Who has .2 seconds reaction time.

Its All Skillzz··90 votes·19,506 views

Thats how much time you have to live before Rengar Removes you from the game with undodgable point an click ability.

135 Comments

UnboundHades26 votes

kinda happy hot is removed so these kinds of shitposts will die off

Faulty AimBot32 votes

True, but still, the OP has a point. You literally can't react to him and Riot really needs to address this kind of stuff.

Marshbouy6 votes

No, he really doesn't. There is plenty of warning given before rengar jumps on you if he's ulting. I think he should get a pyke-like indicator if he's coming from a bush though.

Its All Skillzz23 votes

{quoted}

No, he really doesn't. There is plenty of warning given before rengar jumps on you if he's ulting. I think he should get a pyke-like indicator if he's coming from a bush though.

Yea its nice to know when im about to instantly die, so i can prepare to look at the shop an get a free ride back to the base.

Its All Skillzz9 votes

{quoted}

>shitpost https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yW_st2H2Y2Y

yea, who thought a champion like this would be healthy, idc if he can be shut down, avoided if you are a squishy champion and he chooses you, then you are going to spend all game dead and its not fun or healthy, which is why assassin in general need to be deleted out of league as they ruin the fun aspect of the game and they are legit feast or useless, they are not fun for the person playing agaisnt them and they are only fun for the assassin player themself, the class in whole does not belong in a team based strategy game.

OlympicStalker9 votes

-old video -old rengar -0 armor fed rengar -yes this is a shitpost

Salron9 votes

https://youtu.be/Q4UfNgcGU1I?t=148 and 5:14 7:19 7:50 10:40 Whenever I watch a stream with a Rengar in it, usually he'll be doing this too so I don't see how it being old Rengar is relevant when hes designed to 1shot out of stealth in every single iteration he's been through

Its All Skillzz8 votes

{quoted}

https://youtu.be/Q4UfNgcGU1I?t=148 and 5:14 7:19 7:50 10:40 Whenever I watch a stream with a Rengar in it, usually he'll be doing this too so I don't see how it being old Rengar is relevant when hes designed to 1shot out of stealth in every single iteration he's been through

"ya but hes balanced and trash lol" i feel everyone who plays this game is just assassin mains, they just out to 1 shot everyone and never be a team player, going for kda or feeding a bunch of shut downs. its sad state that because of assassins we had to start giving damage items defensive, like phantom dancer the new ga.

Salron6 votes

This board hates assassins which makes it really weird when I see the majority of people come out and defend Rengar Maybe r/Rengarmains never left after they originally votebrigaded some threads

Nuparu3 votes

To be fair, he's been reworked and reverted with various changes to make him less frustrating (namely a significantly better indicator and they stopped him from straight up oneshotting late game with crit if the players on the other end are willing to buy some armor.)

He's still an assassin in essence, if he's ahead he's supposed to kill you if he gets on you. It's the exact same thing as mages deleting squishies near them, except it usually requires you to be fed versus just naturally scaling to be like that.

Edit: And the video above, the very first clip it hotlinked involved a 14 kill Rengar. Any assassin/mage could have done that. Syndra could probably carry an orb and flash R and he still would have died. etc etc

Ephixus1 votes

{quoted}

To be fair, he's been reworked and reverted with various changes to make him less frustrating (namely a significantly better indicator and they stopped him from straight up oneshotting late game with crit if the players on the other end are willing to buy some armor.)

He's still an assassin in essence, if he's ahead he's supposed to kill you if he gets on you. It's the exact same thing as mages deleting squishies near them, except it usually requires you to be fed versus just naturally scaling to be like that.

Edit: And the video above, the very first clip it hotlinked involved a 14 kill Rengar. Any assassin/mage could have done that. Syndra could probably carry an orb and flash R and he still would have died. etc etc

There is a difference between mages and assassins, mages has to land their stuff and Rengar? Just points click out of stealth to one shot.

Your argument is invalid.

Nuparu1 votes

And Mages have sustained damage, Rengar barely survives if he kills one person unless he's omega fed.

Also, most mages have near-guaranteed ways to land their stuff. It's not that hard.

You saying my argument is invalid doesn't actually make it invalid.

