What exactly is Bards... place?

Raoul··2 votes·1,602 views

I mean, yeah hes a support and stuff...

But I kinda dont get him...

Is there any more to bard than just placing 3 shrines and then poke? I played a few games, but kinda I dont feel like I am having any impact on the game... at least not more than I would have with Taric.

His Q is very unreliable, his Ultimate can backfire like hell... Whats the deal with Bard?

Sure, if you are lucky, you can stun 2 targets, but only if you are lucky. Sure, if you are luckya, you can put the whole enemy team in stasis or catch the enemy ADC of guard, allowing you team to position themself, but most times your ultimate is doing more harm than good...

41 Comments

Woodakoodashooda8 votes

He offers sustain. He peels. He CC's for easy kills. He helps secure objectives. He allows for safe dives. He baits enemies to their doom. He makes ganking mid with ADC/Jg easy. He provides additional protection to the Jg against invasion.

insaiyanbacca5 votes

Bard does pretty much anything and has a crap ton of utility, however hes very reliant on his team knowing how to play with him and utilize his kit as well. also parts of his kit can take any mistakes that would normally be bad and make them much worse.

IronChefBoyardee2 votes

Or you can stasis a turret. You underestimate the damage of the chimes or stunning someone against a wall. the W can be used as a quick ms boost and you can bait people with the E. Think outside the box

Brimaz The King2 votes

His identity is a roaming support.

Raoul1 votes

Which means the ADC is alone 1v2 alot?

1374344 votes

A big part of playing Bard is knowing when to roam. His chimes last 10 minutes I believe. The bad ones (not saying I'm a good Bard btw) leave as son as they see chimes up versus waiting until a good time.

My biggest issue with Bard is that he is one of those supports that if the rest of your team is bad (or conversely just doing balls to the wall amazing without your help) you really won't be doing all that much during the game, which may be why you feel like you have no impact on the game. There is nothing wrong with that, it just means the proactive style it requires to do well with the champion may not be the support style that fits you and you would be better off trying other champions like tank supports or damage supports instead of more utility supports.

Koechophe1 votes

As a bard main, I honestly disagree with the statement that if your team is doing bad, you won't feel impactful. I'm not perfect, by any means, but I've noticed that bard has more carry potential than any other support I've played. It's not so much that your team needs to learn to play around you; as a bard player, you need to learn to play around your team. Bard can augment any playstyle, so if you identify the way your team is playing and bolster it, you can make a huge difference even when you're super behind. It's hard, as a support, to feel impactful on a losing team, but bard does that super well just because he adapts.

Brimaz The King1 votes

No you only roam after you've helped your ADC get a kill never roam when they have 2 people.

BladeSteel2 votes

The thing is, it isn't luck that gets you to stun 2 targets or to put the enemy team in stasis...its skill. If you get good with bard, you can effectivly remove 2-4 people from a fight, making it really easy to win teamfights. Build him tanky, and peel late game (sometimes initate, especially with a righteous glory) early game poke, and set up kills for your adc. Its really easy if you can get good. None if it has to do with luck, its all skillshots.

Your Real Mom2 votes

Bard is one of the best champions for contesting objectives. Most people don't realize that his ult has multiple purposes. There have been games where I played bard support and ulted 4/5 of the enemy team (leaving the taric support) while the enemy team was taking it, half of my team was dead, and our eve jungle snuck in and smited it. I died for her sins because I threw myself in and tried to steal it with Q (i wanted to be the play maker lmao) but in the end my team came out with baron and the enemy team was salty.

Same can be said for dragon. Especially if the enemy bot lane has something like annie/blitz which can also be a very heavy presence - by ulting them you can eliminate the threat of being ulted or pulled and contest dragon much easier by throwing them off guard.

If you have deep wards and the enemy bot lane is hugging their tower or playing obnoxiously safe, you can ult their tower and dive very easily.

If you're in a team fight and they have someone with aoe - like galio, talon, or nunu - you can ult them and your team can walk away unscathed. If they have someone who's slippery like fizz, kassadin, or zed, you can ult them if you pay close attention to when they burn their escapes and proceed to line up your Q with a minion or with another champion who was caught in the ult behind them.

It's a very easy thing to do once you get a hang of it. Bard's ult lasts for around the same time as a zhonyas. As long as you and your team are ready to capitalize on it it will work in your favor.

