What would you like to see in Mage itemization? What wouldn't you like to see in Mage itemization?

TehNACHO·Nov 19, 2017·4 votes·509 views

So it's somewhat casually thrown around now that Mage itemization is somewhere between a trash bin and the local garbage dump, but I want to see a little more depth in that statement. What do you think needs to be added to enhance Mage itemization? What do you think needs to be avoided to stay away from accidentally hamstringing Mages?

Some things I would like to see:

More itemization options to differentiate AP Assassins from AP Mages (as well as more dedicated items for different AP niches)
Adapting certain Mage/Champion Passives into items (Ahri's Passive is pretty neat)

Some things I would like to avoid:

Items with confused niches ()
Odd or tacked on power

12 Comments

egoSniperNov 19, 20172 votes

I'd like mages to have real damage again. The entire product line got nerfed for a few sustain damage outliers like Azir. Ever since AP was redone to be stat-parity with AD per gold cost, mages have felt really flat. They no longer have big power spikes unless they either get ridiculously fed or are just an outlier FotM champion.

I don't think it needs to be much, but seriously, there are only 2 AP items in the game right now built for straight damage: Luden's and Deathcap. You might be able to argue Lich Bane but since not too many mages are keen on AA'ing things outside of laning phase I personally don't.

Literally every single other AP item is just utility with some incidental damage tacked on, and it's boring because now you play the same damn kit every game.

ZerdunNov 19, 20172 votes

i want real itemisation.

item 3057 should be for the slayer based APs who need mana as well as some divers/skirmishers item 3802 for burst/artillery mages and item 3070 for most battle mages while item 3010 should be good for the mana hungry tanks, close range battle mages/AP fighters.

Control mages would want either chapter, tear, or catalyst based on what they are laning against. Since this class is as versatile as it is they sorta bleed over all three items based on matchup and how their kit is designed.

item 3165 should not be the go to item for almost mid lane AP champs, it feels kinda bad TBH. The book is good but i feel that it is currently too powerful as it is in comparison to the other mana items in the current itemisation. I wanna see the GW ripped from its pages and placed elsewhere. Honestly 20% CDR mana and AP should be a strong buy as is.

item 3136 should become the new void staff, while the completed mask should have options for either GW or a type of BotRK effect that is applied through initial spell casts based on which side is completed (think like item 3035 ) we can put the GW here and give it a reasonable method of application that allows it to actually be effective in a team fight where people peel for the carries. Plus you could name them liandry's suffering (botrk) and liandry's torment (GW). Both names sound legit.

item 3135 should become a flat M pen option and be what the ap assassins want to buy similar to how ad assassins want to buy item 3142 / item 3814

item 3089 needs to be made great again. It's just not built because it costs tons and current item 3135 is generally just a better buy unless your Veigar , then you get both.

I want to see some more viable defensive options outside of item 3102 and item 3157 for AP's who deal damage in general. item 3027 is jank because of the charging mechanic and outside of these two the only real durability item mages build is item 3116 .

I would also love to see some AP's get a focus their tertiary stats to scale off of instead of the current flat AP and CDR + whatever defense you can muster design. This is especially true considering that CDR is on just about every 'good' piece of AP gear. Since all the ap champions have their damage balanced around scaling off of these two stats everyone just buys the best items / whatever is most slot efficient because cost efficiency is king. With the current AP item/champ pool currently the way it is very little can currently be done in order to keep the the items balanced while expanding the AP gear pool without the risk of creating a metagolem or making all the gear relatively mediocre (like it is now).

The easiest way to alleviate some of this would probably be to give each ap classification a different set of stat priorities in what type of gear they function best with. Similar to how the AD fighters, slayers and marksmen work (all want AD to an extent. Fighters like having tanky items that help them lane. Slayers are divided based on how they fight, ArP,CDR,and item actives for survivability for the assassins. While the other generally uses higher flat AD items alongside a mix of CDR and flat stat defensive options because they are sitting in the thick of combat. Marksmen generally prefer AS and Crit to pump out consistent high dps and leech to sustain) Only this time they have a good bit more to be wary of because they would have to work around balancing some legacy stat scaling systems (such as AP being a damage modifier for most abilities) An example of a champion who would probably need to be watched would be Malphite

AhrisNov 19, 20171 votes

Ahri's passive is meh. Need to cast at least 3 fox fire which hits 9 times total to get the heal. If by that way, not really worth getting it over other utility and damage items unless you only want sustain during laning phase.

During Mage update I would like to see tank destroying items, make Mages have ability to fight bruisers and ADCs, allow Mages to have more sustain in their spells(spell vamp or something), and make Zhonyas more towards burst mages than mages in general(as they require going in close).

