I'm sorry, I feel like I missed something. Darius gets to become a pentakill legend, Garen gets to deal extra damage and true damage on his ultimate, Morde gets to take the dragon as his pet and wail on ADC's with a pal, and Skarner? Skarner gets a rock. A rock that can be taken away from him.
Am I the only one that thinks that Skarner got the short end of the stick with these changes?
Radnar the bold52 votesGaren- made it eaiser to kill the fed enemy. Daruis- made it easier to kill things Morde- Take dragon as your friend to punish them for not taking dragon. Skarner- get your spires on the map or be punished by the enemy getting gold and rewards for counterjungeling you.
A Miss Fortune9 votesI don't think It's that bad. The changes they listed in Juggernaut page weren't the only thing.
For example, Garen got his E buffed so he can actually move faster and can't be as easily kited, but he doesn't get free 20% more AR/MR and also his silence got nerfed hard.
I like the Skarner buffs, if I did the math correctly he gets about 125% extra attack speed at max level. Plus he also regens 3% of his mana (he is quite mana hungry as far as I know), and 150 movement speed. His clearing and ganking capability will be scary and I feel like he would just be flat out overloaded or overpowered if it was his permanent passive.
While he can be kited, 150 movement speed from the crystals will give him 480 movement speed. That's insanely fast.
ArkenStorm30 votesgaren now moves slower towards champs he's hitting with judgment. why on earth is that a thing
Retillin11 votesHe was getting to Kalista to easy, they had to increase his skill cap to counter it.
ArkenStorm1 votesyes, and the guy who can only runa t you and hope to deal damage loses sticking power. woooooo
Retillin3 votesCorrect! More "skill" is involved now! So when you lose as Garen you can only blame yourself!
/s
Jesus Canaj 4202 votesMeh. The point of Garen's kit is to run up and stick to them. Q is good for that, but nerfing silence duration means they can escape easier. Removing tenacity on w means you can be cc'd more effectively. Making e slow yourself if you actually do finally succeed to get near the target means now they can once again, escape easier.
It's not really them adding "skill", it's them nerfing the everliving crap out of his only way to be useful.
Retillin4 votes/s = means /end sarcasm.
junglerboy1620 votesnot to mention all the stats he's getting from his new passive are just stats that already existed as part of his Q (and are no longer there).
So long sticking power, hello gimmicky objective nobody asked for. (Like seriously, when did anyone ever want Skarner to be an objective/zone controller?)
This basically screws Skarner if he's:
and gives him a slight advantage over live if:
I don't know what the team behind these particular changes was on, but nothing about it screams "juggernaut" or feels like a Nasus-esque change like they said they wanted, it's just something that forces a healthy balanced champ into an unfair disadvantage.
Auryiel6 votesGaren - Makes it easier to be Garen Darius - Makes it easier to be Darius Skarner - Punishes you for not being around an objective all the fucking time Morde - Might as well not exist anymore
Honestly if you think SKARNER of all people got the short end of the stick, you have never, ever played Morde. And that's coming from someone who saw the Skarner changes and just got his soul crushed.
Jesus Canaj 4208 votesGaren's change did not make it easier to be garen in any way at all imo. It only made it way worse.
Vistha Kai15 votesGaren - all base stats nerfed, 20% slow on E when damaging champions, half of the kit removed or nerfed. Darius - half of the kit removed. Morde - they want to make him an ADC. Skarner - reworked into shit for the 5th time.
Meep Man17 votesIn all seriousness, these are PBE changes. Grain of salt guys...
DrCyanide32 votesUh... it's not just a PBE change. It's an official "we're giving him a rock" change.
http://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/page/gameplay-update-juggernauts
Whatever else happens is PBE changes that could be tweaked over the next 2 weeks, but they're going to have Skarner's passive be a rock.
FaceBiscuits7 votesIn all seriousness there was a lot of things that were on PBE that got ridiculous/stupid changes where Riot said lol! relax its PBE! then published them to Live anyway.
