Fizz is pretty disgusting

Fadedpf·Dec 18, 2014·60 votes·5,105 views

^^^ title.

Just 2 or 3 kills can get him rolling to buy his lich or hourglass. He is so safe and can 100 to zero at least 2 people in a fight. His hypercarry is probably one of the best in the game right now.

*** EDIT!! ***

Fizz might not be a "hypercarry" but he can sure delete your important team mates like support and ad/ap carry which will very much lose you the fight and the game as he constantly goes in exploding squishes. using his e to escape and be untouchable and using hourglass to be untouchable. Pretty disgusting and annoying champion

63 Comments

Goth ThotDec 18, 201424 votes

No, he doesn't even need lich or hourglass to 100 to 0 most non-tanks - I've found that 2 dorans rings and a sheen will suffice.

FadedpfDec 18, 20142 votes

Well yeah but his carry will be so real with he has a lich or hourglass

SouL1essDec 18, 201410 votes

Fizz isn't a hypercarry by any means though

FadedpfDec 18, 20145 votes

not true at all

redniwediSDec 18, 201420 votes

It kind of is true. Hypercarry is something completely different, where Fizz is just a fantastic assassin. It's similar, but different.

Brenticus12Dec 18, 20141 votes

I don't get it, isn't he a hyper carry? I've had so many varying definitions of hyper carry presented to me but what I've gathered is that they are champs that can carry a team by themselves if even slightly fed. Examples include Akali, Vayne, Trist, Yasuo, Trynd, Yi, LB, Nasus (If he is allowed to farm, which is unlikely if his entire team is feeding), Kassadin, Talon. I would add Fizz but it seems you guys disagree. I would also add Zed but he falls off pretty hard late game because his damage relies on sustained damage during his ult's proc making it hard for him to hyper carry.

WildlustDec 18, 20142 votes

The only champion I constantly saw people mention when reading up on hypercarries was Poppy.

The EllimiistDec 18, 20141 votes

{quoted}

The only champion I constantly saw people mention when reading up on hypercarries was Poppy.

Yah due to ulting a support and being completely invincible..

I Main SwainDec 19, 20141 votes

depends on the support, but generally yes

NarasimhaDec 18, 20144 votes

And not Vayne ? I'm surprised. Everyone else is moderately debatable, but you can't argue the status of those two.

The EllimiistDec 18, 20143 votes

Pretty much this. Except for leblanc who falls off later (hyper carry = lategame potential). I don't think fizz falls into this either as he is unlikely to be able to kill an entire team. He is more just a good assassin like zed.

SpecterVonBarenDec 18, 20146 votes

{quoted}

I don't get it, isn't he a hyper carry? I've had so many varying definitions of hyper carry presented to me but what I've gathered is that they are champs that can carry a team by themselves if even slightly fed. Examples include Akali, Vayne, Trist, Yasuo, Trynd, Yi, LB, Nasus (If he is allowed to farm, which is unlikely if his entire team is feeding), Kassadin, Talon. I would add Fizz but it seems you guys disagree. I would also add Zed but he falls off pretty hard late game because his damage relies on sustained damage during his ult's proc making it hard for him to hyper carry.

A hyper carry is a champ that can potentially kill an entire enemy team while doing most of the damage to them, even if their team was helping. So, like Tristana, if her entire team manages to cc or peel for her enough to keep her alive through a fight and allow her to get at the enemy team then her damage alone will be enough to kill the enemy team.

If that makes sense.

And this is why Fizz isn't a hyper carry. He's very good at killing targets, yes, but he's not capable of killing an entire team by himself because he's a burst assassin and has to wait for cooldowns before he can kill another person.

NinpireDec 18, 20142 votes

so that scratches out talon, akali, and kassadin right? i always thought the hypercarries were the ones that were mainly AA based, like kog, vayne, twitch, trist, yi, trynd, and yas (maybe nasus)

crippler38Dec 18, 20141 votes

everyone forgets Draven

Brenticus12Dec 19, 20142 votes

Draven is the only hypercarry we need.

crippler38Dec 19, 20142 votes

not to mention he shuts down almost every other hyper carry in the game early game and mid game he can generally kill them easily enough, honestly once you go draven nothing ever feels the same again

not a starburstDec 19, 20142 votes

Hypercarries include: . These champions can deal out enough damage on their own to melt an entire team over the course of a teamfight. However, with the exception of Trynd (ult op lol), these champions are fairly fragile: if they fail to burst key targets or get CC'd, they will die almost instantly.

