Guinsoo's Rageblade Rework(idea)

NullDragon·May 19, 2015·6 votes·865 views

REMOVED: Passive(either the AP+Attack speed or both?) NEW Passive: Damaging an enemy champion with an autoattack gives 10% magic penetration. Damaging an enemy champion with a spell gives 10% physical penetration. Each can stack up to three times, for a total of 30% penetration. Stacks fade after 5 seconds.

Keeping the hybrid focus. Acts as a penetration item in a similar vein to Void Staff and Last Whisper. Thoughts? (any and all stats could change please focus on the new passive)

14 Comments

Very Hard EngageMay 19, 20152 votes

those numbers are way to high.

try 5% per spell up to 3x, enemy loses up to 15% armor and 5% per AA up to 3x, enemy loses up to 15% MR.

item that gives a moderate amount of ap/ad around 35 each.

if you want more than that the item gets redonkulously strong and overpowered with other pen items which would negate tanks.

otherwise tanks build this item just to apply the debuff and suddenly your carries can melt the enemy tank.

DesideriumMay 19, 20151 votes

{quoted}

those numbers are way to high.

try 5% per spell up to 3x, enemy loses up to 15% armor and 5% per AA up to 3x, enemy loses up to 15% MR.

item that gives a moderate amount of ap/ad around 35 each.

if you want more than that the item gets redonkulously strong and overpowered with other pen items which would negate tanks.

otherwise tanks build this item just to apply the debuff and suddenly your carries can melt the enemy tank.

15% would be stupidly underpowered. Ridiculously so.

30% is fine.

Also 35 AP/AD is very low. Nowhere near "moderate."

NullDragonMay 19, 20154 votes

Keep in mind that this is penetration, not reduction. Only you benefit from this item.

It's just a different way to increase the damage for yourself, except a way that's multiplicative with other items. That's the point, instead of just more attack speed and AP.

Very Hard EngageMay 19, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Keep in mind that this is penetration, not reduction. Only you benefit from this item.

It's just a different way to increase the damage for yourself, except a way that's multiplicative with other items. That's the point, instead of just more attack speed and AP.

i feel like im taking crazy pills here, you want % reduction, and you want it on both types of damage correct? thats OP for carries. you need to tone it down or else its a "everyone builds this" addition.

NullDragonMay 19, 20153 votes

In the same way last whisper, void staff, and black cleaver is OP for carries I guess.

Yes, you could probably buy a ton of AP to get even more penetration.

For ADCs, they'd be better off with Black Cleaver if they already bought Last Whisper. For AP carries, requiring auto attacks would make it inefficient for most everyone(I for one welcome our new hybrid Lux overlords)

The three stacks could be tuned until it's not favorable for anyone except people who autoattack and deal magic damage. If it's an 'everyone builds this' for those champions that's... the point. It fills the same role as Void Staff and Last Whisper.

stochastic42Jun 3, 20151 votes

last whisper with 3 rank devastating strikes mastery gives 39% pen, with this you would get to 69% pen which would reduce a 300 armor tank to 93 armor not taking into account flat pen, flat reduction, or % reduction. With black cleaver instead you would reduce his armor to 210 with 6 cleaver stacks and then reduce that to 128 with 39% pen so i'm not sure they would be better with black cleaver, depends on the situation. For champs that use AP and deal hybrid damage like corki, kogmaw, varus, ezreal, and most adc, this would become almost mandatory.

Still it's a good idea and you could easily just make it not stack with lw and void to solve that problem. Rageblade def needs a rework.

kile147May 19, 20151 votes

It would actually not be OP on carries, the only carry I can think of that it could be OP on would be Corki , and it would probably be a much needed buff to MissFortune . The real abusers of this would be bruisers like Jax and Shyvana , who already deal fairly mixed magic and physical damage in their kits through both abilities and autos. And the interaction between this and Darius bleed would make an already painful champ obscene as well.

If this item gave any AD/AP then this plus one other offensive item would allow these champs to steamroll everyone else in the game because they would be too tanky for carries to kill, and would have too much penetration for tanks to take hits from.

stochastic42Jun 3, 20151 votes

yeah, with this and botrk alone jax would melt any champ in the game extremely quickly.

DisasterSolaMay 19, 20151 votes

{quoted}

those numbers are way to high.

try 5% per spell up to 3x, enemy loses up to 15% armor and 5% per AA up to 3x, enemy loses up to 15% MR.

item that gives a moderate amount of ap/ad around 35 each.

if you want more than that the item gets redonkulously strong and overpowered with other pen items which would negate tanks.

otherwise tanks build this item just to apply the debuff and suddenly your carries can melt the enemy tank.

Not if you make it apply to only yourself. Instead of lowering your opponents stats, make it increase your penetration.

Remember that winsoo's rageblade is meant explicitly for basic attack hybrid champions.

WezzJun 3, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Not if you make it apply to only yourself. Instead of lowering your opponents stats, make it increase your penetration.

Remember that winsoo's rageblade is meant explicitly for basic attack hybrid champions.

And the only 2 champions that fit that criteria is A) much better built as an AD offtank B) has been mediocre in a long time, only thing that's left is some minor utility

aaronconlinMay 19, 20152 votes

Riot has said that they're really hesitant on making a hybrid penetration item

kile147May 19, 20152 votes

Jax Shyvana Darius I can't see why, surely this wouldn't make an already difficult to balance class of champs OP

FewtasMay 19, 20151 votes

And think about Fizz . Most of his damage is mixed, so he would just become unstoppable.

stochastic42Jun 3, 20151 votes

No, Fizz is almost exclusively magic damage, and this item wouldn't be very good since he usually leads with spells not autos so he wouldn't build his pen up.