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The Reforging of Mordekaiser.@Riot

Mordepool··4 votes·2,538 views

https://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/lotr/images/6/61/Morgoth_2.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20070728215554 Currently our Master of Metal Mayhem, has carved out a Domain in Toplane, occasionally annexing Midlane and Jungling.(too bad the preseason changes killed his Jungling)

With a 1.2% playrate and a versatile Role selection it's hard to see where his Power should be focused for his Upcoming Rework. (Soon™)
To really Nail down a Direction we need to understand the man underneath the Armor and where he fits into the game as it stands

#What is his Theme? An immortal Warlord Bound in Undeath, an ancient Evil about to launch an assault on middle-earth(whoops) to cover the lands in a Second Darkness.

How is his theme brought to the Rift? Green mist? He came before the shadow isles so not sure that works http://gifsoup.com/view/4776518/fart-gun.html

he sometimes gets a spooky scary skeleton dragon. Oh that's it?,. Really? And most of the time the dragon just ignores his commands? Wow, and the players are ok with that? Oh so the players complained so Riot made it worse? Interesting? #(Warning the above statement is dripping in sarcasm) so we have room for improvement.

What is Mordes Gameplay Fantasy? http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view5/4578446/sauron-o.gif Sums it up pretty well maybe add some Iron Maiden in the background for effect. When Playing Mordekaiser the enemy team needs to feel threatened by your presence. Feel the inevitablity of death closing in.

What is his Role as a champion?
Mordekaiser has decades of Battle experience knows the limits of his strength and can assess the strengths in others. With his cycle of Rebirth being a key strategic point to his victory. He can lose the Battle to win the War. when such a sacrifice is needed it's always a net gain for Mordekaiser.

What are his expressions of skill? Timing his long ass cooldowns/flash 3rd Q don't really count. https://media.tenor.co/images/98ea3573b5b5e979739f3d884b3c6f74/tenor.gif ##Getting this Dragon to obey for longer than 2 seconds

Does his Subclass even fit? This is a question is a thread unto itself. But I can say that having played him since S1 he is a Battle Mage/Juggernaut and not a Juggernaut/Battle Mage. The Juggernaut classification seems like just an excuse to drop his MS to 325( which needs to change)

##What does Morde bring that is Unique? "He turns his enemies Strength against themselves " this is THE CORE ELEMENT to Mordekaiser. It's how he Wages War on Rune Terra Passive- iconic Q&W&E- cool but meh R- is what Defines him as a character ( and no I'm not talking about the Dumb Dragon) & I'm not talking about the dragon.

Coming back to Mordes Core element turning the enemies Strength against them. My vision of a New ultimate My idea: Children of the Grave curses the target damning the target to a fate worse than Death. For the next 12 seconds all damage dealt to the target by Mordekaiser from aa's and abilities deal an additional 50%(for example) damage. In addition any of Mordekaisers basic abilities that hit the target apply the grounded cc for 1.25 seconds.
Mordekaiser's Ghost Lingers for 45seconds, persists through Mordekaiser's death and is still controlled by his Master FROM THE GRAVE. ( Reinforcing his willingness to Lose the Battle and win the War) The leash range for the ghost is the balancing lever riot could use

Why add the Grounded CC to his Kit? I thought he is supposed to be the immobile no CC champion.

While this is true after 7 years I feel like having Mordekaiser depend on one Crystal scepter so much is a sign of bad design. ultimately his strength of character won't change by the addition since it's presented in a Window of Power that is gated on positioning and proximity to the enemy champion.

Moving Forward: #1 Reducing Feast and Famine. This should have been the goal the last time around, being able to contribute to your team when behind. see "My idea" for his ult change.

#2 330 movement speed Please if you don't like the grounded cc addition recommended 340.

#3 His R: Dragon Ghost has to go. it has proven a balance nightmare that Riot is using Bugs to keep ineffective ( I want a functioning Champion not a gimmick anyway) The damage portion of it is lackluster and could be removed entirely making his ultimate a utility spell
#The rest of his kit could stay as is with some rebalancing for a none damaging ult

To all those curious as to why I have stayed loyal to this champion for 7 years and why not just play the New OP

Because I don't need the FOTM OP to win just the tools to effect the game and when I played him before the Rework, EVERY GAME was Fun. Now it feels like I'm playing a cripple with a big stick.

Let me know what you think

Mordepool still on vacation thinking of you Metal Man

https://youtu.be/0deA1JUUZFQ

25 Comments

Mordepool1 votes

I know it's a big Wall of text I tried to break it up to make it readable

Kilanost1 votes

You're supposed to have decent control over dragon? Never would have guessed... lol.

I personally would love to see how this champion does without all these goddamn bugs.

Mordepool1 votes

{quoted}

You're supposed to have decent control over dragon? Never would have guessed... lol.

I personally would love to see how this champion does without all these goddamn bugs.

It makes me wonder how high his winrate would spike

Selegun1 votes

Not sure of every bug you may be referring to but the targeting portion of dragon is a combo of input and the base dragon retaliation setup. This explains why it goes crazy in minions since its on the player to clear them out so the dragon will obey. As for it doing the same with champions, in a way its a poorly conveyed form of counter play since its easy to confuse the dragon while its getting order and trying to fight back.

