To compare to how ridiculous this champ is. The C9 vs CLG game shows this. Pob got DESTROYED in lane, and yet CLG makes a huge comeback of the utility and damage of a Azir that should have been far behind and out of the game. A champ has utility or damage, not both.
IcyPepper10 votesA champ has utility or damage, not both.
Mages tend to be a little more versatile than assassins, you know.
Angelofchaos16x4 votesTrue, but Azir is over versatile. Poke ? Check. Zoning potential ? Check. High DPS ? Check. Disengage? Check. Engage ? Check. Shield ? Check. 1 V 1 potential ? Check. Team fight potential ? Check. High damage to turrets and objectives ? Check. Question is, why would you not pick Azir ? Question, what is a HARD counter to Azir ? Answer, there is none. His 2 major counters Zed and LB have both been nerfed and Azir out scales them anyway
TheRakkun1 votesTrue, but Azir is over versatile. Poke ? Check. Zoning potential ? Check. High DPS ? Check. Disengage? Check. Engage ? Check. Shield ? Check. 1 V 1 potential ? Check. Team fight potential ? Check. High damage to turrets and objectives ? Check. Question is, why would you not pick Azir ? Question, what is a HARD counter to Azir ? Answer, there is none. His 2 major counters Zed and LB have both been nerfed and Azir out scales them anyway
I agree with you, you just have to really be careful how you word things because the post makes it seem you're advocating for a blanket nerf to his kit (Utility and Damage is standard for a mage as another poster said) but what he really needs to be toned down in are very specific areas (Poke, Burst, 1v1 potential (No mage should have 1v1 potential, that's the point of a mage, to be a backline damage dealer with utility and probably objective taking) while maintaining key parts of his identity (High DPS, Zoning, Mobility)
The Yetii Rider1 votesI agree with you, you just have to really be careful how you word things because the post makes it seem you're advocating for a blanket nerf to his kit (Utility and Damage is standard for a mage as another poster said) but what he really needs to be toned down in are very specific areas (Poke, Burst, 1v1 potential (No mage should have 1v1 potential, that's the point of a mage, to be a backline damage dealer with utility and probably objective taking) while maintaining key parts of his identity (High DPS, Zoning, Mobility)
I disagree that mobility is a key part of his identity. The dude can literally resurrect turrets and send armies long dead to crush his enemies. Zone control and DPS is much more important to the theme of emperor than a dash.
IcyPepper1 votesTo be fair, he's not amazing in solo queue at the moment (45.63% winrate in Plat+, 9.83% pick rate, 17.05% ban rate). He's very LCS hyped, tho, because he has tools pros are better with than solo queue.
If anything, he could use a power shift. Make him a tad weaker in LCS by making him less of a swiss knife, and a tad stronger in solo queue. But not too stronger, otherwise we would face a post-cinderhulk release Sejuani/Amumu/Gragas/Nunu scenario.
TheRakkun2 votesTo be fair, he's not amazing in solo queue at the moment (45.63% winrate in Plat+, 9.83% pick rate, 17.05% ban rate). He's very LCS hyped, tho, because he has tools pros are better with than solo queue.
If anything, he could use a power shift. Make him a tad weaker in LCS by making him less of a swiss knife, and a tad stronger in solo queue. But not too stronger, otherwise we would face a post-cinderhulk release Sejuani/Amumu/Gragas/Nunu scenario.
Might want to check out my post on him, I gave a tonne of suggestions on how to shift the power in his kit, and this all comes from experience playing Azir mind you.
Divewing1 votesStill have the bias towards his dash though
Abyssphere1 votesTo be fair, he's not amazing in solo queue at the moment (45.63% winrate in Plat+, 9.83% pick rate, 17.05% ban rate). He's very LCS hyped, tho, because he has tools pros are better with than solo queue.
If anything, he could use a power shift. Make him a tad weaker in LCS by making him less of a swiss knife, and a tad stronger in solo queue. But not too stronger, otherwise we would face a post-cinderhulk release Sejuani/Amumu/Gragas/Nunu scenario.
Agreed very much with your second point. I honestly don't think he's too strong but the power is just in incredibly frustrating places/places that as you say, are far more useful in competitive play. As long as kit is what it is now, he'll dominate LCS every time he's even remotely usable in solo q.
They need to streamline what he does but make him better at those things. That'd probably result in a win rate increase in solo q games if anything.
Sir Yamazuki1 votesTo be fair, he's not amazing in solo queue at the moment (45.63% winrate in Plat+, 9.83% pick rate, 17.05% ban rate). He's very LCS hyped, tho, because he has tools pros are better with than solo queue.
If anything, he could use a power shift. Make him a tad weaker in LCS by making him less of a swiss knife, and a tad stronger in solo queue. But not too stronger, otherwise we would face a post-cinderhulk release Sejuani/Amumu/Gragas/Nunu scenario.
Actually, he does do well in soloq, in plat+ experienced Azirs are sitting at 54%+, his average win rate is low because people new to him lose very often.
TheRakkun1 votes[{quoted}](name=Lord Yamazuki,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=QHU96gNU,comment-id=0000000000010002,timestamp=2015-07-19T21:50:18.025+0000)
Actually, he does do well in soloq, in plat+ experienced Azirs are sitting at 54%+, his average win rate is low because people new to him lose very often.
Isn't 52% ish generally considered a balanced winrate?
macromite2 votesyou know, most good mages fill most of those boxes anyway.
UltraSceptile1 votesMages tend to be a little more versatile than assassins, you know.
They also have a lot less risk, but azir has pretty much no risk.
