Why not have Cull grant a significant amount of OnHit damage against Minions?

Rebonack·Nov 24, 2015·14 votes·537 views

It's supposed to be the farming item, right? As opposed to Doren's Blade, which is more of a generalist starting AD item.

14 Comments

junglerboy16Nov 25, 20153 votes

Maybe give it some sort of execute functionality? Like "minions below 20% HP are executed by auto attacks. Does not apply to monsters"

Most ADCs are already close to that threshold anyway, so just giving them that little extra could be a nice help for the item to offer. For other lanes it might be a bit more noticable (I'm thinking mages in particular, who generally struggle to last hit with AAs), but the item isn't all that appealing to most other lanes anyway, so I don't see how this would hurt too much.

RebonackNov 25, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Maybe give it some sort of execute functionality? Like "minions below 20% HP are executed by auto attacks. Does not apply to monsters"

Most ADCs are already close to that threshold anyway, so just giving them that little extra could be a nice help for the item to offer. For other lanes it might be a bit more noticable (I'm thinking mages in particular, who generally struggle to last hit with AAs), but the item isn't all that appealing to most other lanes anyway, so I don't see how this would hurt too much.

An execute could work as well, but it would be a double edged sword. If it kills them too quickly it would push the lane.

junglerboy16Nov 25, 20151 votes

Yeah, that's why I was saying you'd have to gauge how close the average ADC is to 20% of a minion's health with a standard AA early game. I know that once they get a BF sword they usually 4 shot melees and 3-4 shot casters, so 20% may be a little high.

That said, pushing the lane could be a fair trade off to take, considering that it would require player skill to not allow it to over push and force them to not over extend with their weaker combat stats.

SeenanNov 25, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Yeah, that's why I was saying you'd have to gauge how close the average ADC is to 20% of a minion's health with a standard AA early game. I know that once they get a BF sword they usually 4 shot melees and 3-4 shot casters, so 20% may be a little high.

That said, pushing the lane could be a fair trade off to take, considering that it would require player skill to not allow it to over push and force them to not over extend with their weaker combat stats.

I'd say <= 3 shot casters, mind you.

darkdillNov 25, 20151 votes

I'd like this. Cull seems like a trap right now. You get it, suddenly the game forbids farming and you lose all your lanes within 10 minutes.

RebonackNov 25, 20151 votes

{quoted}

I'd like this. Cull seems like a trap right now. You get it, suddenly the game forbids farming and you lose all your lanes within 10 minutes.

Isn't that how most Rift games are going these days?

FreezerFlareNov 25, 20151 votes

Have it execute minions when they are at 10/15% HP? idk

IcyPepperNov 25, 20151 votes

Hm, I feel like an extra +3 damage onhit against minions would be a fair change?

RebonackNov 25, 20153 votes

{quoted}

Hm, I feel like an extra +3 damage onhit against minions would be a fair change?

I haven't the faintest clue what a fair value would be. That's for the folks in Live Balance to figure out. But this item does seem kinda like a trap right now.

IcyPepperNov 25, 20152 votes

With the AD it gives, +3 damage onhit would give it the same damage as doran's blade would against minions.

You trade combat stats for gold efficiency. We wouldn't want to overtune it, that's for sure D:

One thing I could see happening is that when you hit 100 stacks, it gets a slight damage boost to compensate for the dead weight until you sell it.

SeenanNov 25, 20151 votes

{quoted}

With the AD it gives, +3 damage onhit would give it the same damage as doran's blade would against minions.

You trade combat stats for gold efficiency. We wouldn't want to overtune it, that's for sure D:

One thing I could see happening is that when you hit 100 stacks, it gets a slight damage boost to compensate for the dead weight until you sell it.

The lifesteal and HP it gives (Doran's) still seems a lot stronger though, even if Cull's onpar.

RebonackNov 25, 20151 votes

{quoted}

The lifesteal and HP it gives (Doran's) still seems a lot stronger though, even if Cull's onpar.

This is pretty important to keep in mind.

Doran's gives a nice chunk of HP, more AD, and actual Lifesteal which allows it to stick around in an AD champ's toolbox longer before it becomes irrelevant.

Cull costs more gold, gives less stats, and gives no HP at all. You're gambling a lot on being able to sell it once you kill 100 minions. Even then, you've sacrificed an early game advantage for 200ish more gold.

Sightless66Nov 25, 20151 votes

That seems like it would just be a crutch for lower-level games, and would make it pretty worthless for higher level players. That kind of change could easily make it a low-elo trap.

It would probably be better to make it give a better reward for farming, instead of having it just make farming a bit easier. That would allow it to be useful at multiple levels.

LordGeovanniNov 25, 20151 votes

its a farming item as in you get it if you plan to farm the item is already strong and after you get your 400 gold boost you can sell the item back for 180 you are makeing a 80 gold profit off of useing the item with no stats even considered. its strong already and its not there to encourage you to passively farm its there because that's what you are going to do anyway and is rewarding you for it already the. the type things you guys posting this item would be a 650 gold item worth 1000 gold. though by all means if a reasonable idea is shown id like to see it