Seriously, I understand it wasnt that good on most AP based junglers, but some really did good with the item and even got a great boost from it. Why do you have to DELETE Runeglaivefor the new one? Just KEEP BOTH! Hell, AD Champs get 2 options, why not APs? Why force all APs to get the same item, which will leave some in the dust no matter what you do, because not all AP Champions work the same way.
Lauricella312 votesrito knows what they are doing said noone ever
Jungle Lux God8 votesThe reason Runeglaive is getting removed is because there's no difference in keeping it or removing it because you wouldn't pick it anyways.
Dominick Destine3 votesThe reason Runeglaive is getting removed is because there's no difference in keeping it or removing it because you wouldn't pick it anyways.
+1
Meep Man1 votesTrue, most AP champions are going to be using a spell before a basic attack anyway. Even Nidalee and Elise usually use a spell on their enemy before attacking or would benefit more from a Luden's proc than attack proc.
Grashnim4 votesRuneglaive is trash. Thank goodness, replace it with something meaningful.
undesirable team4 votesDamnit rito, you're breaking Garen, first Mana Pots, now Runeglaive?!?!? :( 
ARequestOfDeath6 votesno you are wrong. when they 1st crippled garen was when they removed dfg
Big Lincoln4 votesbecause people have deluded themselves into thinking that runeglaive is somehow bad when 2 of the best junglers in the game (and the meta AP junglers) abuse the shit out of it
it's a cheaper lich bane that's more effective until you get AP items and it works great on more than just AP junglers, unlike runic echoes which will only be available to them. that's what i call diversity
ProfDrDeath3 votesRuneglaive used to have a real advantage over Lichbane, due to the presence of CdR on the item. However, with Sheen being changed to give mana/CdR, meaning that all its upgrades have CdR, as well, Runeglaive is simply inferior to Lichbane (not to mention that RG was changed to give less AP despite being more expensive in the preseason).
Now, I am not saying that the replacement item is good or healthy for the game yet - 10% MS on a jungler's rush item has serious potential to warp the whole jungle environment (and not for the better, I might add). Imagine that on Nidalee, for instance...I shudder.
Jbels1 votesRuneglaive used to have a real advantage over Lichbane, due to the presence of CdR on the item. However, with Sheen being changed to give mana/CdR, meaning that all its upgrades have CdR, as well, Runeglaive is simply inferior to Lichbane (not to mention that RG was changed to give less AP despite being more expensive in the preseason).
Now, I am not saying that the replacement item is good or healthy for the game yet - 10% MS on a jungler's rush item has serious potential to warp the whole jungle environment (and not for the better, I might add). Imagine that on Nidalee, for instance...I shudder.
Then again, most junglers can't seem to get their fully enchanted jungle item until at least 12 minutes into the game unless they are just getting off successful gank after successful gank while finding the time to not fall behind in farm as well
l Helios l2 votesWell Runeglaive negated any sheen items, so no lich bane, no tri force, no iceborn. That can hurt some champions, mainly in reference to a lich bane on Fizz, Ekko, and a few others. Iceborn has great overall utility and isn't a bad item on some junglers.
So probably the main reason is Runeglaive would essentially negate the purchase of other items. Sure you may not build some of those items on most junglers, but you have to factor in build diversity and junk.
That's just my take on it. Plus it will fit all junglers better than Runeglaive did.
Jbels4 votesWell Runeglaive negated any sheen items, so no lich bane, no tri force, no iceborn. That can hurt some champions, mainly in reference to a lich bane on Fizz, Ekko, and a few others. Iceborn has great overall utility and isn't a bad item on some junglers.
So probably the main reason is Runeglaive would essentially negate the purchase of other items. Sure you may not build some of those items on most junglers, but you have to factor in build diversity and junk.
That's just my take on it. Plus it will fit all junglers better than Runeglaive did.
Pretty much this. The new jungle item won't allow you to build Luden's, which is a better trade-off than not getting to build IBG or Lichbane, which give CDR (Something mages don't even seem capable of maxing out today)
l Helios l3 votesMost junglers never build luden's anyway. Maybe Ekko if you really wanted that AP and movespeed. Maybe a Fiddle. Not much else.
Mirai Ko6 votesI think we're missing the point of the post a bit. It's not whether or not Runeglaive is good, or if the new jungle item is better. The question is, why isn't it possible for both enchantments to be in the game at the same time? Why is it that only 1 AP focused enchantment can exist? Runeglaive might not be the best item, and the new jungle item will see far more and better use, but is there a reason we can't still have the option of Runeglaive? Or while we're at it, the option of Magus as well (for those of us who remember the Magus enchant)?
l Helios l1 votesLet me answer this with a question: why keep an item no one is going to buy? If other items are better, what's the purpose in leaving it in game?
