Anyone else feel this game needs more items ?

RainbowIcee·Feb 12, 2017·106 votes·4,726 views

I feel there's a serious lack of items in the game when most people are building the same thing. AD's are building the same thing, AP's are building the same thing, tanks are building the same thing. People are complaining that ranged champions are abusing melee champion items and should be changed this is true but i feel more items in the game will not only allow more variety it they should also set up counter measures to fight off other items and champs. There just isn't enough items, because rito keeps deleting them.

113 Comments

ScissorsNstuffFeb 12, 201733 votes

Game has no pants

LordSirChipmunkFeb 13, 201711 votes

Or underwear.

MelledoneusFeb 13, 20175 votes

item 1018 Wear it as a dress, damn it.

Velzard of KozFeb 13, 20178 votes

No, we need new item.

Giovanni's Briefs +20 Fabulousity +10 Looks -15 Dignity

UNIQUE Passive: Any inflicted charm crowd-control is prolonged by 1 second.

Coco's Bra +20 Chestsize +10 Booty -10 Modesty

UNIQUE Passive: Nearby male enemy champions (except for Taric and Lee Sin) are slowed, busy watching dem chestsize, by 10% plus 5% per 10 Chestsize.

LeetriFeb 13, 201710 votes

Man, that last item is gonna be so OP on Gragas.

BorblandFeb 13, 20178 votes

It has a secret passive on Gragas: Looking towards Gragas with that item for more than 2 seconds fears you

LeetriFeb 13, 20172 votes

Obligatory https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5GyxaeeoXJk

AMYS GRAVEFeb 13, 20172 votes

Was expecting an MF joke, this was better.

Velzard of KozFeb 13, 20172 votes

Poor Jinx, her Chestsize base numbers are so weak.

SpecterVonBarenFeb 13, 20172 votes

If the item is a bra then why does it increase booty size?

Velzard of KozFeb 13, 20173 votes

For the same reason this dagger item 3115 gives power to your magic, this dagger item 1042 makes you attack faster and somehow this dagger item 3124 allow both. :^) Stat synergy.

AptestFeb 13, 20173 votes

Targon's Codpiece?

MinaZer0Feb 13, 20173 votes

truth, wear(LUL) are the undergarments and socks, my ankles are getting blisters from the item 3006

Also I think if the items werent so overloaded already maybe there would be room for ALOT more items, ex. item 3165

Ariel the CruelFeb 12, 201721 votes

I think item structure should be looked at before adding more items blindly. Items are about stats. We could have 10 000 items and everyone would still build roughly the same thing because it's the "most effective" build.

ModKnightsKemplarFeb 12, 20179 votes

This. It's much better to have a small handful of items that actually do their job than to have a shop full of items that don't fulfill their function.

We're in a decent spot with items. They overtuned the lethality items a bit this time around, and we should expect that. Riot expects that. They are constantly tuning the game, and seeing a problem like this isn't a big deal to them. The game isn't broken. All they have to do is tune it back down on the next patch and it'll be fine again.

Also, not to sound like a jerk, but I just don't think it's that bad. I'm still having plenty of fun playing.

THE RlVER KlNGFeb 12, 201721 votes

I just want Zephyr back

is that too much to ask

AirKingNeoFeb 13, 20171 votes

Only if it gives more AD and a real passive.

IcyPepperFeb 13, 20179 votes

So basically a different item altogether.

AirKingNeoFeb 13, 20171 votes

The problem is it negates the trade off of getting Ninja Tabi and 10% MS is stupidly massive.

IcyPepperFeb 14, 20171 votes

The problem is it negates the trade off of getting Ninja Tabi

I have no idea what you're talking about there.

I can't help but feel you're trolling. Zephyr is obviously referring to wind, like Janna's one spell, and it makes sense for it to be a low AD, high MS and AS item. It's a kiting item, rather than a burst item...

AirKingNeoFeb 12, 20179 votes

It's more like this:

Crit needs to be removed and reworked so ADC itemization isn't this shitty quadratic scaling that causes ADCs to be useless pre 30 then gods post 35 when building crit. Make them scale linearly. Like Essence Reaver becomes an AD mana item with 20% CDR, Infinity Edge increases auto attack damage by 25% (except on hit effects, but does apply to spell onhits like Ezreal Q and GP Q).