ArkenStorm2 votesThe last time CertainlyT had the changelist thing, we ended up with cass. broken in the right hands, worthless everywhere else. and by right hand i mean premades who can get early help from jungle to get fed and proceed to machine-gun-e and win
Vistha Kai4 votesIt was Stashu who was responsible for Cassio.
TBH I don't even think CertainlyT was even near the people responsible for Cassio rework to begin with.
Strazty2 votes[{quoted}](name=Inept Maverick,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=bIfdl5oa,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2015-08-04T21:37:10.834+0000)
In all seriousness, these are PBE changes. Grain of salt guys...
Riot releases things they put on PBE regardless of what people say kinda like the new HUD
shad8whawk16 votesHi,
I have been playing Skarner for about a year and a half, and he's my main jungler; the one I turn to when I want to carry games. I don't pick him to be a tank, I pick him because he's a fighter. HE DOES DAMAGE. His whole kit is built to chase. He can duel people. He has two disables when he ganks.
His Q and current passive make him do damage, but most importantly help him to chase his targets down. If they run by anything while being chased, I will press q and it will help me catch them... at least it used to. Now I lose the 6 to 18% movespeed on top of having my base speed down. What's the point of lowering the cooldown if I'll get kited and can't use it?
For his W: huge indirect nerf. His w movespeed would stack with both his base and q movespeed. Since he maxes q first, at max rank I lose 6-12-18% movespeed that I would have gained from q stacks, on top of the 15 flat lost from my base speed.
So, max movespeed of a chasing Skarner is now down from 472.2 (without boots! with maxed q and w) to **382.8 **(maxed w, q doesn't matter; no boots) [calculated from base m.s x 3q passive stacks x w ratio when fully ramped up]
Now for his e, You waste the slow through stunning them. Since you have to basic attack to do damage and reset your q, you'll never use the 2 second slow, cause you've removed his chase tools. He'll now q then stun... and then what... wait for e/w cooldown?
A Skarner doesn't run in and e right away and if he missed RIP gank (like amumu q before 6) A Skarner gank is supposed to be cut off escape, q them till his passive is up then stun, and have his e for if the laner escapes and he needs to keep chasing. Skarner is not Udyr with a condition on bear stance. That is what his new e is. I get e on as many targets as possible then I have 5 seconds to bear, bear, bear, bear.
And what's with the chalice? If you're spamming w so much buy a tear, dont afk near krug or gromp camp. It's like saying Udyr is mana hungry then spamming his bear stance with a single point in it to each camp.
I play Skarner to chase, to run, and pick people off. "You'll never escape." His abilities all worked for these three purposes.
Now he's Nunu in the Definitely not Udyr skin playing Dominion on Summoner's Rift.
LoLKiru8 votesI think Skarner's new passive (not sure if this is the right thing to call it) is something that doesn't sound great on paper, but ends up being super effective for him in practice.
Depending on the boosts he gets from running over crystal spires, it could turn him into a ganking monster (and improve his clears since the spires give him bonus AS).
DrCyanide2 votesIn that case, they could have worked on their presentation. Almost half the video is Skarner walking up to and capturing the rock.
Solari Fortune2 votesI think Skarner's new passive (not sure if this is the right thing to call it) is something that doesn't sound great on paper, but ends up being super effective for him in practice.
Depending on the boosts he gets from running over crystal spires, it could turn him into a ganking monster (and improve his clears since the spires give him bonus AS).
Here are his boosts when near a crystal controlled by his team, "While near active crystals, Skarner gains 150 Movement Speed and 35%+5%/lvl Attack Speed, and he restores 3% of his maximum Mana per second."
