Daily Reminder that ARAM is Still Not True Random

Limrick·Dec 19, 2016·33 votes·1,744 views

That is all.

33 Comments

FlahertyDec 19, 20164 votes

Daily reminder that no one except the small group of weirdos that exclusively play ARAM, for some reason, don't care.

Deep Terror NamiDec 20, 201615 votes

? It's the people that don't exclusively play ARAM that this is an issue for. The ARAM accounts are the ones that abuse it with a limited champion pool.

FlahertyDec 20, 20162 votes

Most people don't play ARAM enough to care that sometimes the randomness is very unfair to one team or that people will only unlock the 5 champions that are super strong on the map so they have a better chance at winning

LimrickDec 20, 20167 votes

I don't even bother touching ARAM because of that. It's supposed to be a fun game mode, but it's ruined by people that abuse the system.

FlahertyDec 20, 20164 votes

I probably play ARAM more frequently than average and I hardly run into people that "abuse" the system. And even so who cares? You don't play ARAM to win you play it to fuck around or practice teamfighting

WimbledofyDec 20, 20164 votes

"ruined by people that abuse the system" I own all the champs and win more than I lose, maybe you are just a terrible player. It's only a fun game mode if you let it be fun, if you complain about it of course it won't be fun.

BladegloryDec 20, 20161 votes

This kind of comment reminds of one time I got Varus. I got called an ARAM smurf by my allied Morgana, she did everything in her power to ruin the match for me (mainly taking relics from me) and refused to actually attempt to win. She just hated Varus so much that she even threw a few homophobic slurs toward me because I owned Varus at all. I spited her (and proved her right, strangely) by sniping the enemy team out and going something like 14/3 and carrying the game despite her nonsense.

I really wish I was exaggerating.

I don't really care if all champions are unlocked for ARAM, but I do think that complaining about "ARAM smurfs" is more along the lines of a witch-hunt than a major issue. You can't tell what other champs people own, and confirmation bias is sure to take part.

LimrickDec 20, 20167 votes

There is no valid argument against having it be true random.

FlahertyDec 20, 20163 votes

Every other game that has a "select random character" feature always chooses characters that you have unlocked, not all the characters available because doing so gets rid of part of the incentive of working towards unlocking the character. Why should ARAM be different?

LimrickDec 20, 20167 votes

Most of those games are fighting games with 15-30 characters, not 132. Also every character in fighting games is theoretically viable, but in ARAM, you can actually lose the game in the loading screen.

FlahertyDec 20, 20164 votes

The number of characters doesn't change the fact that it still has that effect. And you can have the theoretical best team and still lose because simply having a character doesn't mean you win it's how well the person can play it. There are only a handful of characters truly unviable in ARAM since most champions that have kits that don't go well with the map can build differently and coordinate with their team differently to still be relevant and win.

WimbledofyDec 20, 20161 votes

man so many people downvoting you :/ yet noone willing to really give a reasonable response.

FlahertyDec 20, 20161 votes

Yeah, but honestly I shouldn't be expecting much from people here.

Sir FuzziDec 20, 20161 votes

Actually, I've posed one. It's a TL;DR but the bottom line is that it's random anyway. And if everyone can trade everyone, rerolls become very public domain and then you'll probably see those champs anyway.

It's not that literally nobody owns Udyr, it's that very very few people care to play him and he (and many others) get rolled more preferentially. It's probably like a spectrum, from most to least rerolled.

The fact is, opening it up will probably most affect people who won't care, while people who still get bent out of shape over ARAM comps will find a new way to get bent out of shape when it turns out that this doesn't magically make the compositions one way or another.

In fact, it more globally encourages trading and rerolling to get teams that have more favorable composition since now, everyone can trade. Someone good at Morde can take that, meanwhile with nobody good at Aatrox, they roll him off. In the end, you probably just have to face on average better teams because everyone has the potential to get exactly who they want.

I just don't understand what 'true random' is supposed to mean. Removing any limitation on champion trading seems to be counter-intuitive.

LimrickDec 20, 20161 votes

Remove re-rolls. Easy enough.

The game mode is supposed to be for fun, and if the odds of the enemy team being entirely S-tier is extremely low in a true random environment, so it doesn't matter if you get Udyr if the enemy team might have Trynd or something else bad.

Sir FuzziDec 20, 20163 votes

That's one way of going about it, but doesn't that seem to be moving it over more to a flavour of its own mode?

This would also be a problem because there would still be many games decided right at the champion select, where particularly unfavourable comps (which crop up often) would simply get the short end of the stick. That doesn't seem very fun, and re-rolls at least offer a second or third shot per player.

Lastly, people have a nasty tendency to drop the game when they get saddled with a free-weeker they don't want. This would be problematic because queue times would probably go up and nobody likes that.

My compromise has always been to double free week and exclude classifications (Marksman and Support probably) to broadly sweep out a lot of the greater offenders for, shall we say, less rolling-on-sight. It would leaven out everyone's selections with a handful of new choices. If they have very few champs, the chances of them getting someone unfavourable are probably largely higher. Furthermore, they're likely to only be experienced with certain champs.

All that, of course, and they'll still probably drop the game when they get Udyr.

ninjaroxasDec 20, 20161 votes

Um idk not playing champions i don't want too play.there is a reason i dont own said champions

HemanthDec 20, 20161 votes

The RP from people who want to quickly make aram accounts

NJALoboDec 20, 20169 votes

[deleted]

FlahertyDec 20, 20164 votes

Nothing? Just responding to one of these ridiculous "daily reminder that such and such is blah blah unfair" whine threads that people have some compulsion to make every day because they have nothing better to do

Lintu PuckDec 20, 20163 votes

do YOU want to be on a team where no one knows how to play their champ against a team of people that do? I don't. aram is fine as is.

LimrickDec 20, 20163 votes

That's how it is now lol. ARAM only accounts that play the same 12 champs forever vs. a bunch of people trying to have fun but get Tryndamere.

Do you have any clue what true random means?

Lintu PuckDec 20, 20165 votes

oh I know what "True Random" is. it means people want every champion on the table so they don't have to worry about the boogeyman that is "ARAM Accounts" >.>

WimbledofyDec 20, 20162 votes

he may not know what true random means but you certainly don't either. No game in the world is true random, everything is psuedo-random. More champions being available doesn't make it true random or more random. If you think it does than you don't know what random means. You can say that aram only accounts existing is imbalanced and unfair but you have no logical reason to try to say that it is less random.

So please, stop trying to argue about the word random and actually argue for balance. Arguing about the word random makes your argument so much weaker and has nothing to do with balance.

TeCoolMageDec 20, 20163 votes

Nothing's true random in this game. Riot doesn't measure the wind or use lasers to get their randomized results

ahferroin7Dec 21, 20161 votes

Neither of those are actually true random number generators. The wind is insanely easy to predict (there's a whole field of science built on it), and lasers are not at all random (in fact, they're highly non-random).

Better examples would be listening to radio waves from Jupiter (which is still not very random once you leave a regular human frame of reference) or measuring Shot noise in a resistor (which is what most real hardware random number generators do).

TeCoolMageDec 21, 20161 votes

I'm mostly referring to random.org measuring 'atmospheric noise' and roll20 using a 'true random source of entropy based off the fluctuation in the power of a beam of light'