TehNACHONov 19, 20171 votes

Edited a letter. AdApting passives. We don't need to copy paste Ahri's Passive word for word, but a Passive heal for targets hit fills a missing sustain niche AP Itemization doesn't have too much of without breaking Vlad's combat potential.

Any more specific examples?

AhrisNov 19, 20172 votes

{quoted}

Edited a letter. AdApting passives. We don't need to copy paste Ahri's Passive word for word, but a Passive heal for targets hit fills a missing sustain niche AP Itemization doesn't have too much of without breaking Vlad's combat potential.

Any more specific examples?

I guess dfg would be great.

M00ndanc3Nov 19, 20171 votes

an ap item 3071 or item 3036 would be nice or perhaps a mana item that isnt item 3165 or item 3048

TehNACHONov 19, 20171 votes

item 3135 ? Or is there a more specific niche you want?

More mana options would be pretty great.

M00ndanc3Nov 19, 20171 votes

black clever and void staff are different tho, black clever is % armor shred and void staff is % magic pen. i would like a magic shred item that isnt this thing item 3091 (this isn't even for mages this is for like teemo, kayle, and azir and any adc that is feeling opressed by magic damage)

Taliyah RocksNov 19, 20171 votes

Personnaly i'd like a second build path for item 3136 , so you can build it into something else than item 3151

I feel like an alternative to item 3089 would be welcome. Similar to how item 3508 is an alternative to item 3031 , and how there's FOUR item 3086 and multiple lethality items.

...orrrrr the removal/rework of item 3089 . Many mages don't get their power spike until they've got their big hat, and it's rarely worth it to rush it first. Meanwhile every other class get their powerspike after one or two items coughcough

Now that they added item 2420 , they could buff Zhonya's base stats. Being full build with both item 3157 and item 3102 leaves you with very little AP.

The biggest issue is that mages sacrifice a lot of power to get their utility, meanwhile item 3147 item 3142 item 3814

BlacephalonNov 19, 20171 votes

gimme a AP version of item 3139 so i can have some counterplay to a Malzahar

NaqelNov 19, 20171 votes

-AP version of item 3094 , let's call it "Arcane Firecannon", to go along with Fleet Footwork. -A split of item 3151 and item 3165 mismatched functionalities: a new 20% CDR item, a specialist Grevious Wounds item, a specialist mana recovery item, a specialist flat penetration item, a specialist anti-bruiser item. -A new item 3145 upgrade, perhaps the aforementioned "Arcane Firecannon".

AirKingNeoNov 20, 20171 votes

Mages need items changed, but not total hard buffs. Just weak items made better, but their strongest items cut down too.

item 3057 20% AP ratio added to spellblade passive. Makes it decent to build early if you've got a bit of AP with it. item 3100 Spellblade passive AP ratio increased to 60%. Why is this item so terrible? item 3089 -400 gold cost, -10 AP. item 3010 Passive changed to restore 20% missing HP and 20% missing mana upon leveling up. Back to being a laning phase item. item 3027 Max AP increased to 110 (+5 per stack), Max Mana increased to 600 (+30 per stack), cost increased by 100 gold. (Catalyst changed inherited.) item 3030 Amp tome added to build path for smoothness, active cast time removed. (Catalyst change inherited.) item 3152 +150 cost, +10 AP. item 3070 +10% cooldown reduction, +100 gold cost. (Upgrades inherit.) Stacking now gives 2 + 5% ability mana cost for stacking. item 3003 Reworked: 60 AP, 10% CDR, 250 mana. Stacking now gives 3 + 7% ability mana cost for stacking. Other effects are the same. Builds from Blasting Wand instead of NLR, Amp Tome added to build path. Costs 2800 gold (665 combine cost). item 3004 +10% CDR from tear. Stacking now gives 5 per basic attack, or 2+5% ability mana cost. item 3802 -5 AP item 3165 -15 AP (reduced to 80 AP). item 3151 -10 AP. It's an anti-health stacking item for the purposes of stopping people who stack HP and little to no MR. item 3285 -200 cost, Amp tome added to build path for smoothness, passive AP ratio increased to 15%, passive deals +50% damage against minions. item 3116 +5 AP, +150 HP; Build Path: Blasting Want + Amp Tome + Giant's Belt; cost increased to 3000 gold. [Some New Item] item 1058 + item 3802 + 750 gold (2900 cost); 95 AP, 300 mana, 20 flat magic pen; Melee only; Active: Gain +80-170% movement speed for 1 second, Passive: Takedowns restore 10% missing health and mana.