Too many broken champs, we need more bans

1234123124123412·Oct 1, 2019·9 votes·5,574 views

Title basically, give me more bans, we had 3 before, we have 5 then and now we need more , give the first pick 3 bans and everyone else 1, i dont think 7 bans per team is too much, its basically needed now.

24 Comments

KeiagaOct 1, 20194 votes

Its not needed. Just learn the how to play against the champs giving you issues

VentiraOct 1, 20194 votes

But what if the issue is "This champion has insane health regen, is surprisingly durable, and has an aoe resetting True Execute" What do.

KeiagaOct 1, 20192 votes

You talking about pyke?

1.) He's not "surprisingly durable" since he has no sort of damage reduction or shield in his kit, and the only bulk in his core build is from his support item and item 3814

2.) His health regen only happens when he's out of sight and his only escape is a single dash on a long cooldown that he has to use offensively. Which means all you have to do is pick a champ that can burst down this squishy assassin with the income of a support, or CC him long enough for your teammate to blow him up.

3.) His execute has a very small window of health for it to work. You know exactly when he's able to execute you or a teammate, and when you can predict it, you can completely ruin his gameplay with any type of heal.

VentiraOct 1, 20193 votes

I have been surprised quite a few times by Aftershock Pykes refusing to die as fast I think they should, and his execute window scales as he gets items, and it's, to the extent of my knowledge, impossible to predict his execute window once he has 1-2 items. Lawd knows I can't tell when he's capable of executing me until he's executed me.

KeiagaOct 1, 20191 votes

"Pyke is tanky because i personally have underestimated a rune several times" doesnt have a whole lot of weight behind it as far as arguments go.

And his ult isnt very hard to predict either

VentiraOct 1, 20192 votes

Like, I know it's coming, that much is a given, but there's not much I can do about it. It comes out too fast to be manually dodged, or even flashed unless I flash just before he ults. No support has a burst self heal outside of Soraka's R and Nami W, and both of those champs get destroyed by Pyke's cc in the first place, so they're probably weak and behind to begin with.

KeiagaOct 1, 20191 votes

Unless he baits you,you have all the warnings that hes about to ult. Health is getting low. You hear him in stealth, or hes charging his hook or he just dashed in. If youre expecting it and your ping isnt terrible you have enough time to react to it.

Most heals can tip someone over the execute ghreshold considering how narrow it is. Even the summoner spell.

VentiraOct 1, 20191 votes

It's not that narrow a window. It's 250 base, without accounting for his weird health/lethality scalings. At level 6, that means he can Execute at 1/4th of your soraka or nami's health (assuming they have no health from items at the time, which they typically don't, starting Frost Fang) of your average support's health.

For reference, Pyke's ult is 250-550 (based on level) +80% bonus AD, PLUS 1.5 per 1 Lethality. And most pykes typically end up getting a fair bit of Lethality and Bonus AD from Duskblade and Youmuu's.

KeiagaOct 1, 20191 votes

Lets do a bit of math. Let's discount runes since those are a little harder to add in.

At level 6, Pyke will have probably, tier 2 support item and boots. That means his execute threshold is 250. A soraka(using her to represent any squishy healer or adc) at level 6 has 837 health.

That means Pyke can ult raka at about 30% of her health. Which is good. Until you add in the fact that that Heal is 165. Meaning she'd have to be below 85 health for pyke to execute her, which is a small enough amount that a single auto attack would kill her. Meaning no one would ever let themselves get that low, and if they do, they'd be dead anyways.

At level 18 though, Pyke with his standard build can execute at

550 +85 + 168 =803 HP. That's quite a lot, but Heal at level 18 is 365.

So even if the team has no healers, A pyke can only reliably execute someone if they get below 438 HP. Which, on a Soraka that has 0 additional health, would be 23% HP. But then again, at that late into the game, most single skills from any damage-dealing champ could kill Soraka at 23% HP.

TLDR, the only way Pyke can get executes is on targets low enough that they would have died to any other skill anyways.