For AP itemization, Morellonomicon needs to be nerfed and other AP items need buffs. Candidates for buffs are: Hourglass getting it's active reduced to 90 second cooldown and potentially a bit more stats. Luden's Echo just needs -200 gold cost. Deathcap could use less cost as well. Void Staff needs to be 40% bonus magic resist.

For tanks, I'd nerf Sunfire, buff deadman's slightly (like 5 armor or 50 HP), and rework Thornmail (So it does it's job of whatever it should do. Shouldn't be just an anti-Jax item.)

For bruisers I'd make Sterak's Gage melee only (still procs in the ranged forms of duel-range champions), make sure Deadman's was buffed, then make Sterak's and Maw stack again (ranged champions can't get Sterak's now so..), and keep BoRK good on bruisers not just ADCs.

For AD assassins I'd nerfed lethality to 0.50 + the other 0.50 based on enemy's level, then give Edge of Night a new passive.

For onhit itemization, rework Rageblade and don't give it Phantom Hit. Make it just a normal 3000 gold or so hybrid item. Make a new 3600 Gold item that gives 70% attack speed, 7% movement speed (remember zeal wouldn't give crit anymore, probably AD), 15 AD, and a passive that procs Phantom Hit every third hit.

As for new items, 1 more item to build out of the following: item 3191 , item 3155 (wouldn't stack with Maw, hell this could be the new EoN, no the shield wouldn't be large like Maw), item 3136 , and item 3802 .

AazzlanoFeb 12, 20176 votes

Not really. What we need are more BALANCED items. The reason that champs build the same thing is because those items are just broken, and the other items are shit. If there was actual balance, you would pick what was appropriate for that game, considering your and their team. Like you would pick items more for their passives/actives, and not just what is the bigger massive power spike which let's you invalidate your opponents. The fact that you have many items which are heavily over gold efficient on top of having (usually multiple) passive(s)/active just skews the game too much IMO. The fact that some items are like almost never built should be an obvious sign that the other items are simply better.

Some people say that some items can't be buffed without becoming broken. And I agree with that. However, the problem is usually that the other items are built because they are the ones who are overtuned.

I'm a mage player, but they did a good thing with the toning down of mage items, but obviously AD items need to calm the fuck down too. They actually reduced the price of Long Sword a few years back, which is skewing the "effective gold" that AD is valued at as a baseline. So since Long Sword is cheaper, AD is 'worth less gold' therefore they can validate having an item which is x% gold efficient. When in reality, they just artificially reduced that value by making the baseline item cheaper. And even then, many AD items are massively gold efficient, with some items reaching over 150% gold efficiency (like why?) and that's when considering them with the "low value" of AD, which is bullshit anyway. They are EVEN MORE gold efficient. If they globally toned the fuck down out of all the items (like they did with AP), balancing each item would be a lot easier since they are less volatile. And it would then make strategically building items an actual thing.

Troll for TrumpFeb 13, 20175 votes

The game doesn't need more items.

It needs a balancing of the items. They keep adding new items, but also gutting items out of oblivion.

item 3512 is one of the latest ones. It was great, and Riot... hit it really hard. item 3107 item 3814 may follow suit item 3109 might be overbuffed, and then nerfed back into nothing What they do to item 3153 is the best option.

But when they do item reworks like Botrk, the power levels need to be adjusted accordingly. Adding just a targeted slow was good. But the most recent PBE change, which extends the cc by up to 10 seconds based on the AAs is.. a little too much. These types of things will result the same as the item 3124 rework.

This also extends to the champions. We don't need to keep adding new champions. Often adding new champions creates controversy, raises power levels, and even knocks out other champs out of the meta. It's best to rework all champs so they're on the same power level. Sometimes, these ideas may fail: Vladimir (questionable) Fizz Mordekaiser Skarner , but you will still have successes.

