequent as sol because of her easy-to-land cc and passive. It has been really hard to tell which lane new champions belong to lately, and I think that is a good sign for lane-fluency (remember when people thought zoe should go jungle?)

Bârd1 votes

I've mostly just been building rageblade.

Gilgayu1 votes

{quoted}

I've mostly just been building rageblade.

rageblade got hard nerffed though, rip

Preusedsoap1 votes

{quoted}

im seeing neeko more like a mid laner that roams as frequent as sol because of her easy-to-land cc and passive. It has been really hard to tell which lane new champions belong to lately, and I think that is a good sign for lane-fluency (remember when people thought zoe should go jungle?)

tbh im glad zoe jungle doesnt work, if it did shed be one of the most oppressive junglers in the game

SeaChange1 votes

Her kit is easy as is. As smooth as free ulti movement would be, I think we can get used to it, and in turn utilize the damage that comes from these downsides.

ShadowGlaive2131 votes

I think the multi-target root lasting 3s is a bit much even if you need it to pass through 2 units first. Lux and Zyra roots, for example, only last 2s. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, the only other champ that I'm aware of that has a 3s root is Morg which I thought was justified because it's single target, slow moving, and can get shot blocked by just about everything.

Gilgayu1 votes

{quoted}

I think the multi-target root lasting 3s is a bit much even if you need it to pass through 2 units first. Lux and Zyra roots, for example, only last 2s. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, the only other champ that I'm aware of that has a 3s root is Morg which I thought was justified because it's single target, slow moving, and can get shot blocked by just about everything.

I guess Riot want to make sure she can land all 3 stages q's when she lands her e.... but it turns her into a teamfight monster.

SpecterVonBaren1 votes

The ult seems kinda.... bland? I dunno, we already have some champs with similar mechanics to this, I just kinda wish it was a little more interesting than "slightly different Nunu/Lissandra ult". And I know there are differences but it just feels like they could have given her a more interesting ult than this given her ability to transform.

Stupafly1 votes

Doesn't her e duration scale with level? Its only - maybe the back end of lane you have to deal with the 3 sec snare

Edit:I assume q max will be the norm

Modl Ryden l1 votes

Lol after seeing the trailer, if you just avoid bushes knowing that the enemy team has a Neeko, you ultimate avoid her ganks.

Seriously, if you see your enemy laner casually walk into bush and back. It's highly likely that it's a Neeko getting ready to bamboozle you. Honestly never worth taking the risk to facecheck, which is a good rule of thumb since like ever.

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