Ya'll are acting like riot is taking away your ability to use the mouse...mid season riot is gonna try and fix the acd mess they made, be patient then have a bitchfit if it falls through
Alicetaria29 votesDo you remember when ADCs/Top lane & junglers had to use their mana consuming abilities to deal damage? No? Because they don't need any kind of mana to deal damage, they just right click, auto attack and kill anyone squishy like mages/supports with 2 auto attacks.
ADCs can dish out over 2k damage with a single right click, meanwhile mages need to do a whole rotation, sometimes 2 rotations to deal half the amount of damage a single ADC deals with ONE FUCKING AUTO ATTACK.
Who needs to be balanced more, really? Simple logic, not that Riot's balance team knows what balance or logic is, even if it hit them square in the fucking face.
Spearsus2 votesDo you remember when ADCs/Top lane had to use their mana consuming abilities to deal damage? No? Because they don't need any kind of mana to deal damage, they just right click, auto attack and kill anyone squishy like mages/supports with 2 auto attacks.
ADCs can dish out over 2k damage with a single right click, meanwhile mages need to do a whole rotation, sometimes 2 rotations to deal half the amount of damage a single ADC deals with ONE FUCKING AUTO ATTACK.
Who needs to be balanced more, really? Simple logic, not that Riot's balance team knows what balance or logic is, even if it hit them square in the fucking face.
But...but ADCs are b-balanced! Said no one ever.
SSShutTheDuckUp1 votesIndeed. If you ask ADC mains they are actually weak
nelogis3 votesAight 2k damage you are out of your mind with that one but I know where you are coming from.
I know that the phrase "they are working on it" kind of gets old (it died of old age by now I think) but they said that something is coming in patch 8.10/8.11 to fix that. I mean.... whats 2 more patches after enduring this bullshit it for the past year right? r.... right?
Anyway I wouldn't want to be on these boards if that patch whiffs and at the end ADCs come out even stronger and mages got net nerfed. I don't even think a bio-hazard suite will hold against what would come after that.
Alicetaria10 votesThis is literally from my match history, Cait with 100% crit chance and not even a full inventory, she dealt 2.4k damage per auto attack, enjoy: https://i.imgur.com/qggvBIf.png?2 https://i.imgur.com/kYCDkIi.png?1
M00ndanc32 votesI think you forgot how cait works. She has her passive head shot that can crit. This means she already has a bonus damage that your not thinking about. And since she doesn't headshot on every auto this means that she couldn't have been doing that much damage every auto. The only way she would get more than maybe 4 headshots off is if she either placed a trap under someone who was cced or someone accidently stepped on one and ate a full headshot rotation (W, AA, E, AA). Lastly Thats the largest crit she did all game, meaning unless everyone on your team didn't build armor, she probably got it clearing out a raptor camp on the way to a fight, because everyone knows that an adc will randomly take jg farm.
nelogis10 votesThis is the LARGEST critcal strike, not the average critical strike or something.
I don't even know if this applies to only champs, she could have literally hit a caster minion for 2.4k
Also I'm guessing this was a headshot.
So no she doesn't deal 2k damage PER auto attack. I get that ADCs are overtuned but saying they deal (A NET AMOUNT OF) 2k damage per auto attack is a straight up lie and you know that too.
Also it's a lie saying that a mage rotation deals 1k or even 500 damage.
A single spell of a full build mage deals more than 500 damage easily.
Viktor will blow an ADC up with his rotation and that rotation takes around 2 seconds to finish.
Alicetaria3 votesViktor will blow an ADC up with his rotation and that rotation takes around 2 seconds to finish.
The same goes to an adc, but they do it in less time, with more damage and without wasting one drop of their mana, just right click without even bother.
The fact that this cait didn't even have a full inventory shows how much damage she can sstill deal while being BEHIND, now imagine if she had the same amount of kills I had? She'd be dishing out way more than 2.4k.
Largest critical or not, maybe her other critical strikes where of the same caliber in terms of damage output? I wasn't keeping an eye on her.
BiochemicalZombi2 votesWow she crit s red buff , gg unplayable 2.4k on redbuff with - armor, nerf crit pls, rework red buff pls.
If you honestly think that any adc can deal 2.4k crit on a champion without being miles ahead your delusional.
I go 20/8 on draven within 25mins and the highest I get in damage is 1.5k , with stattik, RFC, Q, and it’s a crit.
If that Caitlyn did anywhere near the caliber which you said of 2.4k hell I’ll be generous and say she only did 800 per crit. She would only need to auto 20-30ish times to get 20k dmg ( which is her total.
Stop taking numbers out of context to try to prove your point smh
nelogis1 votesThe same goes to an adc, but they do it in less time, with more damage and without wasting one drop of their mana, just right click without even bother.
I don't know about "less" time but if Viktors rotation doesn't kill the ADC for god knows why, then he is dead yeah. Keep in mind that Viktors range is by far superior to most ADCs.
The fact that this cait didn't even have a full inventory shows how much damage she can sstill deal while being BEHIND, now imagine if she had the same amount of kills I had? She'd be dishing out way more than 2.4k.