Carries are champions that can win teamfights for you. All ADC's fall under this, all mages fall under this, all assassins fall under this, and most bruisers fall under this. Tanks and supports are more utility champions instead of raw damage champions and therefore do not fall under this category. They can deal enough damage and kill enough people to win the fight alone, but they can't kill everybody.

Fizz is a carry champion, but not a hypercarry. He can burst down a squishy or two and probably get out alive, but he can't win against the entire enemy team with minimal backup.

BudupopsDec 19, 20145 votes

"cooldowns"

Rew711Dec 18, 20142 votes

He may not be a hyper carry, but his damage and speed out match Kassadin and his E is worse than Teemo's passive.

serpensortia1Dec 19, 20141 votes

Teemo's passive takes 2 seconds of standing still to activate and doesn't avoid AoE or skillshots. Sure it's great for ambushes, but you can't really compare the two of them.

I Main SwainDec 19, 20141 votes

I think he was confused and meant to compare Fizz w to Teemo e? That would make more sense based on the context of his statement.

His point is somewhat debatable however if this is what he meant. Do you include teemo's on hit and the dot or just the dot when comparing the two? and how much missing health do they have since fizz w scales off that? Also how much AP are we talking about. It gets a little hairy I guess is my point there

Rew711Dec 19, 20141 votes

Fizz's E allows him to avoid any damage or attack on him, and leaps to a place away from where he was to also deal damage. (This is great for catching fast moving champions.) Teemo use to be in-targetable when invisible but now, only turns invisible with a small AS bonus. It's great for surprise attacks, but not as powerful as Fizz.

jv21blU7oDDec 18, 20146 votes

He is fucking obnoxious and I usually ban him.

metaworldpeace10Dec 18, 20144 votes

I would put Fizz under the category of "hyper snowballer"

MannysmokerDec 18, 20144 votes

If people play Swain .. or Darius in mid he wouldn't be able to snowball or buy this item in vs him item 3027 it will give you enough sustain and tankiness to fight him.

PhoenixOfHeavenDec 19, 20141 votes

Dar I don't get how, but Swain definitely. right when he jumps on u you ult or use W. He dosnt stand a chance.

but you MUST use Swain to kill him, and very few even do.

MannysmokerDec 19, 20141 votes

i played a Darius vs Fizz mid and he was so afraid to even get close to minions, cuz Fizz is mega squishy and and melee. is really easy to bait a his E, simply pretend you're going agro or show some fear and the player will try to jump on you then you can abuse him by that.

serpensortia1Dec 19, 20141 votes

Also Lissandra Ryze Once he gets close you root him and he can't Q or E, then you walk away or burst him down.

TrumpetDec 18, 20144 votes

I don't play fizz anymore (played a lot of him when he first came out), and I have a few of tips that can help you counter him.

Auto-Attack him in lane (if you are ranged). A lot of mid-laners seem to forget that their autos can really add up in terms of damage. Especially when it is ranged vs. melee.
Poke, poke, poke. Fizz loves all-in engages, poke him so that he is under half most of the time and force him to choose between cs and getting harassed hard with spells and autos for the first few waves.
Do whatever you can to stay above 1/2 HP. If you fight him when you are below half / he engages when you are below half, you will die or blow a summoner spell.
Ward and ping and type in chat when he roams, and then shove the wave and follow after him if you can. (if you followed the first 3 steps he has to roam)
If you see the fizz pick on the enemy team go for Orianna, Lulu, or Morgana (fizz hates shields)

Congrats, Fizz is now successfully countered.

Edit: a good example of step 1 is an LCS match of Pobelter vs. Bjrgson the autos really added up and let Bjrg take the lane.

SilmarilDec 19, 20142 votes

{quoted}

I don't play fizz anymore (played a lot of him when he first came out), and I have a few of tips that can help you counter him.

Auto-Attack him in lane (if you are ranged). A lot of mid-laners seem to forget that their autos can really add up in terms of damage. Especially when it is ranged vs. melee.

