How is high damage, High mobility....

GigglesO·Jun 20, 2018·23 votes·8,971 views

considered to be the epitome of skill expression? How is it that these champs also have damage reduction on skill click? Which makes them tankier than they should be... How are we still supporting a oneshot meta?

Its all just shit. I tried to play a few games with silver friends, and the games are fucking boring, noone does anything on either team because they are too afraid of getting one shot. Then when someone does do something you go either 10000000/0 or 0/10000000 because there is no stalling out the game, there is no defending while behind, and there is no farming minions if you have the shittier champ.

We need Morello and his nerfs back.

20 Comments

AzadetheJun 20, 201815 votes

My only problem with these champs is 90% of players don't respect them and someone always forgets they exist, dives blind bushes, and dies, snowballing them.

So even if you are playing well.... and can manage to set up their deaths...... your team doesn't. Your team feeds, and then suddenly you're no longer a counter.

HayaishiJun 20, 20181 votes

{quoted}

My only problem with these champs is 90% of players don't respect them and someone always forgets they exist, dives blind bushes, and dies, snowballing them.

So even if you are playing well.... and can manage to set up their deaths...... your team doesn't. Your team feeds, and then suddenly you're no longer a counter.

Because respecting most of these champs is pretty much sitting at tower.

Play a game against Talon as a mage? You are not even safe under your tower and you will miss a bunch of CS because Talon outpushes 90% of mages nowdays with just Rake.

flibitydooJun 20, 201815 votes

Are you prepared to lube up when rito games finally reworks Akali and you can be enlightened on what true ~~mobility and stealth out the wazoo~~ skill is?

Daddy AntsJun 20, 20186 votes

{quoted}

Are you prepared to lube up when rito games finally reworks and you can be enlightened on what true ~~mobility and stealth out the wazoo~~ skill is?

Well she is being reworked by CertainlyT himself.

The guy who brought you Zoe Yasuo Thresh

So we can be 100% sure Akali is going to be grossly overloaded and grossly over tuned resulting in perm ban status.

LeetriJun 20, 20182 votes

Yeah, Warwick was grossly overloaded and grossly over tuned and perm ban status after CertainlyT reworked him...

Daddy AntsJun 20, 20183 votes

{quoted}

Yeah, Warwick was grossly overloaded and grossly over tuned and perm ban status after CertainlyT reworked him...

I'll give him credit for that one.

The only release/rework of his that wasn't overloaded/overtuned af.

Yasuo's kit is overloaded. (I wouldn't call him over tuned) Thresh's kit is overloaded. (Not over tuned though)

Zoe's kit is overloaded and a bit on the strong side.

Warwick was probably the best update he's done.

JoeMGJun 20, 20182 votes

{quoted}

Well she is being reworked by CertainlyT himself.

The guy who brought you

So we can be 100% sure Akali is going to be grossly overloaded and grossly over tuned resulting in perm ban status.

Honestly, her kit is so toxic now I'd actually be impressed if CT managed to break her even more.

Jaygo41Jun 21, 20181 votes

Zoe is a literal offense to the game. Horrendous design and extremely frustrating to play against. Thresh remains the true expression of skill at the support position.

Yasuo... please delete

RalanrJun 20, 20183 votes

I blame anime and their animation budgets.

“Why block when you can dodge.” Feels like the code of a lot of “high skill” characters in fiction, which ends up translating over into games that reward reflexes more than things like planning (those this depends on the game as well).

remakoroJun 20, 20182 votes

I think thats actually pretty common philosophy for most things. In most cases evading stuff is simpler, less taxing and more advantageous than stopping/blocking it head on.

Fondling GemsJun 20, 20182 votes

Agreed, I mean look at fencing, a fighting style that completely revolves around the idea of brushing attacks aside rather than blocking the blow head on. Even shields weren't used to block blows head on but to deflect the attack at an angle. Battles are about endurance just as much as skill, and anything a fighter can do to reduce the strain on themselves is a big boost to their chances of survival.

Not saying that Ralanar doesn't have a point. In fact in a lot of ways I think he hit the nail on the head. Animation/Anime is definitely a big part of what lead to the current idealization of fantasy warfare. If you look at how the public previously viewed such things (Knights defending with words like stalwart and guardian commonly being used) and even in a lot of old fantasy movies with armies clashing shields together the public's idea of what skill looks like in battle has drastically changed.

Now I agree with you and think that in a lot of ways Anime had it right, dodging is better, although do to how much easier it was to animate I wont claim that there wasn't a bias there. Anyways, I think anime started off on the right foot, but do to the tendency to push things to extremes it is a big part of what led to the public's view of battle shifting fairly significantly.

TLDR

I think you are both right, dodging is a major part of skillful combat that wasn't previously appreciated. However Anime/Animation took it to extremes and is what changed the public's idea of what skillful combat looks like, pushing it far beyond reality.

DuskDaUmbreonJun 20, 20182 votes

It's not because they're high mobility and damage. It's because the damage and mobility are hard to utilize well (Say, Azir), or the high mobility is the only way you reasonably stay alive (Such as Yasuo, as his W isn't going to keep you alive forever).

Yi is considered high-skill because of smaller, yet still very important, mechanics. Irelia is the same way.

I should mention that their damage reduction abilities also both lock them in place.

eaglei3Jun 20, 20183 votes

{quoted}

I should mention that their damage reduction abilities also both lock them in place.

Thank God they self CC themselves to give me a chance to say my final thoughts and prayers.

GigglesOJun 20, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Yi is considered high-skill because of smaller, yet still very important, mechanics. Irelia is the same way.

Please list said mechanics?

Nea104Jun 20, 20182 votes

Camille

Don't forget sustain and even tankiness ( take a look at the "Self mitigated damage" of Yasuo )

GigglesOJun 20, 20181 votes

No we wouldn't want to forget about that. People call morde broken for standing there and attacking, but they forget that if you don't get into melee morde doesn't win shit.

PhearBunnyJun 20, 20182 votes

Skill is Zeds Q doing more damage than every other assassins entire kit.

GigglesOJun 20, 20182 votes

[zombie-brand-mindblown]

Aatrox EichmannJun 21, 20181 votes

yi right now is powerful but thats attributed to the fact that riot didnt see the synergy between champs like kayle and taric have with Yi, but irelia is just fucking horseshit

Andrey0345Jun 21, 20181 votes

Yi's "damage reduction" makes him insanely vulnerable, he can't do anything and it gets interrupted by any cc as it's a channel. It doesn't make him any tanky, you just interrupt it or don't waste skills while he's meditating and that's it. Idk about Irelia but Yi's W is pretty useless, even though it helps with things like aa-reset or blocking dmg off some high damage spell like Veigar R, you can't call him tanky because of it.