Ashe Fix/Rework

GalacticBears·10/29/2014, 1:40:55 AM·1 votes·1,513 views

AVOID COMMENTING IF YOU DON'T THOROUGHLY READ/UNDERSTAND THE POINTS MADE IN THE OP!! ASK QUESTIONS IF NECESSARY!

So my roomates and I have taken up playing champs not in "the meta". More for the fun and (generally) the challenge of playing them than anything else. That isn' to say champs that aren't in "the meta" are bad/need reworks ect. some just aren't popular. That being said we've all been playing AsheAshe this go around and come up with some problems and solutions to boost Ashe's playability and popularity. If you have any other suggestions/think Ashe's fine let us know! Especially if you think she's fine, tell us why.

The Problems

1. No damage boost/speed steroid/true escape

*Focus is the closest thing she has to a damage boost and it doesn't scale well as the game progresses and isn't that effective in teamfight situations (virtually ineffective in teamfights). Also it's highly unlikely anyone playing Ashe doesn't build a crit based item item 3046 item 3087 item 3031 "guaranteeing" she'll crit anyway.

*Frost Shot does serve as the opposite of a speed steroid, but its for movement speed whereas true speed steroids are for attack speed. It is great for teamfights and chasing down opponents, but largely useless otherwise. Everyone (other ADCs) elses Q's can be used effectively everywhere else.

*Volley is a solid attack that helps with farming/damage/kiting/fleeing and works excellently with her kit. It's honestly the best thing about Ashe aside from her ult. That being said anyone with a gap closer or summoner 4 can avoid it if they're chasing.

*Hawkshot's a solid skill that not only fits her kit, but the gold passive helps because Ashe tends to fall behind in farm. That being said it doesn't have any offensive output unless your teams attacking/chasing.

*Enchanted Crystal Arrow is Ashe's greatest skill and only "true escape", is essentially fine except for the fact it does additional damage based off AP. This is simply put illogical and doesn't work with her kit at all seeing how the only other damage skill(s...Focus isn't an active but it's still a skill) is based off AD.

2) Obvious target due to lack of escape and crappy base stats

Ashe's base stats plus her lack of a true escape makes her the easiest ADC to focus and successfully kill. VarusVarus is the closest to her as far as lack of a solid escape, but he makes up for it with higher base stats, a true speed steroid, and a damage boost. Obviously like all ADC's Ashe is all about positioning and hopefully your teams lookin out for you. That being said your team can't watch you 24/7 and play effectively. Also her damage is easily negated by the fact every other ADC has either more damage/a damage boost/a true speed steroid. Focus helps poke, but you can't truly poke all game (realistically speaking).

3) Why play Ashe when everyone does it better?

Every skill in Ashe's kit is mirrored in other ADCs kits, with one notable difference. Theirs are better. She's essentially the greatest template ever, but that's it. Cait'sCaitlyn passive is a more effective version of Focus also her range and damage are better. Everyone, but CorkiCorki , EzrealEzreal , LucianLucian , and Vayne, has a slow; so Frost Shot while more consistent is negligible. Also all of the champs I just listed make up for their lack of slow in one way or another with damage/escapes/damage boost. Volley, which is great, is not enough to balance out other issues and isn't unflappable. As an escape/kiting tool it's just ok. As damage every ADC has more powerful attacks, they simply hit less targets/are less wide spread. Hawkshot is a solid skill that's useful especially when you consider it's passive. That being said it has 0 offensive output unless it's used to help chase/initiate. Finally Enchanted Crystal Arrow is easily Ashe's best skill, but scaling off AP is just silly. Nothing in Ashe's kit even suggests to get AP, on the contrary her only damage skill(s...Focus is passive but it's still a skill) suggest AD.

Problems, problems, problems, but we come with solution too!

Admittedly we spent less time on finding solutions, as we got...distracted during the discussion, but here's what we came up with.

The Solutions

1) Base Damage increase

We went really lazy first and thought a simple base damage boost would be fine. This helps with farming, fighting, tower pushing, the works. We also thought, as non-programmers, this would be the easiest thing to setup/handle. We also did 0 math 'cus we're too stupid for that. :)

**2) Change Frost Shot **

There were a quite a few ideas on this, but we came agreed on a few:

  • Make it stack damage, similar to TwitchTwitch , but it stacks damage per hit with the slow. For the sake of "balance" (personally I think this would make her balanced no other changes needed) while using Frost Shot her attack speed is slower by a percentage. Alternatively (keeping [or not >.>] Ashe's attack speed reduced) make it deal a flat amount of increased damage per level.