Eedat25 votes

Who has .2 seconds reaction time.

Average human reaction time is actually right around there. A quarter second I think?

GreenKnight16 votes

{quoted}

Average human reaction time is actually right around there.

Lag from both sides, server lag... it all actually adds up.

Quepha10 votes

.2 seconds is just below average, but if you factor in 50ms of lag it's completely impossible for humans.

Its All Skillzz3 votes

{quoted}

.2 seconds is just below average, but if you factor in 50ms of lag it's completely impossible for humans.

Rengar leaped on me, i died in .28 seconds. like seems like you need to be faker lvl of reaction time to counterplay this.

LegacyDAP3 votes

wtf .26 is like the average. .2 is literally top 10%

source: https://www.humanbenchmark.com/tests/reactiontime/statistics

Quepha1 votes

0.2s is literally below the average time, but I probably should have said better or faster than average.

Terozu3 votes

It's above average. Just because the number is lower doesn't make it have a lesser value.

Actual value here is inversely proportional to numerical value.

Like golf.

Vreivai15 votes

Yeah, about .25 seconds. Add in a latency of 50 ms and about another quarter second to actually perform an action in response, and you've got .55 seconds between seeing something and performing an action in response to it.

Now, obviously the elite players are going to have much shorter reaction times and perform that action faster, but for the average person this will be accurate.

PopcornBunni7 votes

Average single-input reaction time is 0.28. Reaction time with even just two different options to react with is about 0.5 for average, down to 0.33 with training. The more options you have to chose between the slower it gets. Assuming the options for dealing with a rengar jump are: Flash away, Flash orthagonally, flash towards, Zonyas, and aimed or targeted CC spell, that's about 5 options that are sometimes the right choice and sometimes not, some of which themselves have lengthy windups before they come out depending on the champion. And of course in anything but lagless LAN environments, the ping will lower the available reaction time anywhere from 0.04 to 0.16 s. Good luck reacting to a tenth of a second stimulus.

There's a reason overhead mixups in fighting games rarely drop below 20 frames of windup even when there's only two input options.

rtbf22561824117 votes

{quoted}

Average human reaction time is actually right around there. A quarter second I think?

That is not average. That's an experienced gamer's reaction time.

I mean in terms of being able to respond in a controlled manner, instead of just spazzing out like a startled monkey and pressing random buttons.

Terozu4 votes

According to the survey done at my school where we had to react to a color change on a screen by hitting two buttons in order depending on whether it turned blue or green, (I will admit this was only a study of 25 students) we ranged from .19 to .4 seconds.

Also since Rengar also has a sound effect and the average reaction time to sound is .17 seconds, you have some time albeit a little.

And assuming he's talking about rengars jump I've reacted to it fast enough to flash or dash away plenty of times.

rtbf2256182414 votes

{quoted}

According to the survey done at my school where we had to react to a color change on a screen by hitting two buttons in order depending on whether it turned blue or green, (I will admit this was only a study of 25 students) we ranged from .19 to .4 seconds.

Also since Rengar also has a sound effect and the average reaction time to sound is .17 seconds, you have some time albeit a little.

And assuming he's talking about rengars jump I've reacted to it fast enough to flash or dash away plenty of times.

Memorizing colours flickering is much easier than handling ~10 things as they simultaneously happen within the game's systems as they all interact with each other (orbwalking, animation cancelling, ability peculiarities, items, damage numbers). I've had Rengar jump out of nowhere without any warning. He has a passive you know and sometimes the ultimate won't warn you if it bugs out.

Terozu2 votes

I've never had his warning bug out.

As for his passive, you should never be near enough to an unwarded bush for him to use it. If you are, you deserve to take the hit, the same way you deserve to take Kat's damage if you're sitting on her daggers.

rtbf2256182411 votes

{quoted}

I've never had his warning bug out.

As for his passive, you should never be near enough to an unwarded bush for him to use it. If you are, you deserve to take the hit, the same way you deserve to take Kat's damage if you're sitting on her daggers.

"Ok, i'll never, EVER go near any bushes in my life again just because there is a Rengar in the game."

Do you see how ridiculous that statement is? Kat's daggers are highly telegraphed, Rengar's random jumpscare attacks are not. Period.

