What are Riot's thoughts on the upcoming Diver updates?

xxxDogmanxxx··8 votes·1,451 views

I know its not confirmed or anything, but I'm sure quite a few people would really appreciate a few clues on how that's going.

Divers have been kinda left in the dirt for a long time, what with their outdated kits and their simple, linear gameplay. I think most people can agree that they do need a bit of sprucing up.

Personally, I'd like to know who Riot's looking at for major and minor reworks and what their goals are for these champions. I'm also curious on whether the reworked champions will end up following Riots current design philosophy of "positional variance" and "temporary windows of power", especially for the older champions like Xin Zhao and Tryndamere. That would be really awesome.

16 Comments

Ralanr2 votes

Diana, Xin, and Nocturne seem like primary candidates for a diver rework. Diana is considered too much of an assassin for her burst damage (when assassins are no longer about damage) so I think they should swap her E and R with each other (and balance them accordingly) to help enforce her sticky diver nature.

I don't know what can be done with Xin and Nocturne. Nocturne loses a lot of power in a coordinated environment, but I'm not sure you can fix that without changing him a lot.

GULAG 4 U1 votes

You forgot aatrox. Jeez.

Ralanr1 votes

Oh yeah, he exists.

GULAG 4 U1 votes

Gotta admit, I was super triggered

Ralanr1 votes

:P

Anonagon1 votes

I guess I'll say it before someone else does:

"ehhhh Tryndamere isn't a diver, he's a skirmisher please get it right even though there's very little effective difference between the classic skirmishers and divers"

I'll be back with real talk on Divers

Requiemsfire2 votes

Tryndamere doesn't have the tools to reach the enemy backline reliably just like Kled. That's what seperates him from Vi, Irelia, Warwick, Xin Zhao, pantheon etc.

Anonagon1 votes

I know what differentiates Trynd from a Diver. What I meant is that he is closer to a Diver than any of the modern Skirmishers, and that the OP shouldn't get downvoted because he misclassed this singular oudated champion, because the people on here tend to really be sticklers for their class definitions.

MLDzXnRRR1 votes

They are gonna update the vanguards next, divers are probably left for 2018.

xxxDogmanxxx3 votes

If that's true, that kinda sucks.

Anonagon5 votes

they haven't confirmed either, and I would imagine that the one who goes second will be ~ november 2017, like Assassins just were, not 2018

Glory ln Death1 votes

They confirmed that it's almost certainly vanguards in one of Meddler's streams.

Azteryz1 votes

im sure its either vanguards or divers but imo

Aatrox XinZhao MonkeyKing are in much more need of changes to make them more thematic than tanks like

Sejuani Nautilus Malphite

Teridax681 votes

I'd say Tryndamere and Xin Zhao are both examples of light fighters, rather than divers (they tend to build primarily for damage, rather than durability, and tend to have much more difficulty reaching the back line than, say, Irelia or Vi), but pedantry aside, I completely agree that this is a good time to have some preliminary discussion on divers, especially since Riot just released one with Camille, and made a dev blog about how she was intended to be a good model for the subclass.

While I agree that divers have issues of shallow gameplay and old, often rushed kits (a huge number of divers were made in Seasons 1-2, when Riot was pumping out a new champion every few weeks purely to generate more content), I think the biggest issue with the subclass right now is that it's generally overloaded, and has no definite weakness as a whole. Even light fighters, who are notorious for their overloaded kits, tend to be squishy, but divers are tanky DPS champions who also happen to have a ton of mobility, plus often some crowd control and burst. We even have some divers whose burst approaches that of assassins, with Lee Sin and Jarvan as some of the biggest examples (Riot even did a post on AD assassin Jarvan mid), so really, the only in-game feature they tend to not commonly have is ranged attacks (and even then, Lee and Jarvan both have poke). I feel the Diver Update would be a good time to strip divers of excess strengths, e.g. burst damage, but should also be the opportunity to give them a consistent weakness: as mentioned in the OP, gating all of their mobility, crowd control and utility behind heavy cooldowns, which they'd have to use sparingly over the course of a fight, would allow divers to keep diverse kits, as well as deal a baseline amount of DPS, without just filling in as off-tanks and pseudo-assassins in the process.

GULAG 4 U1 votes

Trynd isn't a diver

Teridax681 votes

That is what I said in the very first sentence: Tryndamere is a light fighter, not a diver. In any case, though, that should not detract from OP's main point.

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