What Would It Take To Make Kindred Good?

ItsMaybelline··3 votes·981 views

Disclaimer: I'm still pretty new to League. That being said i love the design of Kindred. I know she isn't that good but god i just love her whole creepy hunter aesthetic. She's just such a unique design and even if her kit is trash i still can't help but love her. She's a death spirit that doesn't look like Kayne, that in and of itself deserves praise.

So my understanding of Kindred's purpose is she's a jungler who deals the majority of her damage with auto attacks. The point of an ADC, or hell, most marksman character's abilities is to set up their auto attacks or check their flaws. Ex. Kindred has a short range vault since a marksman shouldn't have too much mobility due to their reliance on positioning and Jhin has an ult that allows him even more range than his already great range. The most unique aspect of kindred is her Marks. These are what set her apart from other marksman/ junglers IMO. No jungler can set up a mind game like Kindred and no ADC can have a presence in another lane like Kindred.

Kindred's kit is a bit mismatched. Her Q is right at home on an ADC/Jungler but her W is somewhat pointless. The only reason i would use Kindred's W in a fight is for it's passive, which is to lower the cooldown of Kindred's Q to 3 seconds as opposed to 9. The damage isn't very good and it doesn't do anything else unless I've forgotten some CC it has. Kindred's E feels to me like the people who make the 3 hit passives got into an argument with the people who didn't like 3 hit passives and this is the middle ground they agreed on. I don't understand the purpose of a 3 hit move on someone who is jungling most of the time. Sure if she was someone who did sustained damage like Garen or Jax but a jungler shows up to gank a lane, trade with the laner for a second, then leave. Kindred is rarely in lane long enough to even activate this move, let alone hit someone 3 times. The damage on it doesn't feel too impactful.

Now Kindred's ultimate. While this move does have a few uses, i'm not too sure how well it works with her kit. Kindred has mindgames, decent kill potential, great roam and farming, and ranged damage. The use of a stasis that is cast on yourself isn't exactly at home here. First off if she does cast it, she has to run into the middle of a team fight AND LIVE, i'm emphasizing that because that in and of itself is no small feat for a squishy ranged champion with NO SHIELDING. She then cast her ult which everyone on your team needs to be on board for because this can ruin a Tryndamere's day at breakneck speeds. Now once you cast your ult there isn't much reason why you'd win the team fight. Sure, things could go your way and some of them wasted cooldowns but they aren't necessarily at a disadvantage just because no one died. The difference between this and bard's ult is bard's ult turns a 5v5 into either a 5v3 or a you v the entire enemy team depending on how you use it. This doesn't have any impact except in a few clutch instances (Baron is at risk of being smited by enemy jungler, dragon could be smited, ally is about to die a few feet from safety and he won't die anyway once he gets there, etc.). Bard's ult is something that just works naturally, it goes off perfectly and you don't have to understand the ability to know why this new 3v5 ass whooping isn't good for you. Kindred's ult even in the right hands can still have no impact just because this wasn't a clutch instance (You give an ally enough time to run to tower or base but wait! Any one tanky, CC heavy, or just with range can just do what they normally do to stragglers and your ult is now pointless).

So in summary Kindred is supposed to be a fear inducing jungler who can trick people into doing something stupid with her Mark's and can do decent damage without being an ADC, her damage seems supplementary with the advantage of being safer than what Zed or Vi do. Since she doesn't have to put herself at risk to do damage, her arrows need to be a bit on the softer side so that explains why RIot made them out of actual feathers; they were scared she'd be broken. So with that in mind i think the flaws in her kit are:

  1. Mismatched kit
  2. Loss of purpose
  3. Her role, while being one that in theory is unique and would definitely work in lower ELO's, is one that will not be meta. She's a lower damage ADC with safety in mind but safety at the risk of less damage isn't optimal unless your getting free damage with no risk to yourself.
  4. Her scaling and actual numbers from what i hear are absolutely terrible. I don't know much about scaling and stat proggression being new to League so i didn't talk about these above and focused on what her kit does, not how well it does it. But in my limited play of her and what i've seen she doesn't do any damage at all hardly except in the hands of players who are insanely better than their opponents.

So how should Riot fix Kindred? I think her ult is pretty useless although very unique and cool. Her E and W could use some fine tuning or even be reworked. Also she doesn't strike me as a killer so being reliant on scaling through her marks probably isn't practical since everyone's first reaction when they're marked is to not put themselves at risk. I mean if you had a target on your back, wouldn't you run to tower? Also her whole jungler ADC hybrid thing is kind of contradictory to what her kit does so i think her kit should suit what she's supposed to do. And before you point out how absolutely wrong i no doubt am about everything i've said keep in mind i'm still pretty new to League. My knowledge of each champions kit is pretty good but i know almost nothing about how each one scales and how their stats are. Thoughts?

11 Comments

DarkSoul19943 votes

Revert the god awful changes Riot made to them recently. She was actually decent until Riot tried to 'fix' them.

ItsMaybelline1 votes

What did they do to them (I'm assuming them is junglers)? I heard they lowered the gold you get in the jungle, is that it or was there more?

needHymn1 votes

[deleted]

DarkSoul19941 votes

Yeah. Them refers to Lamb & Wolf.

DarkSoul19941 votes

Riot basically soft-reworked Kindred a couple of months ago.

EDIT: This. Revert this gimmicky shit.

RazorRaijin1 votes

Easiest thing would be to make the jungle easier to farm in again.

ItsMaybelline1 votes

My understanding is that Riot wants the game to be more team fight oriented. They don't like champs that have a solo impact in an environment where everyone is equally skilled. It's something i learned in Overwatch which is skill to do Vs. Skill to stop. I.E. A meta where Zed can gank every lane and no one can stop him unless you have a 3v1 is bad because he just gained access to all gold in the jungle and whatever lane he ganks for his team and you have to be a significantly better player to stop him. I think they view junglers as flexible characters: They don't do much but they can apply a touch of pressure anywhere which is what makes them powerful. If Bot is going south then your mid laner would have to use a summoner spell to get down there and yoru mid laner would have to be snowballing mid and lose CS to help. That's why Kindred's damage is so weak: She is a jungler who is even safer than other junglers so her actual impact needs to be weaker than even other junglers. She has safety in her kit due to range and mobility so if she did anywhere close to normal damage then she would be pretty broken. I mean she can shoot you under tower at a few marks and there isn't much you can do then.

RedPannda1 votes

Remove the need for 2+ tanks on a team. As long as this meta stays the only viable junglers are tanks. And if they ever fix that problem she would still be shit.

Remove the target minigame, it gives free kills to the enemy knowing where to collapse. It is not a skill thing, if you ignore it they take it from you. If you go for it they kill you. She lost all her dueling potential. She is probably one of the worst champions in the game atm.

ItsMaybelline1 votes

I really wish the Mark's could be more of a mind game but i'm not sure how you would do it. I love that i can scare the support into running to their tower. I think she should be able to switch the mark to another target once after the activation of the mark. This would make it possible to split up the ADC and support due to a mark on the support, then focus the marked ADC for a kill. That's kind of what i want her kit to be. There are so many things you can do with that passive, and currently we do none of it which is sad.

ItsMaybelline1 votes

Also, you shouldn't be balancing champions for the meta. That's a really good way to fuck up balance. Not only is it unnecessary but the meta is constantly shifting. If we completely reworked every champ that the meta didn't suit then there wouldn't be a meta and the game would lose all competitive edge since no strategy ever worked for more than a week. Champs are supposed to have a purpose in their kit, just because that purpose isn't viable at the moment doesn't mean the champ is underpowered, they're just off meta.

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