Poppy was strong for a while(arguably still is), but still wasn't even super obnoxious. When she was meta, she did have the problems that all tank top laners did when they were meta: Unkillable, cc monster, and enough dmg to kill things. But it wasn't as unbearable as it was, in, for instance, the S5 cinderhulk meta with Sejuani Chogath

ModAcademy KaynFeb 13, 20175 votes

I'm just saying, but Zz'rots deserves to be where it is now.

Ariel the CruelFeb 13, 20173 votes

Zz'rot is better for building monster waves now since it doesn't push as far.

Troll for TrumpFeb 13, 20174 votes

It's too slow and niche now. Like pigeonholed yorick. That may be what Riot is going for, but pigeonhole, niche things are always bad.

item 3056 for diving, for instance (it has other flaws as well, but still) Yorick is hardly seen anywhere. His rework was cool thematically, but I really don't like the pigeonhole. Most yorick mains didn't seem to like that either. Chogath mage goodbye. He has to tank now. It's still too early to call, but Cho's always been a poor tank. Kassadin anti-mage was really bad to deal with for many years Aatrox overbearing or useless Tryndamere overbearing or useless Heimerdinger It's sorta like what yorick does, but no one likes playing against him. It's not that enjoyable to play as him,although that's an opinion

Niche items or champions can only be healthy/balanced well in rock-paper-scissor games like Dota 2, where it's much more important to know what counters what. This is a game that's more based on mechanical skill than in-game knowledge, and enjoys having OTPs

TeCoolMageFeb 13, 20171 votes

Zz'rot is much more easy to use and general but a lot of people don't realise it's a completely different item now.

On poke champions like Varus, Lux and Xerath (but not really Ziggs) and on zoning mages like Orianna and Anivia it does a lot of damage to the tower.

SpecterVonBarenFeb 13, 20171 votes

Shame those champs never build it then...

TeCoolMageFeb 14, 20171 votes

Which is why it's clear a lot of people don't realise it's a completely different item now

SpecterVonBarenFeb 13, 20171 votes

{quoted} But it wasn't as unbearable as it was, in, for instance, the S5 cinderhulk meta with

Uh... replace Chogath with Gragas

Troll for TrumpFeb 13, 20171 votes

Yeah gragas did that too. I didn't play a ton during s5, but I remembered a lot of people complaining about Cho.

SpecterVonBarenFeb 13, 20171 votes

Eh, Cho wasn't really dominant because of Cinderhulk, he could jungle decently but was nothing to write home about. If he was complained about it was because of his performance in top lane.

FaustavianFeb 12, 20173 votes

item 1083 item 3252 item 3050 item 3056 are some items you might've forgotten about

JavelinJoeFeb 12, 20172 votes

item 3060 item 3222 item 3053 item 3091 are in the same boat too. I might see 1 of them every 50 or so games

DaNinadFeb 14, 20171 votes

{quoted}

are some items you might've forgotten about

that third item is broken

RaoulFeb 12, 20172 votes

What this game needs is a serious Item Rework, no more Items that are just good at everything and therefore alot of items that do one thing good, one extra thing ok and thats it. It would solve alot of problem this game currently has if you actually had to give up sth to get the stats you want...

AthronFeb 13, 20172 votes

Um, Ap's are only building the same thing because unlike Ad we have no choice in a variety of items, then when one of our items prove to be too good it get's nerfed to hell, Zhonyas, Rylai's what is next?

SeekêrFeb 13, 20172 votes

I've always thought it was silly how riot preaches about diversity and then their big release ends up being 1 new item. Like 1 item is gonna bring any diversity xD

[zombie-brand-mindblown]

ÈvilMortyFeb 13, 20172 votes

I just want 1 or 2 more ap items that give armor

duckarpFeb 13, 20172 votes

It's not like we need more items.. We just need items to be VIABLE, so we have actual diversity like Riot intended in the first place.

TricolorStarFeb 13, 20172 votes

I miss Will of the Ancients.

But there's lots of items people don't build because they either don't understand where they go or they're too scared to break the extremely restricted meta.

Items like item 3056 item 3109 item 3050 are so useful but people don't build them cuz they have no reason too

SpecterVonBarenFeb 13, 20172 votes

item 3050 Is too much of a crapshoot for me to justify getting as a support. There's no reason to buy an item that can go off when not needed and then not be back up when it is needed. Why buy something like that (Especially since my ADC can get plenty of crit anyway) when I can get another support item that has consistent power or at least an active that I can control?