Terozu2 votes

keep your brush warded, if you have reason to believe he's nearby stay away.

If you get jumped on it's because you weren't warding and were mispositioned. You messed up.

rtbf2256182411 votes

{quoted}

keep your brush warded, if you have reason to believe he's nearby stay away.

If you get jumped on it's because you weren't warding and were mispositioned. You messed up.

I do not stare at my map every 2 seconds like they do in the LCS. I rarely play this game nowadays, and if i see a proficient Rengar without knowing he is proficient at playing Rengar then i will obviously be deleted with little to no warning at all.

Misplay? Sure. Fair? No. What you are saying is that Rengar is free-elo up to Platinum with an uneven counter-trade, given all he has to do is mash 2 buttons while i have to burn 5 abilities most likely together with a summoner spell or two, if he is strong enough to one-shot.

That is not fair. His passive range shouldn't be an automatic killzone.

Critmaster Garen1 votes

{quoted}

Average human reaction time is actually right around there. A quarter second I think?

only when youre highly trained at that particular reaction. you already have to have the movement in your muscle memory.

Tuition Fee10 votes

Idk why people still complaining about assassins. Just build GA so you get to live for an additional 0.1 second.

IainG102 votes

Plus the 5s of limbo

Pals Before Gals8 votes

I use my fortune telling skills to deduce that this fiery-headed post stems from a previous game against a fed Rengar

FOR JUSTICE5 votes

but see, have you ever played a squishy with Khazix in game?

Zerenza5 votes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QzIuZudzESo

Visual Reaction Time and Auditory Reaction Time are different from eachother.

In this video there's a tiny test for your reaction time inside of it, here's what i got.

.185 MS Visual and .083 Auditory.

In league of legends there's a large number of sounds you can listen to that would help you react to a multitude of things; for example, rengar's Roar when he leaps at you, comes out at the beginning of his jump almost the exact millisecond that he reveals himself. I'v gotten pretty dang good at flashing that shit, or landing a skillshot before he even finishes the jump because all i have to do is press 1 button right after i hear that roar.

There's more examples but i feel like Rengar's is the most helpful.

I should add that my ping is 63 usually, so we have to add 63 to 185 so 248 with visual and .146 with auditory. My mouse and keyboard have almost no delay so i'm gonna go with it's negligible but i think i have plenty of time between rengar's jump and the damage portion of the jump in order to prevent myself from getting popped, assuming i have the tools necessary to do so.

EyesOfTheFox2 votes

Because.... SCIENCE!

LankPants1 votes

Nice theory, but Rengar doesn't give auditory warning of which direction he's coming from. There's no way to use the audio queue to align your mouse over him in order to react to him at all. The roar is only useful for allerting you to him, in order to actually react properly to him in any way other than a pre-mediated flash in a random direction, IE to do something like Condemn him as Vayne you actually need to wait the full visual reaction time.

Also worth noting, .185 is a very quick visual reaction time, the last time I took one of those tests I was at about .2 and I'm still well above average. The average reaction time is .28, add your 63 ping to that and you're looking at .34 seconds before you can make a meaningful reaction to Rengar. The issue is he can be on top of you in less time than that and burst you in fractionally more time.

Zerenza1 votes

He reveals himself the second he roar's, i can understand having to target him, as with vayne condemn but i don't play champions that have targeted abilities so i usually just point my mouse and click a button. Though i will add that you can kind of deduce what direction he's in because of the fact his R puts a marker on the nearest enemy and it does have a limited range, i think that's pretty helpful to prepare for him jumping on you since if your prepared for it you can react a lot faster.

Also i should add that Rengar's jump takes .5 seconds to complete, during which he is completely unable to perform any action(except prep his Q) so even though the burst itself will come out in .2 seconds(give or take based on how fed he is or isn't.) and i think that .7-1 seconds is pretty okay since you probably also have about 2 seconds to prepare for it before hand when his R gives you that mark on your head.

LankPants2 votes

He reveals himself when he roars, which tells you that he's there, not where he's coming from. You can't target anything based on auditory information unless the only thing that matters is the timing. So you can use the roar to queue up something like a flash or Ezreal's E, but not something like an Ashe arrow, Zyra snare, Condemn or Cocoon.