ElysMustache2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Your Real Mom,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=P1qfgWOU,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2015-12-11T20:34:41.168+0000) Bard's ult lasts for around the same time as a zhonyas.

It is exactly the same time as Zhonya's.

Your Real Mom3 votes

Was unsure of this, thanks for clarifying! Just didn't want to make a false statement!

BluePolarizer2 votes

He is a disruptor. He forces enemy teams to spread out or lose the game (or physically force them to spread apart). This is a role that, while not present in every team (since usually it's pick teams that want to capitalize on a scattered enemy while a hard engage team wants the enemy to bunch up), is typically given to top lane or jungle bruisers on a much higher gold budget. For a pick team, Bard offers similar disruption for a lower cost.

Boulderox2 votes

Bard the only champ I say takes skill to play, so many things he can do have bad consequences when fucked up... No other champ is like this anymore...

Utility is bards game, I like him as a tease champ, a shaco if you will, bent on annoying the enemy so they waste time and resources just for you.

Bards ult is never going to be used correctly because they don't realize to use it as a corall ability, make them have to fight or be stasis'd.

Old Man Teeto2 votes

He's a rotational pick based support.

His job is to roam himself and his team faster than the enemy and try to pick off number advantageous fights with his ultimate/Q.

He is intentionally weaker in full 5v5's for that reason.

He works great with other pick based carries such as Ahri, Fizz, Rengar, TF, Nocturne etc by helping to isolate and pick off people who aren't grouped. When the enemy is grouped, he rotates his team around the map faster in order to take/defend objectives quickly.

If a full 5v5 breaks out, his best use is to split a fight with his ultimate and land 2 man stuns with Q. Removing either the enemy tank line or backline for 2.5 seconds can win a fight on it's own if your team is engaged in a fight.

Koechophe1 votes

I wouldn't say he's weaker 5v5. His ult alone can make a HUGE difference if used correctly: slamming it into the enemy frontline and allowing for picks on damage is huge, or even slamming it into the backline and negating the damage components for almost 3 seconds can easily turn tides. A 2 person stun that lasts almost 2 seconds also makes a big difference, and his ability to create flanks is massive. Not to mention, shrines placed on the periphery of teamfights can actually add a decent bit of health and movement without any cost, and his Q and meeps do significant damage, especially for a support. He's lacking that 1 "defining skill" but his potential in a teamfight is definitely there. Imho he works better in teamfights, because his Q and ult thrive with multiple targets.

Meep Man1 votes

Your passive is really the chimes. They give you big early mana sustain and allow you to roam to Middle Lane on rare occasion. The Meeps offer the reliable lane harass needed to get early kills. His Q can have a lot of impact and its not about luck at all; it's about positioning. A 1.8 second two target stun on a 7 second cool down can have a huge impact on a fight if you position correctly, which you can use your E to do. His W is pretty good. It's a huge help early game by giving your ADC some great sustain early game and letting you come back from an all-in really easily. His E is great for coming in with your jungler in Lane. Great communication can make any Jungler have Zac-level ganking potential. His R is not itself doing harm, its you. THIS is how you tell a good Bard from a bad Bard and what makes you either be a Bard main worth recognizing or not. His R can be used to divide a fight really well, almost like an AoE Tahm Kench Devour for bringing an enemy out of a fight!

LeviathanElite1 votes

It does not matter. Balance in the game is fine. Your own skill will trump any perceived game imbalance.

Jbels2 votes

{quoted}

It does not matter. Balance in the game is fine. Your own skill will trump any perceived game imbalance.

Nobody was calling Bard's balance into question...

LeviathanElite1 votes

{quoted}

Nobody was calling Bard's balance into question...

I realize, but the forum needs to have its ignorance struck down.

Jbels3 votes

{quoted}

I realize, but the forum needs to have its ignorance struck down.

You sound like ISIS.

LeviathanElite1 votes

{quoted}

You sound like ISIS.

Spare me the Fox news bullshit

Jbels3 votes

{quoted}

Spare me the Fox news bullshit

Spare me your tired "I'm here to make this a better place by forcing everyone to see things the same way I do" cliche bullshit, and we can talk.

LeviathanElite1 votes

{quoted}

Spare me your tired "I'm here to make this a better place by forcing everyone to see things the same way I do" cliche bullshit, and we can talk.

No just wanting everyone to be unbiased, and understand the folly of having biases.

Jbels2 votes

{quoted}

No just wanting everyone to be unbiased, and understand the folly of having biases.