Vennominaga8 votesAs a long time Skarner main, I agree 1000%. This poor champion goes through more unnecessary reworks than anyone. He's in a fine spot right now, especially with sated devourer. His identity is being completely stolen. He's not Bard; he shouldn't have his "windows of power" in specific locations. That completely removes my choice as a player. What if I want to invade and kill the other jungler while they're taking a camp? That's a damn shame. There's no rock there so I'm effectively losing out on the power spike I had before through Q and his old passive. Which, let's be honest, was pitiful enough early game. Udyr would just turn around, bop me in the face while tanking red, and kill me. That's how underwhelming Skarner's bases are. I can't ramp up attack speed to beat him or movespeed to run away since both of them are removed. I want to take Scuttles? Slower than before. My own jungle camps? Better be a rock or it's slower. Stuck fighting in an odd place? I'm worthless. I might as well switch to Trundle or Xin or Udyr. They all get attack speed buffs on their kits anywhere they want. Most champions get to choose when and where they want to be on the map. Skarner's not one of them anymore it seems.
Jinxish7 votesSo basically, they made his passive a mini version of Dominion???? WTF?????????
DrCyanide3 votesI don't get it either. And as the enemy team, what incentive do I have to even go near your rock? I just push my lane and you're powerless.
I beat Dominion by not playing it, and I have a feeling players will beat Skarner by not playing Mini Dominion.
Leetri1 votesThe rocks are by the buffs, Baron and Dragon. If you're ignoring them you're more or less giving his team free objectives.
Fishing Boat2 votesIn exchange he gives away the vast majority of his stickiness and fighting capability at every other point of the game except objectives. Don't forget that he lost both passive AND active movement speed.
DrCyanide4 votesAnd in a 40 minute game, how much time are you expected to spend at your own Red buff? Your own Blue buff? The enemies Red buff? The enemies Blue buff? These are objectives that you take and move on, not objectives you take and have a tea party at.
Baron doesn't spawn until 20 minutes in, so that rock is basically a second Scuttle Crab boost until then. Both Baron and Dragon have pretty long respawn times, and I don't think you're going to get as much use out of those rocks while those objectives are down.
What the rocks do is encourage Skarner to show up early for a neutral objective, get his rock, and sit there guarding it so he's ready in case a fight breaks out. They don't help him if the enemy team is the first one there (you could argue they hurt him, due to the vision given over).
Blue Socialist6 votesSkarner doesn't just get a rock....he gets SIX rocks. Jokes aside it helps him out for counterjungling and stuff and gives him more control of the neutral objectives. It gives more incentive for your team to roam into the enemy jungle at the beginning. I personally find it interesting.
Espurr VI5 votesI used to be a Skarner main, but then Riot fucked Skarner over several times making him "good"
Slarrdar5 votesI got over the first rework. I decided to get over it again during the second. Then his lore was butchered but more was promised (Where is that rito? Shurima ended) Then...this. I don't even. My longtime main has finally been put down. I don't think I'll be able to play this version of 
Fool me once Rito, I'm mad. Fool me twice, how could you? Fool me three times, you're officially that guy, okay? You know him, you know the one. You go to the bar and he's like, "This suit is, uh, officially it's a Giorgio Armani, actually my dad knows him." Fuck you! - Jontron
Blue Moon Wolf3 votesI still don't understand how these rocks are supposed to help him. If he wants to do something other than jungle, like top lane, he's got to rush into the jungle, find the rocks, and capture them before the enemy gets gold off them. I feel like all they did was make him more complicated and think THAT all this is going to do is make him played less than he is now.
COLEplusTEN2 votesGhostcrawler's idea...
Poske2 votesHe gets A Crystal
GET your facts straight
Crystals are outrageos
The Ecdysiast2 votesI love that it gives Movespeed for the taking of a stationary mob instead of AD or AP or anything else.
gaby1best2 votesGaren - Q nerf, W nerf, E - situationally buffed, cannot crit anymore. New passive which only works against the most fed enemy(so can't work on lane) and gives him true damage on ult(yes, this is quite extreme; DEMACIAA!).