As for ascertaining his general direction and using that, there's niche cases where it's useful. If you have a spell with a wide arc which covers a fairly large area to ensure you can hit the general direction can be good enough, but these spells are typically fairly rare in the first place. The few I can think of not tied to ultimates on someone Rengar is likely to target are Syndra's E, which often isn't going to be used to knock back without a stun anyway, it's really a last resort to do that and Annie's W, which is a conditional stun. Generally speaking reacting with anything other than a mobility spell via sound alone isn't an option.

and i think that .7-1 seconds is pretty okay since you probably also have about 2 seconds to prepare for it before hand when his R gives you that mark on your head.

That literally only matters if you're casting a mobility spell, if you're not then you still have to find and target Rengar in all but niche cases.

Also i should add that Rengar's jump takes .5 seconds to complete

.5 is still just above human reaction time. That means if you don't react instantly Rengar kills you. It's also worth noting that by flashing before his jump he can actually make it unreactable. I think a majority of players would agree that this isn't OK. The punishment for reacting 0.2 seconds too slowly shouldn't be instant death. This is why Rengar is so overwhelmingly hated by pretty much everyone who doesn't play him and why he's honestly one of if not the worst designs in the game.

Saianna3 votes

I only wonder why even best timed flash doesn't help me. Like, the very second cat jumps, is still far away from me, I flash but even then I get full damage both from his jump AND his Q, even though he's not in melee range anymore. Like.. How the F am I supposed to defend against it? I'm pretty good at flash-dodging "big things" such as malphite R, or anything of such.

But cats R is simply death sentence. There's Nothing I can do except zhyona, but that doesn't help me much cause cat already waits with his Q to shred my face.

Wild Geese3 votes

The average human reaction time is actually about 2.8.. maybe we'll say 2.5 since most league players are young and play videogames...

So we start with 250ms Add 30ms for lag Then we add 10ms for the average monitor. (input delay, not pixel response time). There's at least 10 ms for the delay of your psychical inputs, no matter how hard you try or what you buy.

Altogether, on average the reaction speed is 300 ms, nothing that is meant to be avoidable should be faster than that.

PopcornBunni2 votes

Except there are 1000 miliseconds per second, not 100.

So 0.28, not 2.8

But that's still being extremely generous since the 0.28 time is for simple reaction test timing on subjects who are already prepared to react to a single specific thing with a single specific response. With even just 2 different stimuli and a different appropriate response to each, the reaction time slows to between 0.3 and 0.45 before accounting for lag. That is also not accounting for the literal hundreds of different stimuli to react to accordingly in the game nor the fact that in cases like this there isn't an anticipatory response being tested as in the non-blinded studies. Without anticipation, the immediate reaction time speeds up (think jump scares) but the response time slows even further.

200220123 votes

To answer your question: more than half the human population.

Poske3 votes

[{quoted}](name=Its All Skillzz,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=gLJ8tAhG,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-02-26T02:21:51.097+0000)

Thats how much time you have to live before Rengar Removes you from the game with undodgable point an click ability.

Kinda concerned people think he cannot burst faster than 0.2 seconds

There are videos on youtube where he does it LITERALY in 0.01 seconds https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yW_st2H2Y2Y

14daysuspensionk1 votes

I've seen a Karthus in the middle of how entire team just Zhonya right before I pounce, as if he knew I was ulting for him.

Terozu1 votes

you know your target gets an indicator right?

14daysuspensionk1 votes

{quoted}

you know your target gets an indicator right?

Yeah but he was surrounded by his team, you do realize that just because you are the closest one to Rengar ulting means you getting an indicator does NOT mean you'Re the one he might be planning on killing, right?

Terozu3 votes

So basically he assumed you were targetting him and acted accordingly?

ghaoul1 votes

Watching myself die seemingly half a second after flashing was bizarre.

Its All Skillzz2 votes

{quoted}

Watching myself die seemingly half a second after flashing was bizarre.

yea, i dont like how flashing does nothing to stop point an click out of stealth one shots, same shit happens with kha zix Q rengar Q and wukong Q i think it is. many times ive been able to nearly survive these 3 champions only to flash away an see the animation hit me at spot i flashed an die -.-.

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