Biases create gameplay variety. If everyone felt the same way about things, you might as well never play this game.

LeviathanElite1 votes

{quoted}

Biases create gameplay variety. If everyone felt the same way about things, you might as well never play this game.

Biases deter objectivity. Objectivity is key to all arguments. Also being an expert on a topic is very important prior to spamming forums with balance issues and "ELO HELL" complaints.

Bronze/Silver are far from experts. Lets call the Diamond 5 the "Experienced Car Mechanic" and lets call the Bronze/Silver "Beginner Mechanic"

On the forums, the beginner mechanic is arguing with the experienced car mechanic. Its completely ludicrous and would be laughed at in the real world.

Jbels1 votes

{quoted}

Biases deter objectivity. Objectivity is key to all arguments. Also being an expert on a topic is very important prior to spamming forums with balance issues and "ELO HELL" complaints.

Bronze/Silver are far from experts. Lets call the Diamond 5 the "Experienced Car Mechanic" and lets call the Bronze/Silver "Beginner Mechanic"

On the forums, the beginner mechanic is arguing with the experienced car mechanic. Its completely ludicrous and would be laughed at in the real world.

You don't have to work on cars to know how the parts work together

Boulderox2 votes

{quoted}

You don't have to work on cars to know how the parts work together

But would you rather have a shmuck tell you how your car is working/ not working, or someone who actually does it for a real career and has numerous experience from it?

LeviathanElite1 votes

{quoted}

You don't have to work on cars to know how the parts work together

The person that actually works on cars still knows WAY more than the guy that doenst.

BloodStone1 votes

{quoted}

I realize, but the forum needs to have its ignorance struck down.

People are learning. Chill.

insaiyanbacca1 votes

this has nothing to do with this thread, wtf?

DeathBurst1 votes

Is there any more to Sona than just healing and then poke? I played a lot of games, and I thoroughly enjoy Sona, and if you can't feel your impact on a game with healing and poking, there is something wrong. Your ADC should out-farm the opponent, for one thing.

Remember, kills don't matter. What matter is gold, and if you outfarm your opponent, maybe it's less flashy, but it's safer than a fight.

But yeah, if you are used to Taric, it's a completely different playstyle ;)

Beldair1 votes

Bard is a tricky support. I've used his ult to anjoy a Scion and stop his ult in it's track, i've ulted to stop the enemy team in their tracks so my team can escape.

Am i a good Bard, probably not. I miss with my Q, i do roam for chimes but only when i feel bot is good and the adc says they got it for a bit.

Now i do use my tunnel to set up their support and adc (that just want the kill off of the squishiest champ) and slam them with a double stun before booking it out of there.

ltmetal1 votes

Bard's strategic niche is supposed to be Roaming Utility Support. The only reason he's deemed "bad" for solo queue is that all three of those descriptions assume a good set of teammates who are coordinated enough to take full advantage of the true potential of a well-placed Tempered Fate or Magical Journey.

Wyrmblade1 votes

Bard is weird. I've had a lot of games with him where I went something like 0/10 then won anyways for some reason.

Kingsgrave1 votes

Anti engage support

Truly Prideful1 votes

If your ult is doing more harm than good most times you should probably rethink playing Bard or maybe practice more ( Not trying to sound like an ass ). His ult is one of the best catching tools in the game. At worst you'll blow their flash or force them into a path they didn't want to take if you're using it properly. It makes tower dives early in the game very easy.

His Q really isn't that unreliable at all once you've played him for a while. I find it pretty easy to utilize well at this point. Using their minion backline to stun the ADC is probably my favorite use in lane, it forces them to position in ways they don't want to. Later in the game it's an insanely powerful tool because the cooldown is very low and stuns are easy to hit during chaotic fights.

Bard is also one of the best supports for gank assist. He can set up journey ganks for him and his jungler on mid or bot from angles that wouldn't be warded very easily. He roams very fast so he doesn't need to be away from lane for long if the ADC needs the help.

Could I ask what your skill order / build is? Bard is really quite good, but he takes a lot of practice to consistently do well with. Knowing how and when to use your ultimate is probably the most difficult part.