The problem with saying AD Champs get 2 enchantments is that the two items are completely different. Attack speed is only good in certain scenarios, while armor pen is also only good in certain scenarios. Runeglaive would never be good if Echos was introduced as Echos is superior.
Steven Mcburn2 votesI'd buy it on jungle malphite 10/10 games.
Can't think of any other instance, but if even one exists and it's rarely bought why take it out just because it's rarely bought?
l Helios l1 votesDo you not think that's a waste though? I do.
PalPlays3 votesHey, uh, Elise just called, and said that she'd buy Runeglaive if it was kept in the game.
Ayame Isaki2 votes
Hello. The removal of Runeglaive is an AP Eve nerf.
l Helios l1 votesLich bane is still better on her than a runeglaive.
Ayame Isaki1 votesBut what do you sacrifice to get it? The beauty of Runeglaive is the on-hit and jungle item in the same slot; for Eve it is very slot efficient. Eve never builds Luden's unless stupid ahead and building glass cannon (and even then, there are better choices for the Widowmaker). So now her jungle item becomes slot inefficient since the proc is not that great on her and she has to sacrifice another slot for Lich Bane (which might not even be worth it).
Regardless of how you slice it, Eve loses out on these changes. Runeglaive coupled with on-hit effect buff to her E brought Eve out of the gutter. This change very well might drop her right back into it.
I also think that Elise might be hurt by this as well. I just picked her up so I don't have much experience with her yet (haven't played her since she was last in the free rotation), but I do know she has good synergy with Runeglaive.
I'm really not sure who aside from Fiddlesticks really likes the new item. I feel like for most AP junglers this is trading a fairly poor choice for a slightly less poor choice. For Eve and Elise, it's trading a slot efficient item (with good early game power) for trash.
I honestly think they should either keep Runeglaive and the new item (just like AD has Warrior and Devourer), or keep Runeglaive and bring back Magus.
l Helios l2 votesIt's a little early to be able to tell what is going to happen, but I haven't heard anyone say that Elise is trash just yet. Might better hang on and see what comes of this. Honestly though, if it does hurt some champions too bad, there will be some compensation for it. Eve will likely receive some attention if it hurts her too bad since she is a little on the weaker side right now.
Here's kind of how I see it breaking down when introduced:
Ekko: probably not gonna be hurt too bad Elise: hurts her camp clear some, but she can compensate with other items Evelynn: probably stands to lose the most - hurts her clear some, but her Q should be fine as it is since her clear at that point isn't that bad. Losing the free sheen will hurt prob, but her damage is still good outside of that. All it removes is the instakill potential with her spamming Q. Considering she can be anywhere unless you have a pink, that's not too bad. Malphite: go cinderhulk. It's just better. If you wanted the sheen procs, do iceborn since it helps you stick and gives you the armor. Fizz: just get lich bane like lane fizz. Same principle since your clear wasn't bad to start with. Diana: same as Fizz. Zac: just get cinderhulk.
I don't really know who else would ever build runeglaive, but that's my opinion on everyone. Eve stands to lose the most, but I think it won't be too awful.
Ayame Isaki1 votesElise: hurts her camp clear some, but she can compensate with other items Evelynn: probably stands to lose the most - hurts her clear some, but her Q should be fine as it is since her clear at that point isn't that bad. Losing the free sheen will hurt prob, but her damage is still good outside of that. All it removes is the instakill potential with her
Regardless of whether or not other items can be utilized to offset the reduced power brought on by this item change, those items will still be bought after completing the jungle item; this changes the entire power growth curve for these champions. It also requires the champions to utilize item slots to make up for the lost power, which means that they have to sacrifice something else. What should Eve sacrifice to get Lich Bane? What should Elise sacrifice to make up her lost power?
The hardest part about this from an Eve perspective is balance; right now (as you pointed out) she is viable but not amazing (which is probably the best we can hope for without the community calling for her blood). This item change will necessitate buffs to her kit (or nerf removals).