Mordepool1 votes

{quoted}

As for it doing the same with champions, in a way its a poorly conveyed form of counter play since its easy to confuse the dragon while its getting order and trying to fight back.

Counterplay allows for both players to have a meaningful interaction. The dragon just pauses any possible interaction.
Forcing enemies to keep at a distance while the Morde player is dealing with an unresponsive erratic turret tank.

It's not fun for either party. That's how Mordekaiser feels right now. Just wasted Potential

Selegun1 votes

I agree wholeheartedly that having dragon just stop in the middle of simple movement is something that could be fixed.

Forced? That is an opinion I cannot see your side of at the moment. Between having my early dragons simply melt or my late game dragons aggro juggled while I get killed by one or two champs that know dragon should not be the main target of anything besides an afterthought stun I'd say it has plenty of work around. Lets reel things back for a moment to better understand the situation, who plans and practices around fighting against Mordekaiser? Can you really blame a player for not knowing how to play against that when they are almost as likely to have Urgot on their team? Personally that WTF do I do moment is why I like the game so much, though I am by no means a good enough player to work out 80% of those instances.

That again is just opinion. I still have fun playing Morde when ever I get the chance and the only wasted potential is on me not knowing how to make my favorite character work.

Mordepool1 votes

{quoted}

My example about Dragon stalling any interaction is based around the early game 1v1 when the powerspike is most noticeable and when most champions haven't finished a defensive item. since as soon as mid game rolls around the enemy team can group and make the Dragon irrelevent unless both teams are present.

My remark as to Mordekaiser's wasted potential has alot to do with public perception and how it feels to play him .

I see 2 threads a Month by random people putting forth Mordekaiser Rework threads. Nearlyn's bug thread on Reddit Malicious Metal's Passionate presence on the Boards.
I see New people picking him up asking for help with builds and still his playrate Dropping. 1.4%-1.2%. His public perception is mostly a Negative one

Add these all up and I see a champion with a strong thematic to pull in new players. with a playstyle fun enough to keep them playing until that's ruined by bugs

Most of all I see an opportunity for improvement

Selegun1 votes

While I can agree that the wasted potential lies heavily with public perception I feel very strongly that this is the fault of us, the players. I very much admit I have not seen the boards for several months so the point I'd like to raise may very well be invalid but the impression I had after the Juggernaut rework could be boiled down to read, 'If you are not Plat/Diamond then you cant enjoy the character because you don't know what fun is.' This is very much the attitude that made me lose respect for a large number of players as it turned into the sole argument against the few players that did/still do enjoy Mordekaiser. What satisfaction can be had in a conversation about something you enjoy only to be stopped by the thread bouncer and told you cant join since you are only silver 2? Please dont get me wrong, these players still have valid ideas and thoughts but when someone else wants to talk enjoyment and fun just to be told they cant because they are bad is it any wonder why the only people left on the boards just seem to consistently bitch?

I agree very much that Mordekaiser's thematic has a strong draw on newer players, hell, that's the reason I picked him up in the first place despite the laments of the ass-goblins that insisted on teaching me League to begin with. Personally, it feels like the lack of back and forth conversation is what keeps driving newer Morde players away rather than how buggy or how unbalanced he feels on any particular cycle.

Mordepool1 votes

{quoted}

ass-goblins

That cracked me up lol.

Joking aside you sir bring up some very good points I thank you for taking the time to share them.

Selegun1 votes

Thank you very much for hearing me out. Its not often I'm able to feel satisfied with a board post as I am now.

If I could pick your brain a moment, your post above mentions wanting more base movespeed and that makes me curious as to why. I very much feel giving Mordekaiser more movement speed would make him more consistent yet come at the cost of making him feel cool. What I'm trying to get at is something we can look to a similar character for an answer in the form of Sauron. Have you ever seen Sauron run? Jog? Trot maybe? I cant remember off the top of my head but if pressed I would need to answer with a serious question, why does he need to? He is all powerful, near invulnerable and ever living! There just isnt a sound reason in my eyes that anything more than a confident stride should be anything more than what his speed is set at without some heavy penalties to damage, defense or both.

At the risk of pressing my point to obsurdity, I would gladly give up 5 more movespeed if I could see that number go directly into his armor.

Mordepool1 votes

{quoted}

At the risk of pressing my point to obsurdity, I would gladly give up 5 more movespeed if I could see that number go directly into his armor.

For me Riot has 2 options either give him cc which can allow him to lock down one mobile opponent ( and still be out ran). Or bring his base Movement speed back up to a respectable level

The reason is simply because of how it feels to move such a large hitbox character with such low movement speed.

My preference would be the 1st option keep him slow but suddenly hyper Mobile champions have to feel the inevitablity of death closing in as this slow moving threat runs them down

Selegun1 votes

I can see your point about giving him a CC, though I worry it would come with some heavy restrictions. One example that comes to mind would be to convert his Ult into a grapple of similar duration with several ways of breaking out such as stunning Morde, dealing damage to him from outside sources of above certain levels as well as dashes.