Raoul1 votes

I took some of the advice in here to heart and actually I have been improving^^

Truly Prideful1 votes

Keep at it, Bard is one of the most fun and satisfying champions in the game when you have him down. Hope you end up loving him, always nice to see new Bard players. :D

Koechophe1 votes

I'm a Bard Main, but it's taken me a long time to feel like I'm good at him. This is my advice:

Early game, he has insanely powerful poke, especially with the addition of thunderlord's. Landing Q + Meeps AA will not only proc thunderolord's all the way, but will proc spellthief's 3 times and chunk for a surprising amount of damage. You need to be careful, because he's extremely squishy in response to the damage he doles out, but equal trades become favorable if the enemy has no sustain, because you do.

In the laning phase, his chimes are a huge advantage because they each restore 12% of mana. No other support can restore mana. Don't run too far to collect, and always leave your ADC shrines, but those things can be useful for staying in lane longer and harassing more. Never grab a chime with full mana; pop a shrine down wherever you are. It'll get used eventually.

Mid game, his pattern shifts to roaming. His mobility boost from his chimes is amazing for getting to other lanes quickly, and a well timed ult sets up ganks like no other. Likewise, he sets up ganks in the jungle or in certain lane areas extremely well using his tunnels; ping your allies near where you're going to create the tunnel, and use it to cut off enemy champions. Pop a W on a high value target: the movespeed boost helps substantially and it's the most reliable way to get assists, which are actually not terribly easy to come by as bard.

Bard also has extreme strength in his ability to place wards. He can not only do it more quickly, but tunnels can get you out of almost anything. Just roam within tunnel range of allies, throw one down and slam a Q into the enemy while they're still in the tunnel, so they are stunned when they emerge. You can bait people with tunnels quite well (side note; NEVER ENTER BARD'S TUNNEL IF YOU'RE ON THE ENEMY TEAM. DONT DO IT!).

Late game, his pattern shifts to straight utility and zone control. His ult may seem useless, but the more you play him, the more you see its power. Time it right, you can nab 3 people on the enemy team and turn the fight into a 2v5 for a few moments, forcing people to either die or drain offensive spells. Even isolating one person can be huge; slam the ult into the frontline so your damage can kill the backline, or slam it into the backline so that they're useless for a few seconds. Also (and I can't stress this enough) keep using shrines. While you're gathering for a teamfight, throw them down in possible escape routes, you'll be surprised at how useful they are.

I like to build bard a bit unorthodox; I go for frostqueens and ignore ruby sightstone, just grabbing the regular. Then I build Ludens into Lichbane. The added AP really makes the heals and poke powerful, but it's a squishy build, so it takes care to work properly. Even with those items, a Q + AA will chunk squishies for half of their hp (I'm really not exaggerating there, it's quite nice). In games where my team needs me tankier, I go for ruby sightstone earlier, then grab either frozen heart or gauntlet (depending on gold advantage) then spirit visage or legion, all depending on what the enemy teamcomp looks like and what defensive stats I need. If the team needs more utility, I'll pick up Zeke's for the adc (usually don't do this because Bard roams too much for it to be optimal) and banner of command, or even ardent censure sometimes (so I can buff adcs with my heal). Ultimitely, bard can build whatever the crap he wants, tbh. Straight AP actually works well; he scales extremely well even though his numbers don't seem to suggest it. If you set up three shrines, you're healing for an AP ratio of 1.8 in burst, which is insane (not to mention you can throw another shrine under people while 3 are active, healing for a net of 2.1 AP).

Bard's Q is definitely a mindgame spell. It gets really, really good in teamfights, where there's chaos and more targets, but it works well in lane. Mastering his Q is the first step to becoming a good bard player; it's not quite like other skill shots. Don't feel pressured to use it only for the stun; the slow is pretty darn powerful too, and it does great damage on its own. Remember that dead turrets are still terrain (people forget that all the time) and that your actual target can be the second one you want to hit (so if someone's standing behind a minion, hit the minion and then them with the skill shot, and they'll get stunned). It's also easy to land when people chase you, and insanely easy to land when people run through your tunnels.

Bard's ult is the hardest part about his kit. Using it effectively is really, really, really, really difficult, but the power is amazing. It can be used as great engage, disengage, and it really remolds a teamfight. Just take care, the spell takes longer the further away you cast it; try to use it up close. ALso try to pick fights in the jungle: bard works WAY better there. There's more terrain to Q and make tunnels with, there's smaller gaps which makes his ult exponentially harder to dodge, and there's generally more chimes to work with. Chimes last for 10 minutes, if you have them in useful positions, leave them there so you can use them to run.

Hope some of this is useful.

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