Divewing1 votesFor whatever reason, he still deals large damage on his Q. If he's going to get nerfed id trade ALL the damage on his Q over what's on the PBE any day
TheRakkun5 votesThe nerfs are quite her, problem is they're not hitting him in the place he needs to be hit, His poke and early game zoning,
Make his Q do a LOT less damage with one soldier but have multiple soldiers do bonus damage Have his W range scale with rank
Also there are tonnes of champs that have utility and damage
Shield, Root Tonnes of damage (But she trades mobility)
Stun, Slow, Tonnes of damage (But trades it for range)
Knockback, slow, very good poke and some good mobility (trades it for mana problems)
Problem is Azir has it ALL Burst Siege Waveclear Mobility DPS CC Utility
It's unnecessary, and while I do main Azir I don't want him to be the 
of mages. (Come on who doesn't want a Birb Emperor)
I'm sorry I have to downvote the thread but it seems like you're just advocating a huge blanket nerf of his kit rather than selecting out his oppressive elements.
Feathermane2 votes"A champ has utility or damage, not both."
Unless they are Orianna.
TheRakkun2 votes"A champ has utility or damage, not both."
Unless they are Orianna.
Trades it for mobility.
Feathermane2 votesWhile giving her entire team mobility. On a short CD.
TheRakkun1 votesWhile giving her entire team mobility. On a short CD.
Movespeed steroids no longer count as mobility when you have champs that can hop every autoattack, have spammable 3 part dashes and can effectively dash infinitely.
Cosmic Warper1 votesMovespeed steroids no longer count as mobility when you have champs that can hop every autoattack, have spammable 3 part dashes and can effectively dash infinitely.
Yeah, that's why sivir isn't pick or ban in competitive due to her ult and passive, and why righteous glory is a horrible item on tanks right? -_- Movement speed is the best form of mobility out there, whether you're a mobile champion or not.
UltraSceptile1 votes"A champ has utility or damage, not both."
Unless they are Orianna.
Azir has mobility and a huge cockblock self peel ult.
I hate pretty much every mage but azir has almost no weaknesses while orianna still has some.
TheRakkun2 votesHonestly despite you being right I don't know why this post is being upvoted, it's kind of badly worded as damage and utility is something every mage has, and the post almost calls for a complete nerf of every facet of Azir's kit rather than his actual problem.
Now I'm not going to act like I know much about the match, I don't watch LCS, but Azir is MEANT to be a lategame champion so if the game managed to last until late game then it's not surprising he became really powerful as he likely caught back up. The real problem with Azir is generally how oppressive he is early game and how much stuff he's got crammed in his kit.
LoLKiru2 votesI think the simplest thing to do, is to absolutely gut his poking ability, while keeping his DPS the same (if not slightly improving it).
Maybe give Q a slightly lower cooldown to compensate along with a lower cost, so he can reposition his soldiers more often (you know, the intended function of the skill)
Cosmic Warper1 votesI think the simplest thing to do, is to absolutely gut his poking ability, while keeping his DPS the same (if not slightly improving it).
Maybe give Q a slightly lower cooldown to compensate along with a lower cost, so he can reposition his soldiers more often (you know, the intended function of the skill)
I've always thought that Q should be a repositioning tool, not a poking tool. Apparently riot doesn't think so. Q should have a slightly lower cd, less scaling (35-40%), and his Soldier auto attacks should ramp up in damage as they attack a target so his dps rises exponentially rather than linearly. He needs to be an amazing zone control DPS mage, not a poke burst caster with substantial DPS on the side.
Abyssphere1 votesThe problem is not Azir having both utility and damage. That's pretty standard across the board for mages. But as someone else said, the problem with Azir is that he does EVERYTHING. There's essentially nothing he's actually bad at and there is no real way for you to fight him without him getting the upper hand, should his cooldowns be available to him.
The nerfs to his E should help that, and the move of his attack speed from his passive to his W means he has to make a choice between burst and DPS in the early/mid game, so they are addressing it to at least some degree.
Lugg1 votesAzir does have his weaknesses. He starts pretty slow and he is very squishy, even late game.
TheRakkun1 votesAzir does have his weaknesses. He starts pretty slow and he is very squishy, even late game.
He does have them but he also has many things to cover his weaknesses such as ability to disengage really well and the fact he outduels basically every champion in a 1v1, not to meantion the poke that prevents people from even trying to all in him.
Critmaster Garen1 votesmake his goddamn soldiers destructable and displacable units already. thats all he needs. we need a way to counter his zoning.
TheRakkun2 votes[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=QHU96gNU,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2015-07-19T21:20:14.421+0000)
make his goddamn soldiers destructable and displacable units already. thats all he needs. we need a way to counter his zoning.
But Zoning is part of his kit. I've always said that's a bad idea. If you want to make his early game zoning a bit weaker then have his soldier AA range scale with ranks put into W and have his Q damage lowered but have it do bonus damage when there's more soldiers.
Having the soldiers destructable would mean they would have really strange interactions, like what if one was broken mid dash, or what if one was broken while Azir was casting his E, or what if Azir decided to meatshield himself from skillshots with them, would they obey unit colision? Could he just block his creeps to pull a wave?
Bad idea.
Manwalrus1 votesIt's definitely substantial enough since they completely shifted his build and you need to max w, which for an azir player is bad enough. They're also not hitting him where he actually needs to be hit. But then again I'm not really sure what the balance team has been smoking recently.
TurquoiseYoshi1 votesAzir is good at the pro level because he is difficult to play. He has no real weakness other than the player. When pros with hundreds of hours of experience play as him, they can do whatever they want.