They could slightly buff her Q (you will recall in 5.7 her Q was buffed, but in 5.14 it was nerfed to lower values than pre-5.7, so maybe bring it back to pre-5.7 levels). Maybe couple that with a partial revert of the W nerf (maybe 20 or 30 mana instead of 40, still costs more than a hate-spike and less than a ravage). I really don't know what the best approach here would be.
l Helios l1 votesThat's definitely a fair assessment, but I don't think letting someone like Elise lose late game damage is bad personally. Elise for the longest time was a utility tank with some OK damage, at least that's how I remember season 4. And it wasn't really runeglaive that brought her into the meta alone, it was that along with several buffs and changes. Personally, iceborn wouldn't be bad since it can help with utility aspect plus with tank stats and CDR, which are always nice.
Eve will be hurt by this, but I think we need to hold on to see what actually happens on live. I mean, Eve hasn't been declared useless just yet by PBE folks, so I think we may be OK for now. Plus the reason why Eve was always so stupid was her pseudotankyness with her Ult along with the high gank potential. I don't think it was runeglaive alone that facilitated her return to the meta.
LaughingMan112 voteswhere is the reference that shows Runglaive being removed, i havent seen anything, i may have missed it in a previous patch b/c i havent tried building it for a while, and whats the new item?
ShatoSummoner1 votesIt's on the PBE. New item is called Runic Echo and is basically luden's with 80 (+10% AP) damage.
LaughingMan111 votesAh alright, so a baby ludens, are you able to stack ludens and runic, or is it a unique effect?
ShatoSummoner1 votesWith the mana restoration of runeglaive. As for whether or not it stacks, the wording on the Unique Passive text implies that it can stack, but I haven't gotten on to test it myself.
PrinceOfStorms1 votesNo, they cannot be stacked, as both have the "Echo" unique passive.
PalPlays1 votesCheck out this site! It shows all the PBE content and is one of the biggest League sites to date! http://www.surrenderat20.net/
There, now you don't have to ask such questions.
LaughingMan111 votesI check the PBE a lot actually, like i said, its possible i just missed it.
PalPlays1 votesOkay, just making sure you were aware of that great website. Have a nice evening!
LaughingMan111 votesYeah its appreciated, thanks for the consideration.
LegacyDAP2 votesRuneglaive is the most shit item I've ever seen, because lichbane is like a billion times better, and all runeglaive did was make it so you couldn't buy lichbane.
Erockandroll2 votesRuneglaive is the most shit item I've ever seen, because lichbane is like a billion times better, and all runeglaive did was make it so you couldn't buy lichbane.
Something tells me it could have been something, if it weren't for the abuse cases. Which is all the more reason for riot to find an item that is way more transparent, and helps a larger group of mages Jungle.
LegacyDAP1 votesYup, this exactly.
magic pole2 votes
"just keep both"
RIP magus
ha ha ha...i think ill let you suffer for a while
dangopee1 votesWhen will people realize that runeglaive is a garbage item and all you do is put yourself behind when you complete it unless you are some extremely mana reliant champion?
Maximum Morde1 votesCause Runeglaive sucked anyway compared to getting an actual Sheen item.
ModKnightsKemplar1 votesWhen Riot has addressed similar questions before (why can't we keep X even though we are getting Y, specifically with items), the answer is that they don't want to clog the space. It becomes a clarity issue, especially for new players, about which thing they should get.
Cindikle1 votesTo be fair, there is only 1 AD item.
Sated isn't AD. Both tanky champions and AP's also pick it up.
There's a tank, AD, on hit and AP item.
The new item is overall better. It's more flexible. Some champions may prefer Runeglave, but not by much. If they're really hit that hard, adjustments can be made to the champion. But I doubt it'll be that bad that we'll see large drops in win rates.
After this change, we just need a 20% CDR AP item that isn't a mana regen item and we'll be fine.
TotalJerk1 votesFuck Runeglaive; that asshole killed Magus.
FlashnFuse1 votesI feel like runeglaive and this new item fulfill reaaaally different needs for ap junglers. I think it would be nice to keep both. The dianas, nidalees, and other lichbane lovers can keep runeglaive for the power it brings and the other ap junglers that don't care for the sheen proc as much can get this new one.
SithesisLord1 votesWelp. Back to 
i guess.
Randomonium1 votesGive it a shot. I was worried that Runic Echoes wouldn't be good on champions like Diana but after playing on the PBE I'm very happy with it.
What champions do you think Runeglaive is superior on?
killd0zer1 votesBecause it's clunky to keep in items that are bad.
If we kept every shit item we'd have 200 items
Celeste Benal1 votesIf I'm not mistaken, champion mana regen got buffed with the other jungle changes. So... yeah. They pretty much changed it back to an AP item, with a quick burst of mana regen on echo effect. Too bad that at that point, you don't really need it.