  • Make it slow the targets attack speed on par with their movement speed. Obviously this only effects champs that are focused on basic attacking, but it could be extended to increase champs cdr. Meaning while the targets effected their skills cooldowns are increased. Not a huge change (hopefully) for the sake of programming, but certainly effective in game. (this is my idea :D)

  • Drop her current (relatively) useless passive and make Frost Shot her passive giving her a new Q we've named Focused Shot! You'd most likely have to reduce either Ashe's base attack speed or the percentages that Frost Shot slows. Focused Shots would do more base damage and you could do a few things (keeping in mind her new Passive is Frost Shot now) for the sake of balance.

    • Reduce Ashe's attack speed
    • Turn off Frost Shot while using Focused Shot
    • Make it stack damage similar to previously mentioned Frost Shot change

3) Change Hawkshot

  *  Give it an extremely short fear to whoever' in the effected area (think Shaco's jitb)
     - Makes sense honestly, SURPRISE HERE'S A HAWK! Also helps if Ashe's dueling/trying to escape. For sake of balance you'd either have to reduce the range of the revealed area or how far it can go.

 
  • Remaking the skill as a whole.

    • Possibly adding a small circling hawk around Ashe (a mini Valor or something similar to FiddleFiddlesticks /SwainsSwain birds). Removing the gold passive the skill now adds a hawk that attacks at random every (whatever seconds). Helps with farm and in team fights. Same active, but the hawk no longer helps while the skills on CD.
  • After Firing speed steroid

    • No longer "burdened" by the hawk (even though we dunno where this things coming from...) while the skill is on CD Ashe gets an attack speed boost that is reduced as the CD comes to an end.

4) Change Enchanted Crystal Arrow

  •  Make it Scale off AD (duh)
    
    • Not really gonna go in depth on this...should be pretty obvious and taken care of regardless of whether Ashe gets a full rework or not.
  • Increased damage per range travelled

    • Taking away the stun all together but keeping the slow
    • Reduce the stun time per range flatly increasing the damage
    • Increasing the damage and stun the closer to Ashe the target is (cus logic) and reduce it via travel time
    • Stunned target takes more damage from Ashe for a certain amount of time (we settled on 3 seconds after the initial stun)

**[New] 5) New Passive **

  • Master Archer (new passives tentative title)
    • Ashe never stops to fire skills. Similar to how Lucian can still use Relentless Pursuit while using The Culling, but for all of Ashe's skills. Additionally reduces her CD's by a percentage while not attacking.

Well that's about it. Thanks for reading! We'll probably come back with more ideas the more Ashe games we play and add to it. Again if you have other Ideas on how to improve/change Ashe tell us! If you think Ashe is fine tell us why! :)

P.S. Seriously why does Enchanted Crystal Arrow do AP damage? Like every reason we could come up with got show down...makes no sense. Someone please explain.

33 Comments

All Skillzz10/29/2014, 2:12:04 AM3 votes

ashe is my favorite campion, i climbed to plat 5 with her and i played her in every role cept jungle cause i couldnt get that to work. but yea her ult should scale off ad an her passive should not punish you for AAin as an adc.......

xDingwithsalad10/29/2014, 2:27:12 AM2 votes

ashe is an amazing champion and probably one of the most balanced champions

KMannnnn110/29/2014, 3:21:44 AM2 votes

Ashe is squishy and doesn't have a dash or a jump, but she has completely unmatched utility among adcs, with free vision, permaslow, hard engage/disengage, and increased gold farming, all while still dishing out #tonsofdamage with autos and volley. The only change she needs is to have a passive that works outside of the lane phase.

xDingwithsalad10/29/2014, 3:49:32 AM2 votes

actually im totally done with this conversation, good luck in bronze buddy.

KMannnnn110/29/2014, 4:18:50 AM1 votes

Ashe can end up dealing a lot of damage sooner than other adcs because she gets gold about 15% faster. And yes, that assumes equal farm, but ashe has the second longest range until tristana scales above her, so she shouldn't have any issues keeping up with cs. More items=more damage, and between autos and a 4 second cd 100%ad ratio spell, the numbers add up fast.

Quepha10/29/2014, 4:44:37 AM1 votes

wow another person thinks that every adc needs to deal the same amount of damage or they're useless. ashe has a higher winrate than most of the adcs you say are better than her so maybe you're underestimating parts of her kit.

also, how do you say that other champions have a better version of ashe's Q, E, or R?

GalacticBears10/29/2014, 1:22:22 PM1 votes

The infamous silent down votes strike again! Hey guys just to remind you this is a discussion and we highly encourage different opinions. They will be considered and looked at, but make sure you read the OP and understand this is not a beat 'em up session on Ashe. This is a realistic look at the champ as a whole and her playability vs other ADCs playability.

GalacticBears10/31/2014, 11:19:50 AM1 votes

After letting this fester some and reading other threads that have Ashe changes suggestions we're still interested in the silent down voters speaking up :) Don't be scared! Open platform for other opinions, just make sure you know your facts as well!

Sageace10/31/2014, 9:12:00 PM1 votes

Sorry, i didnt post my answers in your forum. Here.