Darius - Laning heavily nerfed, no longer the biggest lane bully and most dominant top laner. Ult damage nerfed, W dmg nerfed and no longer reduces attack speed. Q normally nerfed, situationally buffed.
Mordekaiser - P, Q, W, E, R buffed, with the exception that W no longer deals damage if he's not near the ally he casted W on; still, he can now cast again to steal HP from enemies(so he finally gets sustain). He gets to have a dragon pet.
Skarner - Ult buffed, don't know about the other changes because I don't play Skarner and don't know his old numbers.
So yeah, kinda different from your "Darius gets to become a pentakill legend, Garen gets to deal extra damage and true damage on his ultimate, Morde gets to take the dragon as his pet and wail on ADC's with a pal, and Skarner? Skarner gets a rock.".
DrCyanide1 votesThose details weren't available when the post was made, and it's quite possible some of those details will change. What will be the same is the content in the videos though, and that's what I described.
gaby1best1 votesWell of course those weren't all the changes, but you still made a thread witout knowing the full details.
DrCyanide2 votesThe details on the PBE could change, or they could be altered slightly in coming patches. Those details are less significant than the general ideas and goals behind the changes, which Riot explained in the article.
If someone pointed out "you missed the part where if Skarner's team controls all 6 they spawn crystal minions which have better defensive stats" or something else, then I would have been happy to know what I missed. Honestly, I still feel like there's suppose to be something else with the Skarner changes.
Wrennardx2 votesI really doubt there any many players with more Skarner games over the last few years than myself, and I can tell you that these changes are pretty brutal. What made a good Skarner now was maximizing the uptime on your Q stacks while in the jungle while understanding how/when to use your W/E during ganks. Now..., it's all tied to a crystal that isn't anywhere near the lane. Unfortunately Repertoir is pretty uninformed if he believes his changes do anything besides make Skarner even less viable in a game. Q nerfs are foolish, W change is unneeded and removes complexity within his kit, but the E change is the worst (Repertoir is woefully out of touch on this one).
Skarner was actually in a pretty decent place, I have no idea why they keep messing with him year after year, seems like it's what they do when they want to seem like they're doing something and don't know what to do (Kinda like how they change the entire jungle every year and say "Oh, we've changed the way the game is played").
It's sad and it's a bummer, but it's what a company does that's moved farther and farther out of touch with it's community.
Silven2 votesJesus Christ, they're minerals! http://i.imgur.com/jiRLB2i.gif
Karn Bishop1 votesI like the changes, it fix's one of the main reasons i refused to play skarner, which was his clear times and safety in his own jungle from invades. This gives him both, also his shield now scales off of total hp n Q off of total damage and anyone who doesn't think that is amazing is just not using their head.
skyfall6192 votesSkar was able to duel just about every champ and win. His clears were already very fast
Karn Bishop1 votesYet he rarely sees play in his current kit setup, guess your just the only one who can see the greatness that is skarner and abuse it to its full potential, nope the current skarner is an smart pick only vs some very specific team comps which is why his pick rate is so low in the first place.
Those picks are mostly champions that cannot straight up fight skarner or kite him and that's only if they are behind or skarner manages to get a lucky early lead.
I remember when bard was released and everyone said his chimes were dumb and would never work and yet here we are today and bards really successful, i think skarners crystals will be the same way.
skyfall6192 votesskar can be kited very hard and his ganks are meh without ult thats his main problem. he can duel the likes of lee sin with ease.
Malicious Fury1 votes{quoted}Skarner gets a rock. A rock that can be taken away from him.
The Dragon can be taken away from Morde. He can go all game without it because the enemy jungler is better than yours.
DrCyanide7 votesHe could, and I'm sure he would be very sad without his Dragon.
The difference is if Morde gets even a single Dragon he's like "bwahaha! I've got a Dragon!". I have a hard time imagining Skarner players feeling comparably powerful when they get their rock.
