Honestly, who the fk's responsible for buffing Brand's passive?

BeatzBoyFTW·Apr 23, 2018·51 votes·13,148 views

Take the fking buff back. There's literally 0 fun in having to deal against this high damaging "support" as a tank support like Alistar or even Braum.

29 Comments

FrostQueensPlaneApr 23, 201844 votes

Funny because there's nothing fun playing against alistar or braum period.

meowwow7Apr 23, 20185 votes

it is when you are good with displacements or in alistar's case playing an off meta poppy support

DanjengApr 23, 20181 votes

You could argue playing a mobile champion into Brand. Anyway, Morg is a better pick into Alistar.

flibitydooApr 23, 20183 votes

I don't mind playing against them

in lane they offer very little pressure so you can farm up as much as you'd like or harass'em (provided you don't give them level 2 advantage and get cheesed).

later on because of that lack of actual lane pressure that either of those tank supports exert, you actually get to play your endgame fantasy which is the most fun period. Least fun champs IMO are those whos endgame fantasy is "I have none, but I can dumpster the enemy so hard early game that they can't have their endgame fantasy either"

TwinkieProApr 23, 201825 votes

Nerf his base and increase his scaling. forced to build ap for the same amount of damage.

CelebrimborrApr 23, 201811 votes

have you seen a brand support that does not build ap

VoraciousXApr 23, 20187 votes

{quoted}

have you seen a brand support that does not build ap

Nerfing base damage means less damage early, which is what makes Brand Support good. Scaling would mean he needs to build damage to have it.

Spank the FoxApr 23, 20184 votes

{quoted}

Nerfing base damage means less damage early, which is what makes Brand Support good. Scaling would mean he needs to build damage to have it.

You missed the point. Brand DOES build damage in the support role, buffing his ratios just makes him better post lane while making sure he never returns mid because less base damage = less chance to clear a wave = unviable mid.

You need to introduce mechanics vs creeps to make him want to go mid again eg proccing his passive.

I illustrateApr 23, 20183 votes

Yea but he's only a big deal early game when you don't have as much sustain or max hp

LordGeovanniApr 23, 20182 votes

well thank riot for removing all the things that item 1006 built into. except the gimped item 2053 line

VoraciousXApr 24, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Spank the Fox,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=LavQ75Qc,comment-id=0002000000000000,timestamp=2018-04-23T09:40:25.142+0000)

You missed the point. Brand DOES build damage in the support role, buffing his ratios just makes him better post lane while making sure he never returns mid because less base damage = less chance to clear a wave = unviable mid.

You need to introduce mechanics vs creeps to make him want to go mid again eg proccing his passive.

He has mechanics vs creeps, just no one uses it anymore because his W is so much stronger. I assumed the person who said to nerf his base and up his scaling was suggesting a nerf to support brand, not to try to move him to mid lane(although more scaling would help him in the mid lane area than the support role because he's picked support for his high base damage early)

iPooUnicornsApr 23, 20183 votes

The point is he is able to function with very little AP because of his high base damage.

Even when he's mid he doesn't get high AP items.

An "ideal" Brand build looks something like.

item 3092 if Support

item 3285 if Mid, and he really only needs a item 3802

item 3151 item 3020 item 3165 item 3135 item 3116

Really his biggest damage items are:

item 3020 for MPen item 3916 for MPen item 3151 for more DoT item 3135 for MPen

Any other AP items won't really increase his damage output by much, he really only needs magic penetration.

Why? Look at his base damage vs scaling (all sourced from the league wikia):

Brand's abilities set his targets ablaze upon damaging them each second, dealing 4% of their maximum health as magic damage over 4 seconds, stacking up to 3 times, for a maximum of 12% of their maximum health over the duration, and empowering his abilities against them

Entirely base damage, no scaling aside from level.

At 3 stacks, an area around the target is marked, which explodes after 2 seconds. All enemies struck are dealt 12% - 16% (based on level) 「 (+ 1.5% per 100 AP) 」 of their maximum health as magic damage. The explosion will still trigger if the target dies to the third ability or during the delay.

For the damage from the AP ratio to come close to the base damage, he would need more than 1000 AP.

Q: MAGIC DAMAGE: 80 / 110 / 140 / 170 / 200 (+ 55% AP)

Average base damage and AP ratio, but it isn't really a "damage" spell

W: MAGIC DAMAGE: 75 / 120 / 165 / 210 / 255 (+ 60% AP) INCREASED DAMAGE: 93.75 / 150 / 206.25 / 262.5 / 318.75 (+ 75% AP)

Here we find his only spell with a decent AP ratio, but it already has high base damage.

E: MAGIC DAMAGE: 70 / 90 / 110 / 130 / 150 (+ 35% AP)

Low base damage and low AP ratio, but it's a point click spell, it shouldn't do much damage

R: MAGIC DAMAGE: 100 / 200 / 300 (+ 25% AP)

Again, high base damage, bounces four times, can only bounce twice to a single target, leaving the AP ratio to have a max of 50% AP. At max rank, he would need at least 600 AP for it to get more damage from his AP.

