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Garen's Q Needs a Nerf.

NotAPurpleFrog··4 votes·1,626 views

No I'm not a noob, no this is not my main, no this is not a first account, no I'm not bronze-silver, ranked is toxic, I have over 3 lv 50 accounts. Move along now Discussion Hustlers.

Ignoring the fact he has passive armor gain + a 60% damage reduction at lv 1, and the fact that he has infinite potions in his passive,

His Q is an: AA reset, deals true damage to Villian, deals bonus damage, has a speed boost, breaks slows, and has a silence. Can we add more shit to his 3s cooldown escape engage "win trades" silence Q? Like fucking honestly, this isn't a juggernaut anymore, it's a tank with armor scaling and damage. There's no way in fuck for Garen to lose, just Q E, deal half your enemie's health lv 2 because balanced.

And I'm completely ignoring the fact that he has a point and click MAGIC DAMAGE nuke execute. Why does Garen deal true damage if he has NO RESOURCE AT ALL.

  • Silencing someone would require MAGICAL ABILITIES, yet he has no resource
  • His armor RANDOMLY GLOWS AND GETS OVER 50% DAMAGE REDUCTION, for no cost
  • He gets a FUCKING SWORD OUT OF THE SKY THAT DEALS MAGIC DAMAGE AND TRUE DAMAGE TO THE VILLAIN, for no cost
  • He heals more than potions, yet uses no magic to do so.

So either this is a fucking load of bullshit, or it's a load of bullshit. No I'm not calling Garen overpowered, I'm saying his Q is unbalanced, ONLY HIS Q, and maybe W.. and maybe R...... and maybe R... actually why the fuck does Garen have a Black Cleaver on E...

What I suggest:

  • Remove Garen's Movement Speed on Q when running away from people, and remove the silence, it's called Decisive Strike not "Run Away!!!!"
  • Remove Garen's Per Level Armor gain, so he isn't a tank and more of the Juggernaut he was supposed to be.
  • Make Garen's R not deal magic damage, make it AD but it doesn't scale and it's a set amount
  • Make Garen have no Health Regen (not his passive)

Either that or just give him Mana Costs so new players learn to manage their mana.

24 Comments

Critmaster Garen4 votes

{quoted}

a 60% damage reduction at lv 1

you already lost me here. there is not a single garen who starts w.

moving on.

NotAPurpleFrog1 votes

I meant lv 1 W

Critmaster Garen3 votes

{quoted}

I meant lv 1 W

yes. level 1 w. ive seen that.

literally no one does that.

NotAPurpleFrog1 votes

1 point into W

AnAggravatedPimp2 votes

As a Riven main I'm all for the Garen hate train.

As a rational person I'm like WHY THE EFF IS THERE A GAREN HATE TRAIN

NotAPurpleFrog1 votes

He's being buffed.

ZephyrDrake2 votes

Oh noes it break slows... oh wait you can instantly reapply the slow. His entire kit deals true damage to the villain so why mention this? If a Garen is starting W he is an idiot pure and simple. Also AA reset? I guess renekton's empowered W is an AA reset as well. Seems to me that you have no idea how to deal with him and instead of learning how to do so you came here to whine about him

NotAPurpleFrog1 votes

You can't re-apply slows if your ability is on cooldown now can you. No Garen starts W I mean lv 1 W has 60% Damage reduction. Renekton's W IS an AA reset, I can deal with him I'm saying his Q is overloaded, not whining but ok.

ZephyrDrake1 votes

{quoted}

You can't re-apply slows if your ability is on cooldown now can you. No Garen starts W I mean lv 1 W has 60% Damage reduction. Renekton's W IS an AA reset, I can deal with him I'm saying his Q is overloaded, not whining but ok.

Renek's W and Garen's Q are as much of an AA reset than an Ezreal Q is. The animation makes it pointless as one. Slows are the more abundant type of CC in the game, tons of champions and items have slows in them. Not my fault your champion has only one slow in their entire kit and nothing else to deal with Garen. His W also has a stupid long CD and really short duration at rank 1.

You can say his Q is overloaded all you want. It's a MS boost that silences if he hits you with it. Sona's W is more overloaded than that

Sona Ping2 votes

Yeah all together, this is correct; Garen does have a kit he uses to fight people.

NotAPurpleFrog1 votes

It's not the fact he can fight people, it's the fact he can kill people while taking little to no damage, and even if you deal damage to him he just heals it all back up in 5s.

AnAggravatedPimp1 votes

{quoted}

It's not the fact he can fight people, it's the fact he can kill people while taking little to no damage, and even if you deal damage to him he just heals it all back up in 5s.

Then poke him from Range. Quinn is meta as hell right now and she'll walk all over Garen. He can't heal if every time his passive procs he gets Auto'd

NotAPurpleFrog1 votes

Poke him, how? A majority of top laners are melee.

AnAggravatedPimp1 votes

{quoted}

Poke him, how? A majority of top laners are melee.

By picking Quinn or possibly Gnar, though I've less experience with him. Seriously, this thread is just you saying what Garens kit consist of then ignoring arguments/counter arguments. Pick Quinn, she invalidates most Melees and can roam mid then bot then mid again then go back top before the wave crashes into her tower. Or pick Vlad and heal harder, burst faster and then be useful in teamfights without flash.

Sona Ping2 votes

{quoted}

It's not the fact he can fight people, it's the fact he can kill people while taking little to no damage, and even if you deal damage to him he just heals it all back up in 5s.