Poke, poke, poke. Fizz loves all-in engages, poke him so that he is under half most of the time and force him to choose between cs and getting harassed hard with spells and autos for the first few waves.

Do whatever you can to stay above 1/2 HP. If you fight him when you are below half / he engages when you are below half, you will die or blow a summoner spell.

Ward and ping and type in chat when he roams, and then shove the wave and follow after him if you can. (if you followed the first 3 steps he has to roam)

If you see the fizz pick on the enemy team go for Orianna, Lulu, or Morgana (fizz hates shields)

Congrats, Fizz is now successfully countered.

Edit: a good example of step 1 is an LCS match of Pobelter vs. Bjrgson the autos really added up and let Bjrg take the lane.

To be honest, most of the time that doesn't work (it's not just Fizz, most assassins work this way, though Fizz is far more annoying than the rest of them). You can poke him out of lane, spam pings when he he roams, ward everything, be up 60 cs at 10 minutes, basically just completely shut him down, and then your bot lane will feed him a double kill regardless, or your jungler will get caught in a stupid invade and feed him double buffs and a kill, or their team just starts roaming and camping mid to get him rolling, keeping a good Fizz down is incredibly difficult.

The majority of the problem with him is just how insanely hard he spikes when he gets his item 3100 , facing a Fizz with just a LB feels like facing an Akali with 3 items sometimes, which is why it feels so hard to truly shut him down, he's still extremely effective on low gold, to a much greater extent than most other assassins, imo. I mean, I've played games where Fizz was dc'ed for 10 minutes, and the moment he got his LB, he was still out-damaging everyone else in the game.

The other point about him that's annoying and, quite honestly, overbearing to deal with is his late-game where he can E>Zhonya's>E and basically be invulnerable for like 10 years.

To be honest, I don't really even think he's OP. Bad Fizz's are laughably easy to beat, and even the good ones aren't anything special, he's just insanely annoying, to the point where I would say most of my losses to him are more from me tilting and playing awful from getting pissed off instead of him actually being too strong.

SelflessTeammateDec 18, 20144 votes

Fizz only becomes truly problematic once he gets his Hourglass. That can make things frustrating. Can't even target him when he's doing that leap thing (which you totally should be able to, I mean even Nocturne can be hit during his ult). In team fights, you generally attack the squishier targets first, any of the AP-based assassins and supports and the like. Fizz is unique in that regard in that he's not a valid target.

I can deal with the fact that he does absurd amounts of damage, that in itself isn't a problem because he's pretty low on defense. But giving him an Hourglass plus his normal dodge move is a little too much.

That's why he's such a common ban in any mode in which he can be banned. Akali and Katarina are very similar for almost the same reason, but the difference is that you can hit them during their skills, for the most part, so they don't bother me at all.

Of course, it's rare that anyone in Silver gets item 3102 , or any defensive items at all, which would do pretty damned well to help them out. But Fizz' invincibility during his skills is kinda a bit much.

The WhamboozlerDec 19, 20144 votes

Hyper-carry or not, the little fish is complete cancer. He's obnoxious to fight, snowballs hard and utterly ruins games once he gets going... which is VERY hard to stop him from doing. He blows up squishies with easy and is incredibly hard to keep at bay if he wants in, or keep locked down if he wants out. He's a humungous pain in the butt that's never been fun to play against. Can we stop arguing what the definition is of a made-up term for the game and talk more about the topic of the post... Fizz being disgusting.

FadedpfDec 19, 20141 votes

This

Leti the YetiDec 18, 20143 votes

he's some of the best assassins in game

JunkοDec 18, 20143 votes

His hypercarry is probably one of the best in the game right now.

Haha no. He is annoying but def not a hyper carry, or close to it

redniwediSDec 18, 20142 votes

Rush Tiamat and Spirit Visage on Rek'Sai mid and Fizz will cry. There's other counters, but I've found this to be the easiest.

HowldoomDec 18, 20142 votes

"Fizz is pretty disgusting".

This? After the Velkoz fiasco?

juaumzitusDec 18, 20142 votes

If you pick Orianna or Syndra and rush grail against Fizz, of course you will be raped, same with Zed, learn how to build properly.

DiostukosDec 18, 20142 votes

{quoted}

If you pick Orianna or Syndra and rush grail against Fizz, of course you will be raped, same with Zed, learn how to build properly.