TwinkieProApr 23, 20181 votes

{quoted}

have you seen a brand support that does not build ap

The support ap item doesnt give much as it is, not to mention support brand gets significantly less gold, cutting his damage a fair amount in mid game. All speculation and practice could hold differently but that's my thought for it.

xelakerApr 23, 20181 votes

generally he gets a fair amount of gold because dingus people like op charge into him like he is every other support and don't give him the respect he deserves and feed him. this is coming from a guy who played a fair amount of brand supp last season.

Starcraft243verApr 23, 20187 votes

I wouldnt call "responsible" the one who buffed brand's passive.

ResolutionApr 23, 20183 votes

Maybe don't pick Alistair into Brand... If your picking melee tank supports into Brand - you've already lost from being out drafted.

Your 100% complaining about being hard countered when in reality if you chose your champions better you wouldn't be at such a disadvantage.

Brand is kinda like Garren in low elos, most players end up not knowing what to do against him. Yet if you look at Plat+ he's the 10th best support overall. Janna, Nami, Morganna are all better. I think it has to do with people not being able to kite and dodge skill shots. Almost every Brand complain thread is from people in Bronze and Silver.

notice me Sin piApr 24, 20181 votes

bronze n silver lives matter tho

Who Fed RuApr 23, 20182 votes

Professor WardApr 23, 20182 votes

Lock kill potential and kill him at level two where he blows up like a balloon in a needle factory......

** If you let brand hang around and not abuse his weakness of being a china doll, youre going to lose, and deserve to.**

Stats from my last game against brand and i understand im posting one random game but the technique is there, abuse his weakness in hp, shut him down early, and he becomes worthless.

Nautilus- 1/1/16 (17:1 KDA)

Brand- 0/11/5 (0.45:1 KDA)

Daddy AntsApr 23, 20182 votes

{quoted}

Take the fking buff back. There's literally 0 fun in having to deal against this high damaging "support" as a tank support like Alistar or even Braum.

Alistar is busted but somehow evades getting nerfed.

Braum deserves to be beaten around in lane for a change.

LordGeovanniApr 23, 20182 votes

For a change Braum hasnt had Any significance since his release he rides on being afk in lane and uses his q and ult the same way janna uses her q and ult but if braum uses his e hes practically intentional feeding because riot nerfed the hell out of Hp on items so his q damage is garbage (and just before they nerfed his q ratio too) and the damage reduction on his E doesnt scale because all of the health items are nerfed the resistance items arent good generally and riot removed everything that builds from item 1006 except gimped item 2053 items so braum (like other support tanks and tanks in general) have no way to sustain in lane after body blocking for an adc versus safe back line champions who have to mess up for you to even get to them

Bloodrage ShadowApr 23, 20182 votes

Last I checked Brand is kind of a counter to tanks lol. Why are you complaining about Brand specifically and not something like Zyra or Vel'Koz?They are both more annoying than Brand imo. You can actually dodge Brands abilities minus his E and R. Brand is squishy as hell before stacking his HP items and also immobile so have your jungler camp the lane.

If you still think he's so frustrating to play against as a support then ban him. Riot needs to nerf other op crap right now, Brand isn't an issue right now unlike Janna/Lulu/Morg to name a few.

Tomoe GozenApr 23, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Take the fking buff back. There's literally 0 fun in having to deal against this high damaging "support" as a tank support like Alistar or even Braum.

You do know that Brand is a mage, right? He's not an enchanter. You're not supposed to be taking him on as a tank, he's supposed to be doing damage to you if you have no intention of engaging him at all.

LordGeovanniApr 23, 20182 votes

Tanks are supposed to counter mages item 3020 item 3165 item 3151 . item 3102 has better mr than every real tank item unconditionally building out of null magic mantle while tanks get items that build out of item 1057 that dont have as much mr except item 3193 under its condition and it cuts your damage and item 3091 again on its condition that most tanks cant use because its stats are garbade and riot locks them into clunky windups and slow moving spells into tanks while if any ranged class has a wind up they cry clunky riot first over buffs it then removes the wind up without taking away the over buffed damage.

Tomoe GozenApr 25, 20181 votes

Tanks counter damage in general, not mages.

Mages kill squishies (Marksmen, Assassins if they catch them).

Marksmen look to take down objectives and eventually, pierce the defense of tanks and also look for opportunities to take down primary damage dealers with proper setups from supports.

Assassins look for opportunities to outmannouver and kill the zone lockdown of mages and take out primary targets to allow their team to have an advantage in that regard.

The way League works now is that Marksmen do everything, Mages tend to perform a mid supporting role, Supports are way too strong babysitters for squishy Marksmen and Tanks are either too tanky or not tanky enough to deal with the primary issue of being damage sponges.

Assassins are again, either too strong or not strong enough to do what they need to do. If they're weak, Mages with their utility do a better job (and maybe AoE damage) than Assassins.

LordGeovanniApr 28, 20181 votes

Tanks make damage less effective in the amount they do but they dont counter anything as the damage still kills them in a short amount of time.

Jon 678910Apr 23, 20181 votes

The thing you need to realise is that people have no sympathy for tanks. Most perform at or worse than average across the board, but people would rather have "interactive" lanes, with an enchanter on each side.

I'll admit that the brand passive buff was a problem, but it's more noticeable on tanks. The fact that tank play rates are low means that this won't be addressed.

guseul88Apr 24, 20181 votes

Meddler. And I know this for a fact because before the Brand buffs his account had a 39% win rate or something like that, on brand over about 40 games.

Then we have Irelia...??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????