Oh, I agree. Like you wrote, he does have a Q, W, E, and R ability that do things and many threads over the years have told me that is more than enough reason to nerf someone.

And since he is apparently trading in lane, and taking no damage and healing it back in less time than it takes for his passive to come off cooldown, then sure he needs a nerf if that's the case.

NotAPurpleFrog1 votes

Quit being sarcastic, holy shit I'm here to explain real problems not some imaginary shit you made up on the fly.

SuckHerWee1 votes

I didn't read all of it bc it was really aggressive, but I agree that garen needs some form of nerf or adjust rn. He's extremely tanky and can disable all forms of cc and has a lot of mobility, which is ok, but at the same time he can one shot squishies lvl 6. If you have a flash or escape you can't even use them until after the q silence duration has ended, and by then your hp is either already extremely low for his ultimate execute or youre forced to back. Ive seen garens get some lethality and dmg and then just build full hp from their and destroy towers faster than a 700 stack nasus

NotAPurpleFrog1 votes

Most of the aggression was a joke, if you read it all you'll see, not reading your post fully because you didn't read mine. Besides it's not a smart idea to comment about a post you haven't even read.

jiffib1 votes

No I'm not a noob, no this is not my main, no this is not a first account, no I'm not bronze-silver, ranked is toxic, I have over 3 lv 50 accounts. Move along now Discussion Hustlers.

Having played a lot doesn’t make you good at the game, and it doesn’t mean you approach the Garen matchup correctly.

Any champ’s kit can be exaggerated and made to sound OP if you forget to mention long cool downs, short ranges, and short windows of power. Most of the stuff you mention has a clear downside that you’re purposefully avoiding mentioning, like the fact that if he’s stupid enough to take a point in w at level 1, sure he’ll get that 60% damage reduction for .75 seconds but you’ll be level 3 before that skill even comes up again. And oh, wait, your champ has abilities and autoattacks too! You can trade effectively for a VERY long time after he uses his w.

These downsides can be exploited when playing against him. There’s a reason Garen is literally never picked in pro play. So maybe try playing around cooldowns or picking any of the many laners that do well into him (ie any ranged top laner) before whining about how he needs a nerf.

Sure, he can run at you and if you let him hit all his skills, he’ll do a lot of damage. Same as literally every champ in the game. But remember that’s all he can do — run at you. So outplay him. Choose kennen and you’ve won lane. Choose any other tank and you’ve won team fights against him.

Oh wait, he has tons of damage against you when you’re the villain? Tell your team that, and don’t fight him 1v1 when you’re the villain.

Oh wait, he has an execute? Don’t let him walk up to you and unload his whole kit on you. If you do, don’t be surprised when he kills you.

NotAPurpleFrog1 votes

I'm not exaggerating, I literally said exactly what the ability did, I know it has a 1s duration on his 60% Damage Reduction, it's the fact he has 60% Damage Reduction with 1 Point into W. Ofc Downsides can be exploited, otherwise everyone would play Garen, and his R is Ranged, ontop of that he has flash 100% of the time.

VermillionWolf1 votes

Ye dude, his Q will deal 1% of ur max hp true damage IF your a villian.

Nerf please.

L I T E R A L L Y U N P L A Y A B L E

NotAPurpleFrog1 votes

Autoattacks deal the same thing.

VermillionWolf1 votes

Attack speed Garen new meta

Baron Von Garen1 votes

1.) "infinite potions in his passive" -- No, his passive goes on a 9 second cooldown when he takes any damage from champions, and from level 1-10 it's less or roughly the same regen as a refillable potion.

2.) "His Q is an: AA reset, deals true damage to Villian, deals bonus damage, has a speed boost, breaks slows, and has a silence."--- It deals 1% max health true damage to the villain, not the entire Q damage. The speed boost is honestly subpar, people like gangplank and fiora can do the same or better multiple times, I won't even mention adc's like jhin with stormrazors. Silences are the weakest form of cc in the game. Also Garen's Q stays on an 8 second cooldown at all ranks, again unlike most top laners with an auto reset. Look at darius, his W starts at 7 seconds and goes down to 5.

3.) "Can we add more shit to his 3s cooldown escape engage "win trades" silence Q?" -- Again, its 8 seconds at all ranks and the silence duration was nerfed, it used to go up to 2.5, now its 1.5 at all ranks.

4.) "And I'm completely ignoring the fact that he has a point and click MAGIC DAMAGE nuke execute." --- Did you know darius is a champion in league of legends? Anyways, the magic damage part is hit or miss. I'd honestly like it if his ult did physical damage, because then building black cleaver would actually synergize with your abilities, like most champions in the game.

5.)"Either that or just give him Mana Costs so new players learn to manage their mana." -- He has no mana costs because all of his abilities are on an absurd cooldown. His W starts at 24s and only goes down to 20. However, fiora on the other hand has a shorter cooldown, and her W blocks 100% of damage and redirects any cc, slows your movespeed and attackspeed, and is aoe.

tl;dr

What I'm getting from this is, you picked a champion that doesn't do well in early game and tried to level 2 fight garen expecting him to die in 3 autos, then got killed yourself. Obviously you've never seen garen in a teamfight otherwise you wouldn't have made a post as to why hes 'op' and 'strong'

His laning is subpar, teamfight is shit, his ability to splitpush is pretty decent, his susceptibility to ganks is terribly high, making it even harder for him to win lane if he does get ahead. That's Garen right now.

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