As for giving him back movespeed I feel its good to keep it low since he has more than enough in combat MS between items like Trinity Force and Ludens as well as his W should you have well coordinated allies.

Mordepool1 votes

{quoted}

I can see your point about giving him a CC, though I worry it would come with some heavy restrictions. One example that comes to mind would be to convert his Ult into a grapple of similar duration with several ways of breaking out such as stunning Morde, dealing damage to him from outside sources of above certain levels as well as dashes.

The Grounded CC is the best thematic fit I think " There is no Quick Escape from Death" that could be a VO line. I definitely want it gated hence how I worded it in the thread. If Morde curses a target they aren't affected by grounded Until morde can close and deal damage and even then he would need to stagger his abilities and AAs In order for him to actually lock them down. Any Movement speed boost to the enemy champion could easily tip the balance in the chase

Selegun1 votes

On paper I can see Grounded being a thematic fit. Without getting an idea of how it feels to play with the mechanic I cant say I have anything productive to add to the conversation.

What I can make a comment on is that I dont feel Mordekaiser should have the ability to chase. Being able to run an opponent down undermines the value of being indomitable, arguably far more core to his character than anything else. An opponent is supposed to feel they have to run, at least until they dont have the room to escape or are powerful enough to over come him is some way.

Mordepool1 votes

{quoted}

What I can make a comment on is that I dont feel Mordekaiser should have the ability to chase. Being able to run an opponent down undermines the value of being indomitable, arguably far more core to his character than anything else. An opponent is supposed to feel they have to run, at least until they dont have the room to escape or are powerful enough to over come him is some way.

See now we enter into the Battle of thematic vs mechanical gameplay. And one reason why lots of champion will never be equal in that regard is because of summoner spells.

If Morde shouldn't be able to chase then Morde shouldn't be allowed to choose ghost?

Here is the problem with that line of thought.

Ultimately With the Grounded cc his Gameplay Pattern doesn't really change Pick a high value Target ult and smash your way in to the enemy team to that target (that target can cut and out run Morde most likely) but if Morde get close enough they can't Blink away (assuming Morde plays his abilities correctly)

Morde is still ceceptable to CC (that didn't change) and if slowed or if the enemy gets a speed boost they can get away. ( Added Counterplay)

That's what I meant by the chase Morde now has an input into whether a highly Mobile champion gets away or not. Where as before he had Zero input in that interaction. (Healthier for the champion).

Selegun1 votes

An acceptable point to address. I must admit I do not take into account summoner spells since that is what we, the Summoner, take into the game with us. Unfortunately summoners no longer exist so we are left in an odd little limbo when attempting to address these abilities. To this end I am still in the mindset of the summoner bringing those two spells while the champion works with the base stats and spells set to their kit. I do see the benefit you point out with the Grounded debuff and very much agree he could use the bump to feel better. The main concern I have is that when reading it to myself the ability sounds far more like the power of a proper gravity mage rather than a Sauron-esk overlord.

Velzard of Koz1 votes

Looking at just the URL, I misread this as "Reforging of Mordekaiserrot" and imagined Mordekaiser as giant Carrot. That'd be next level theme rework.

Mordepool1 votes

{quoted}

Looking at just the URL, I misread this as "Reforging of Mordekaiserrot" and imagined Mordekaiser as giant Carrot. That'd be next level theme rework.

ROFL. Ya I forgot how much space you get before it cuts off

Mechakaiser1 votes

Shouldn't the grounded effect have an internal cooldown? A perma lock sounds a bit too brutal.

Other than that, pretty cool ideas, I'd personally get rid of his passive too (feast and famine).

Mordepool1 votes

{quoted}

Shouldn't the grounded effect have an internal cooldown? A perma lock sounds a bit too brutal.

Ya I'm not on the Balance team I'd leave that decision for them. I definitely wanted to gate it somehow if they kept kit as is I would attach it to his Q

Malicious Metal1 votes

Honestly, you pinned down his themes and what he should feel like perfectly. Not a fan of the ultimate though, I feel it's just way too powerful.

Personally, I wouldn't really care about Riot actually changing all his skills in favor of making them satisfying and still delivering on his fantasy as a Revenant King.

Mordepool1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Malicious Metal,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=OOernG0E,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2017-04-26T11:54:40.340+0000)

Honestly, you pinned down his themes and what he should feel like perfectly. Not a fan of the ultimate though, I feel it's just way too powerful.

I had to provide some sort of suggestion otherwise my post is just Memes and Games stuff.

Personally, I wouldn't really care about Riot actually changing all his skills in favor of making them satisfying and still delivering on his fantasy as a Revenant King.

^^this is what I am trying to get across

Mordepool1 votes

Lol check New. There is another Rework Morde thread

ApexInTheCircle1 votes

OH! And before we forget, be sure to make him as big as Sion so we can get that intimidation factor in.

Mordepool1 votes

{quoted}

OH! And before we forget, be sure to make him as big as Sion so we can get that intimidation factor in.

Just make the Mace Bigger lol

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