She was building her last item and that was going to be a shiv from what it looks like. So no raw damage added, if you ignore the shiv proc then she still deals the exact same damage.
A 500/0 Ori with full build will deal the same damage as a 0/500 Ori with full build.
So it doesn't matter if she was behind or not, the damage output would be the same if she was 60/0 and had the same items. Damage towards other champs would change, since they would be underleveled and way behind in gold than she is.
Largest critical or not, maybe her other critical strikes where of the same caliber in terms of damage output? I wasn't keeping an eye on her.
No ADC deals 2k crits per auto attack. Other than maybe full build, full damage, fully stacked Jhinsoos.
And even if they would do it, that isn't net damage. Let's take Ezreal, he has 90 armor (rounded down) at lvl 18. 90 armor equals to 47% physical damage reduction (rounded down). So you need to take away 47% of these "2k crits" to get the damage to champs. Also, that is the damage to a champ with 0 armor items, that is just his base armor.
SureMyBAD1 voteslearn not to step on traps, and you wont get heatshot + crit :]
Nielarken21 votes"Just wait until preseason" "Just wait until midseason" "Just wait until world's patch" "Just wait until preseason"
Same excuse different year.
Eedat7 votesWho has ever said just wait for worlds patch? People hate worlds patch. It's a patch guaranteed to completely disregard 99.999% of players and focus only on #LC$
SSShutTheDuckUp1 votesLast year they were saying "wait for the patch after worlds" for the nerfs on Ardent. They'd been saying that for like 5-6 months
Rman12713 votesI can get behind this, but honestly riot should probably not let the mana changes go through until the midseason patch as well.
xelaker1 votesCan exactly just wait for midseason to do anything though lol. I don't really get why midseason has to be this big game changer in the first place but w/e riot do what riot do I guess
Rman1276 votesWell if they put this change through right now, its literally going to throw every mage into the dumpster for atleast 2 weeks which is not going to go over well at all with the player base because Riot wants to play around with balance. ADC's will literally dominate even harder than they already do and it's just a recipe for disaster.
Eedat3 votesI disagree. Clumping too many changes together causes a lot of chaos and makes it extrodinarily difficult to pinpoint whats going on. This is the reason they don't do class reworks anymore. They need to be done separately to help streamline the fixes. I think they should have done bot lane changes first though. I can see how these changes are simpler though depending on the scale of the bot lane changes so it makes sense from a balancing sense to do they first. It just feels bad on the player end though
Eedat13 votesThey probably should hit ADC and Support first tbh. Kinda feels bad to be left with just the possibility of decent changes happening to bot lane some time in the undetermined future
HalcyonDweller3 votesAgreed but these mana changes are still a step in the right direction. Even if they should address problem classes first. But hell, maybe they figured out that nerfing marksmen would have left mages way too dominant and they're preemptively handling that. Who knows?
FilDaFunk13 votesI remember when ADCs had worse waveclear.
Cowgirl Ed12 votes"be patient then have a bitchfit if it falls through"
WE HAVE BEEN PATIENT FOR MORE THAN TWO YEARS WHEN CAN WE BE ANGRY? PLEASE TELL ME
2Charmnot2Charm8 votesI remember when 
cost 1600 gold and was THE RUSH item for mid laners in season 3/4.
ReshiKillim17 votesI remember when midlane mages built 
until it got reworked. Still miss it.
[sg-ahri-1]
Hong Kong Annie3 votesRemoving mana regen items was one of the biggest mistakes riot has ever made. The current problem of mage items stacking mana and people just spamming spells is a direct result of that.
Late For Tea8 votesMana and CD reduction are so abundent nowadays, that players have been spoiled, being able to spam their skills without risk. That said, this change is very bad timing, as Riot should probably have brought ADCs in line first. This just paints the picture that they don't at all care about the ADC problem.
ReshiKillim3 votesRiot's communication about the ADC changes and other stuff.
[sg-ahri-2]
Late For Tea3 votesThanks, I saw it before. While I know they have said they are working on ADCs for midseason, the timing of these balance patches is off. They want to release multiple smaller patches instead of the usual 1 large patch for the ADC balance. So why not do it now, instead of during midseason? If it's not finished, then they should be working on that instead of these mage changes. If they don't want to impact the pro-scene so heavily before MSI, then Im curious why they didn't have any problems reworking mage itemization & mana consumption midseason.
Also another Ryze "rework"...
ReshiKillim1 votesAs someone who's been playing since the beginning of S2, I'd say it's because the mana changes are much easier to adapt to, for both playing and playing against, than the changes that will happening for marksmen. Since in the past, mana was far more limited than it is now, and the current mana changes move mages a bit back towards that.
Dark Nephthys1 votesAs someone who's been playing since the beginning of S2, I'd say it's because the mana changes are much easier to adapt to, for both playing and playing against, than the changes that will happening for marksmen. Since in the past, mana was far more limited than it is now, and the current mana changes move mages a bit back towards that.