What would you recommend as those two?....

Grail offers magic resist, cdr, and ap. Rushing something like a Banshee's Veil would be stupid.

TheKingDodoDec 19, 20142 votes

Fizz can use some extra soy sauce and wasabi Not exactly disgusting... but not the freshest sushi in the sea

AmightyTDec 19, 20142 votes

I wouldnt hat fizz if I could at least shut him down, not matter how hard you fight, even if you go legendary on fizz , 2 kills and you cant even think about fighting him.

SnarflazDec 19, 20142 votes

Fizz E is sort of like shunpo, but shunpo if you want to escape you need a ward or maybe a minion near you, Kat and fizz are both disgusting.

TheUntitledKingDec 19, 20142 votes

Fizz is a pubstomper. A good Fizz will use Fizz's tricks well, but what makes Fizz good is that people don't play properly against him (I'm guilty of this too from time to time so I'm not trying to sound high-and-mighty). The thing about Fizz in teamfights is either lock him down with cc from the start or wait for his abilities to be used while at the same time keeping your AP/ADC away from him. Only when his cooldowns are down should it be safe for the carry's to get in range of him. He - like many other soloq Assassins - suffer against coordinated teams. He's also got poor(ish) waveclear. So a fed Fizz can't push towers as much as...a fed Yi, for example. All a fed Fizz can do is get more fed, so all you have to do is keep eyes on him and stay away from him while pushing harder than his team.

He's manageable, but it does take a fair amount of knowledge and skill from the players to do that. And he's not even the worst offender of Assassin-class toxicity.

Colgate MinuetteDec 19, 20142 votes

Just play TF into him and use your gold card every time he finishes his W. (Also, realize that dodging skillshots including his ult is possible, so just take one freaking step to the side and there goes half his damage.

Earlier today I was going through major FPS lag issues (See my forum post on it) Because you know, rito won't fix their damn game yet. And I still managed to 1v1 kill the enemy fizz who was 5 levels above me. (I didn't have ult) By simply dodging his ult, flashing away from his W when he landed on me then turning around and gold carding him. (Followed by the rest of the auto attacks needed to kill him)

He's very easy to kill, you just have to MOVE OUT OF THE WAY.

I Main SwainDec 19, 20142 votes

I think you mean his E, his W is the auto attack buff which gives passive dot and an active increasing his auto damage based on ap. His E is his ability where he become untargetable, gap closes, and does damage on landing

iIIuminationDec 19, 20141 votes

I've been bitching about Fizz for over a year and everyone told me 'he's easy to counter, he's not that bad', yet he hasn't been buffed, the game hasn't changed that much, and now everyone bans and cries about him. Why is it that everyone laughs at you when you call something OP and then a few months later cries about it more than you did? You can go 0/10 early game and still end up wrecking everyone later. Fizz takes 0 skill and 0 awareness because he can just pole away from spells and ganks. Other assassins have weaknesses, what's Fizz's?

GLWuffieDec 19, 20142 votes

Fizz's weaknesses: melee, mana hungry, ap-based, squishy, and no sustain.

So what can counter him: ranged champs, non-mana-based champions, Magic Resist, Tankiness/High Damage Burst (w/ CC), and AD/Lifesteal.

~GL

SnarflazDec 19, 20142 votes

A fizz can burst the crap out of any ADC. I tried it on lucian.

GLWuffieDec 19, 20141 votes

I forgot to note though that his strength is to basically delete other squishies. ADCs are usually a top priority for an assassin since they usually build pure damage and no MR/Health. If anyone is gonna be a primary target it's gonna be the ADC usually.

It's up to the laner against Fizz to do his job and prevent Fizz from getting a head start. I see it like this:

ADCs are meant to do great damage with autos, which works good against champs, and GREAT for objectives. Assassins are meant to do quick great damage with abilities, which works GREAT against champs. Mages are meant to have a lot of control, which works GREAT against other champs.

Tanks are meant to have a ton of defenses in general, which hurts Assassins the most since they usually rely on a full burst from all their abilities. If they can't burst you, they're sitting ducks because of cooldown/mana (for those applied).

In short, if you build some resistances, then you counter Fizz, otherwise, he counters you.

~GL