Nerf Graves

Secretlolz·Feb 4, 2016·39 votes·1,576 views

Make him easier to kill or give him less damage.

He shouldnt be inmune to both.

15 Comments

qetzelFeb 4, 20166 votes

He is getting nerfed. Check the PBE.

Dextix LTFeb 4, 20162 votes

You call that a nerf?

qetzelFeb 4, 20164 votes

Base damage nerfs on the ability you max first are more significant than they appear. One example is Veigar. 20 damage on W and 30 on Q (scaling from 10) took his win rate down by ~3% Vayne's winrate dropped by ~2% when she lost 5AD. This is slightly different, as it isn't an ability, but the reason for the large drop in win rate is the same; Early nerfs can have really big effects.

MunchCrunchLunchFeb 4, 20163 votes

{quoted}

Base damage nerfs on the ability you max first are more significant than they appear. One example is Veigar. 20 damage on W and 30 on Q (scaling from 10) took his win rate down by ~3% Vayne's winrate dropped by ~2% when she lost 5AD. This is slightly different, as it isn't an ability, but the reason for the large drop in win rate is the same; Early nerfs can have really big effects.

thats really though. on the large scale of many games. rather than the single experience. i mean even after nerfs rengar is still one shotting people. will his winrate go down. probably. but hes still not fun to play against

qetzelFeb 4, 20161 votes

That is true, but Graves is about more than just one-shotting people without time to react - unlike Rengar. Counterplay to Rengar's burst is vision. If Rengar is near you and you do not know it, you will probably die (If he is ahead enough to burst you, that is). You can also stay with your team, so at least Rengar will die when he jumps in. Counter play to Graves' burst is vision, disengage (he can't jump at you from stealth and stun you) dodging and more (for example, staying away from a wall when you know he is nearby).

Because there is more counterplay, Grave's being able to oneshot you should feel fine in the majority of games because you can do something in the moment. The reason it isn't fine at the moment is because a) If his Q hits a wall, you are boned b) His burst is high enough that you can dodge a lot and still die. The nerfs on the PBE should make Q possible to cope with and let you survive through his mistakes. This should lower the frustration when playing against him even if he is ahead. Compare that with Rengar who is still just as frustrating when he works - he just works less well now.

LiziLOLFeb 5, 20161 votes

{quoted}

thats really though. on the large scale of many games. rather than the single experience. i mean even after nerfs rengar is still one shotting people. will his winrate go down. probably. but hes still not fun to play against

rengar now is straight up the worst jungler and just slightly better than shen jungle and shen isnt supposed to be played in the jungle anyway

SeenanFeb 4, 20165 votes

Only quarrel is how he can burst like a Veigar upclose and still be a decent adc afar. AND he gets defensive steroids. Like why? I remember buying just a JG Warrior enchantment and a BFS and my close-hits on creeps were hitting up to the 500s. The hell? (or maybe those were crits, but still)

AzteryzFeb 4, 20161 votes

from afar? you meann his 425 range? literally the lowest auto range in the game and the only person who has lower range but doesnt even technically count is gnar at level 1 (but he gets range per level)

A Prop PhoneFeb 4, 20163 votes

His damage is insane. The reloading mechanic isn't really a down fall when it hurts so much.

stealthfox94Feb 4, 20163 votes

Getting nerfed next patch, Q won't be a double nuke anymore.

SecretlolzFeb 4, 20164 votes

Well, while a nerf is great they aren't fixing the real problem yet.

He's labeled as a Marskman. But he isn't squishy, nor needs to be ranged, nor needs to build Crit. He only needs AD and dash in your face to deal the same damage Talon or Zed can do. If he's going to be labeled as a Marskman, he should atleast have similar weakness to all.

Look at Sivir, She has short range, but not because of that she was given infinite AD scaling the closer her target gets.

MunchCrunchLunchFeb 4, 20164 votes

{quoted}

Well, while a nerf is great they aren't fixing the real problem yet.

He's labeled as a Marskman. But he isn't squishy, nor needs to be ranged, nor needs to build Crit. He only needs AD and dash in your face to deal the same damage Talon or Zed can do. If he's going to be labeled as a Marskman, he should atleast have similar weakness to all.

Look at Sivir, She has short range, but not because of that she was given infinite AD scaling the closer her target gets.

meanwhile hes way tankier than either. and he can outdps talon and zed. and his attacks are just all AOE including his basic attacks

stealthfox94Feb 4, 20162 votes

He's supposed to be a marksman/bruiser hybrid, the nerf will make sure he no longer nukes people from long range. He's not supposed to be squishy.

AzteryzFeb 4, 20161 votes

graves has shorter range and plus hes supposed to be the tankiest adc even his lore allows that

but his tankiness is something you need to work on

now that his e buff duration doesnt reset on minion attacks he needs to actually be either hitting a champ or a turret which is also hard to do cause of his range