Yea that's true though in the past the AP items had much much higher AP values as well which dropped a lot over the course of the past few seasons in favor for more mana and cdr. ADCs also have strong CDR options and ways to get mana to with 
while not losing anything for it (like mages lost AP for) which is one of the reason why I hate when people pretend that losing a bit of mana isn't that big of a deal (I'm not saying you are saying that though lol).
I just hope that they do tone down ADCs a bit as well.
OP Garen Support8 votesYes yes if we are being nostalgic. I also remember these things :
I remember that mages were stronger then ADC's hence the AP carry. I remember that assassins were stronger then ADC's you know assassin job is to kill squishes. I remember tanks living for longer then 10 seconds in teamfights. I remember the long games. I remember that adc's were not unskilled right click bursting champions but were the actual carries when late game cam(45-50 minutes). I remember when we could buy mana potions. I remember when mage items did not have their 500 AP that was stolen from them. I remember having fun 1 vs 1 on mid and toplane. I remember when junglers were not so dominant and were actually punished for camping. I remember when we could ward side lanes. I remember when mages were fun to play. I remember when tanks were fun to play. I remember when true damage dealing cancers not existed on toplane. I remember when the game was actually fun. I remember where I could carry ranked alone just because I was a good player.
There you go. These past 2 years was only fun for botlane everyone else are pissed off at riot.
FutureCreator4 votesThere you go. These past 2 years was only fun for botlane everyone else are pissed off at riot.
Has it really? Playing ADC/Support has been torturous at least for me. You basically just HOPE your jungle/mid ganks your lane more than the enemy does. You have to pray you don't end up laning with someone who doesn't suffer from brain damage, since you'll be blamed anyway if your lane begins feeding.
As an ADC you have 0 agency for the first 10 minutes of the game and completely rely on your enemy either being retarded or you support being competent.
The only time you have fun is mid/late game and you're fed.
Mizaya1 votesQuestion. Did you forget about the massive powercreep on supports or do you really not believe that they're the main problem?
Anyways, I used to play old Xerath in S2 and I at least somewhat relate since Riot decided that having a late game long range artillery win-condition isn't allowed. Still bitter after 6 seasons about that rework, never had a champ that felt the same.
Fondling Gems5 votesAlso feel like mentioning that this change does improve the botlane issue a bit. By hurting mid laner's ability to waveclear and roam they take a bit of the pressure off botlane, helping to reduce the excess of snowballing.
Would I rather see bot lane changes? Yes. However I think that these mana changes are still good for the mid lane and do have a positive impact regarding the botlane issue.
M00ndanc31 votesit also changes how supports can use mana since it will be less effecient to spam mana as an enchanter or mage support.
Daunt5 votesPeople keep mixing up cows and frogs here. In this case mages and ADCs. Whenever another class gets changed people jump on the bandwagon to whine how ADCs are untouched. These comments are mostly coming from people that don't even play mid nor understand how its played out. Like look, i know y'all are frustrated with ADCs but this has nothing to do with them and this is actually a healthy change for midlane. Bring back the good old days where the resource bar actually matters in mid.
ReshiKillim4 votesI remember when giving midlaners blue buff in the early-ish game actually meant something besides CDR. Or just last hitting and only using abilities to waveclear when you needed to.
Warrior Princess4 votesYa'll are acting like riot is taking away your ability to use the mouse...mid season riot is gonna try and fix the acd mess they made, be patient then have a bitchfit if it falls through
And its REALLY hard for adcs to auto attack and do half everyones hp AMIRITE?
YuGiHo4 votes
passive is the old manaflow band but she still has mana problems, some mages eat allot of mana so people just dont play them.
Zed genius3 votesHaven't gone oom since season 4
Alicetaria7 votesZed Genius
Probably because you play zed, and he has literally free abilities and regains all of his energy in less than 5 seconds?
Zed genius2 votes10 regen per second with 200 energy max, do the math I also said "oom", like, out of mana, of course I am not reffering to my zed games
FutureCreator4 votesPlays mainly
"I haven't gone oom since season 4"
How is this possible?
Lauchmelder2 votesRegardless of that, if you frequently had mana problems since season 4 then you were spamming your abilities 24/7.
You literally have to be stupid to frequently run out of mana this season.
Eye Of Terror3 votes
They have something in common: AD
xJLx MCHammer2 votesYa'll are acting like riot is taking away your ability to use the mouse...mid season riot is gonna try and fix the acd mess they made, be patient then have a bitchfit if it falls through
That’s when not very Champion has their cool downs lowered
Dark Nephthys2 votesThis wouldn't be so bad if the mana gating they're doing now happened on the same patch as the ADC changes. But if this goes through then we'll have to deal with mages overall feeling worse while ADCs still stomp and carry for a whole patch (or 2 patches). Also we don't even know exactly what the ADC changes are, for all we know...ADCs might be getting even more buffs...So yes, we have reasons to be complaining.
Pheobos2 votesAs someone who likes playing tanks and fighters more then most other classes in the game. I still have to manage a lot of my mana, so I honestly dont feel like much is going to change for me personally. Atleast not in the way I play when I play mages.