Glory ln DeathFeb 13, 20172 votes

People don't use Ohmwrecker because they don't actually understand how to use it correctly. They read the active and think, "Oh, 3 seconds of no turret shots, that's only going to stop 2 or 3 shots. That's kind of crap." The real power of Ohmwrecker is how it resets turret aggro.

You don't use it at the beginning of a dive to reduce damage. You use it when you're about to kill the enemy so you don't have to run out of the turret's range before going back to take down the turret. Or to redirect aggro away from your squishy team mate mid-fight.

Prophet of UrgodFeb 13, 20171 votes

When should one buy it? Obviously not too late when most towers are gone, I always want to buy it but am too afraid to because I feel I am missing out on early damage and am in solo queue. I also play a lot of Urgot, any more advice based on what I stated?

Glory ln DeathFeb 14, 20171 votes

I'd say it really depends on who you play. Champions who like damage probably shouldn't get it, especially early. Urgot might be good with it, but I'm not really sure. Tanky top laners and junglers are probably the best with it. For top laners, I'd say someone who has decent waveclear potential even without damage items and likes to get tanky items first.

Sion can be a good example of this - get a slow push going (kill just the caster minions so your wave won't die, but it won't push forward - melee minions do low damage but have lots of health, so they take a while to die - it will get you basically a double wave of minions pushing to their turret) and zone the enemy away from your own minions. Then get the jungler to come as the wave gets to the enemy tower - dive them, activate Ohmwrecker a bit before they will die/be forced to run, then take the tower basically for free.

It could be pretty good on a tanky jungler, as well, since you can use it every two minutes when you gank and don't have to worry about where they are in the lane.

TheMinezFeb 13, 20172 votes

Mirage blade. 60 AD, 15% crit, 12% lifesteal. Counterplay to assassins in the form of a 350 unit blink active directly away from the last champion you auto attacked in the past 3 seconds. (Left a mark that revealed stealthed champs and champs in bushes, would probably change to only revealing camo and bush champs.) And then there are the book items, flesheater, exc. I really enjoyed BMB.

XIII VanitasFeb 13, 20172 votes

There's a lot more variety now than when I started playing at the mid/end of S4.

Marksmen have many different builds and we also have AP carries bot (like Ziggs or Veigar) every now and then; supports have many items specifically tailored for their role and light fighters and assassins have multiple options.

The only builds that are kinda lacking diversity are the ones of mages (Morellonomicon clearly outshines Athene's Unholy Grail and there's no offensive mr option for ranged carries, since Abyssal Scepter is not that great on them) and tanks (the available cdr options are limited to only 3 items, one of which gives mana, so if you're manaless you're kinda screwed).

Prophet of UrgodFeb 13, 20172 votes

I've been mulling this idea in my head for awhile but am not sure if it is true: does having more items but they are all weaker increase diversity? The reason I am inclined to believe so is that having many items can lead to numerous opportunities to change one's stratagem or there are enough items to aid in niche situations. Keeping them all relatively weak ensures that no item is crowding out the rest.

I know that there will be those items that will be the most popular due to certain situations arising more frequently than others, but perhaps this would change along with metas. Any thoughts?

Hyrum GraffFeb 14, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=Prophet of Urgod,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=NZ01HRV6,comment-id=002f,timestamp=2017-02-13T20:29:00.420+0000)

I've been mulling this idea in my head for awhile but am not sure if it is true: does having more items but they are all weaker increase diversity? The reason I am inclined to believe so is that having many items can lead to numerous opportunities to change one's stratagem or there are enough items to aid in niche situations. Keeping them all relatively weak ensures that no item is crowding out the rest.

I know that there will be those items that will be the most popular due to certain situations arising more frequently than others, but perhaps this would change along with metas. Any thoughts?

It matters more how relatively weak or strong they are to each other than how weak or strong they are in absolute terms.

If a handful of items are bad, but all the other items are even worse, then everyone is going to pick that first handful, even if they're bad compared to today's items.