All she needed was some touching-up on her Ultimate to feel more awesome (like when Gnar goes Mega).
What did you do?
Well, you sorta buffed her Ultimate. But you also gutted, absolutely gutted, the one aspect of her kit that was 110% solid - her Passive - in favour some gimmicky garbage.
What's next, forcing Void Champions to kill Rift Guardian for their Passives to "work"?
AHarmlessTaco2 votesClearly you have no idea how to read the rest of her changes and you don't realize how large of a buff her R change is.... Try playing a support sometime and tell me how it feels when you can no longer Flay her out of her ult to save your team. OH. And it is a 100% guaranteed escape now. And btw, she gets 350 health when she ults now. SO. Yeah. No one cares about 15 - 35 Armor and Magic resistance when you consider all the things she gets now. [zombie-brand-clap]
Sincerely, An irritated support main.
woodvsmurph3 votesActually late game 35 armor and mr is probably more valuable than 350hp. The armor and mr reduces damage -- basically negating one flat pen item and flat pen from runes that an enemy takes. Whereas, the 350hp is basically gone after one crit from enemy adc. If you don't believe that, think of it another way: renekton falls off late game because he scales more with hp than with resistances compared to other tanks. So replacing resistances with hp is a net loss in tankiness. Thus renek < garen or malphite late game for tankiness because the latter 2 have armor and/or mr scaling.
Oglaf2 votesActually late game 35 armor and mr is probably more valuable than 350hp. The armor and mr reduces damage -- basically negating one flat pen item and flat pen from runes that an enemy takes. Whereas, the 350hp is basically gone after one crit from enemy adc. If you don't believe that, think of it another way: renekton falls off late game because he scales more with hp than with resistances compared to other tanks. So replacing resistances with hp is a net loss in tankiness. Thus renek < garen or malphite late game for tankiness because the latter 2 have armor and/or mr scaling.
Not to mention that she gets none of that Health in her human form, whereas her old Passive gave her a hefty chunk of resistances in her human form that were simply doubled in dragon form.
So yes, this rework is a rather significant nerf to her overall state just for them to fix her Ultimate.
AHarmlessTaco1 votesAt level 18: 2210 health, 84.6 armor (+5 from passive), 53.4 magic resist (+5 from passive)
+1000 health +50 armor +80 magic resist
Total: ~3200 health, ~140 armor, ~140 magic resist Every 1 armor and MR is a 1% increase to effective health.
She has 7680 effective health (3200 x 2.4)
With 3550 health and 140 armor and MR, she ends up having 8520 effective health With 3200 health and 175 armor and MR, she ends up having 8800 effective health
With just 2 dragons on her team: 3550 health and 150 armor and MR, she ends up having 8875 effective health
SO BASICALLY, if your team can get TWO dragons, she ends up with a net equal effective health AND an uninterrupted escape/engage. Just saying, there is no reason to complain like, AT ALL, because these buffs are substantial for the trade-off. Yeah her human form is a little weaker, but do you know how many Shyvana ults I have blocked as a support? Her win rate will skyrocket if you ask me. Yes it was a good change for her, but certainly the human form nerfs were appropriate.
woodvsmurph1 votesI was explaining that resistances are better than hp alone. I was not explaining in terms of her whole kit bundled together; what you say may very well be true at 6 items with the "right" build. But that is not what I was talking about. Secondly, as many have pointed out and you yourself state, she NEEDS dragons to be stronger (or even as strong as) before the changes. I don't know about you, but if my team is losing and I'm jungler I never get any help doing dragons. Thus even if I won my team a 3v2 or 3v3 bot, I am too low hp to do drag fast enough alone (enemy will respawn and kill me and/or steal it, so i'm forced to bail) and my bot lane that I just helped win a fight would rather go shop than help me despite my pings and the help I just gave them.
Big Lincoln1 votesnot like you can't just flay her immediately after the ult for most of the same effect
Oglaf1 votes[{quoted}](name=Big Lincoln,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=f9OETxaF,comment-id=00000001,timestamp=2016-11-19T14:08:25.158+0000)
not like you can't just flay her immediately after the ult for most of the same effect
Exactly. It is not CC immunity for the entire duration; just the leap.
it is a quality of life change, really.
AHarmlessTaco1 votesFlash ult drag ADC is a thing. Plus, its a pretty long gap closer. Plus, its a pretty long escape dash and goes over walls... Plus I am going to instinctively waste a lot of skills trying to interrupt her for the next year.... been playing this game for a while... lolol
I mean Im not disagreeing with you 100%, but there is also the fact that she can ult in response to Janna Q or Thresh flay, negating the abilities. I mean she can hold onto dragon form for a while no problem...
Oglaf1 votesFlash ult drag ADC is a thing. Plus, its a pretty long gap closer. Plus, its a pretty long escape dash and goes over walls... Plus I am going to instinctively waste a lot of skills trying to interrupt her for the next year.... been playing this game for a while... lolol
Range of the leap was nerfed, just FYI.
AHarmlessTaco1 votes???
Dragon's Descent (R) - Now grants 150/250/350 Health Damage lowered to to 150/250/350 from 175/300/425 Shyvana now grows in size with R rank. R can no longer interrupted mid flight!- screen will say "can't be disabled"
??? Previous patch? I see nothing in the Lol Wiki history...
Oglaf1 votes??? Now grants 150/250/350 Health Damage lowered to to 150/250/350 from 175/300/425 Shyvana now grows in size with R rank. R can no longer interrupted mid flight!- screen will say "can't be disabled"
??? Previous patch? I see nothing in the Lol Wiki history...
http://eune.leagueoflegends.com/en/news/champions-skins/champion-update/ability-update-shyvana
"Of course, we had to trade a few things to get there. Beyond the loss of resistances, Dragon’s Descent does less damage and travels less distance."
The more I read up this, the more I am convinced that this isn't a rework - it is a straight-up nerf.
AHarmlessTaco1 votesEhhhhhhhhhh okay. I dont think thats on the PBE yet so I cant say much. If thats the case though it might be a little much. Idk, it really looks like a power neutral to me considering everything else. We'll see I guess....
Oglaf1 votesEhhhhhhhhhh okay. I dont think thats on the PBE yet so I cant say much. If thats the case though it might be a little much. Idk, it really looks like a power neutral to me considering everything else. We'll see I guess....
We'll see indeed. It definitely does not look good though.
[zombie-brand-facepalm]
AHarmlessTaco1 votesDont worry m8. If shes under powered theyll give her buffs. Ritos been pretty on top of things IMO.
Oglaf1 votesDont worry m8. If shes under powered theyll give her buffs. Ritos been pretty on top of things IMO.
Sorry but no. After Rengar's rework I don't trust them at all, LOL.
AHarmlessTaco1 votesHes just not tuned yet.... prerework rengar was cancer. Bone tooth necklace needs tuning, but Q is better in terms of skill expression, W CC immunity trade off for damage is a fine direction, E is the same, and his ult is thematically cooler and has more counterplay. Just because he hasnt been tuned yet doesnt mean his direction is garbage.
Oglaf2 votesNo. It is the principle of the thing. Gimmicky passives are garbage.
As I said, why not tie (for example) Malzahar's passive to the Rift Guardian?
It is moronic.
Oglaf1 votesI'm a Support main too, and it was entirely silly how easily her Ult could be "ruined" by CC.
It needed CC-immunity for the duration of the leap.