VentiraOct 1, 20191 votes

This is true yes, but alot of spells have more reaction time then pyke's ult, especially because his ult is AoE, and surprisingly sizeable one at that. You have less then a fraction of a second to respond to his ult's animation, and at that point it's up to the Pyke to whiff his ult, rather then any meaningful counterplay in the form of dodging, especially as a support because supports are not mobile.

Heal is not a reliable way of clutching out of his ult's threshold, as he, like plenty of supports, will probably have a sizeable chunk of CDR, and his ult as a 2 minute CD at level 6, and heal has literally double that at all stages, meaning Pyke can nuke a lane down effectively twice per Heal use.

Soraka's ult heal isn't totally reliable either, as it also has a 40 second longer cooldown then Pyke's ult, in fact, as the game goes on, the gap between Soraka's ult and Pyke's ult becomes a 50 second difference, meaning it gets even LESS reliable. leaving Nami as the only support champion capable of reliable denying Pyke's reset. Not a whole lotta options.

KeiagaOct 1, 20191 votes

Heal is a summoner spell and just an example I used to illustrate that any lane can have a counter to pyke's ult without having to spend money on a certain item like zhonya's, or even use a certain champ to counterpick. It's not the best counter, but it is a completely free, 100% available counter in 100% of games against pyke. and one that's pretty common in botlane regardless.

VentiraOct 1, 20191 votes

And it's only a very mild counter at that, unfortunately, and with how Pyke's ult work, you cannot afford to ever let him get an execute, as the sheer amount of gold he generates gets out of hand way too fast.

LightswornLanceOct 1, 20191 votes

Why do you act like there is no counterplay, right after saying there is counter play? You have .75 seconds to dodge or even just walk out. Half the champions in the game have some kind of movement speed boost or dash to get out of it. If pyke misses his ult execute because you heal, it's likely you will win that 2v2 and then at that point they should be unable to fight you 2v2 until their jungler comes.

Kai GuyOct 1, 20191 votes

People are constantly told to pick hard damage hyper carry. Those champions almost always lack good CC power. Its not a surprise why a lot of folks struggle vs champions who require CC to counter. When Everybody mindlessly goes with feast or famine comps that all in on damage... well when they are behind others doing the exact same playstyle it shouldn't be a shocker why they struggle.

Boards does not give good advice to boards. The fact folks tilt when told "just CC them" rather then actually just CC them is a shame.

LightswornLanceOct 1, 20191 votes

Well it's aftershock for the 2.5 seconds its active he takes alot less damage.

preternaturalOct 1, 20192 votes

{quoted}

But what if the issue is "This champion has insane health regen, is surprisingly durable, and has an aoe resetting True Execute" What do.

play janna into them.

Ben SwoIoOct 1, 20192 votes

{quoted}

Its not needed. Just learn the how to play against the champs giving you issues

This comment blows.

MrEndsOct 1, 20192 votes

how would u split up the bans evenly then? also there are 10 total bans not 5 total but it is 5 per team. If they wanted to add more bans then they'd make it 2 per person, 20 total and 10 per team.

The KombinatorOct 1, 20191 votes

They increased the number of bans from 4 to 6 when there were ~60 champions. Going with that base logic the number of bans should be ~10% of the total champions.

In current case 14 bans in total. I would make 2 bans for the first 3, and 1 for the other 2. This would be 8 to 16 ban. Depending on the number of dual bans.

JaspersOct 1, 20191 votes

14 isn't right though as with how it works now, you could potentially ban only 5 champs because of the duplication thing. Up it to 20 (2 per person) and people can not only ban the champ who they find current disgusting but a counter too.

The KombinatorOct 1, 20191 votes

{quoted}

14 isn't right though as with how it works now, you could potentially ban only 5 champs because of the duplication thing. Up it to 20 (2 per person) and people can not only ban the champ who they find current disgusting but a counter too.

I calculated that. With my style you could ban 8 to 16. 8 if everyone duplicates, and 16 if none. The point is to make an average 14. And in my experience double ban is not that often. You still couldn't double ban within the team itself. If the first pick bans someone you can't ban that again.

FanekinhaFeb 9, 20201 votes

RIOT do u fkng job and balance champs...2021 30 BANS? phatetic...price to pay with new runes system lool so so so BAD CALL....you guys are paying the wrong DEVs...