New BE system is stupid!!!

Dakuda330·Nov 12, 2017·261 votes·21,495 views

I play league a lot like more than your average person okay. i play tons of games each day between 10-20 games a day. i get 1 level per day and every time i level i get this capsule since I don't get ip anymore after every game. so now I'm only getting like 800 BE for like 15 games.

I just opened a capsule and got 3 90 BE champs and 2 270. The other 3 I've opened have only given me 270 BE champs. What is this system? Yesterday i got 3 270 champs and that is all. That is 800 BE after having played 15 games, it is ridiculous. I'd get over 1k before if you include first win of the day and champ costs are the same.

It takes so long to level that people who dont spam games like me are never going to get any champs and then people like me who only need a few 4800 and 6300 champs its going to take me forever because im only getting 600-800 BE after 10+ games. but wait the people who are leveling get them a lot sooner and better rewards than us? Oh thats fantastic ive only been level 30 for the past 6 years i wonder what good that does for me. The only good part of this system is the random champ for 3900 and thats only because every champ I dont own is 4800+.

I think the old system was way better and way easier to deal with. I could get a new champ within 2-3 days and now its going to take me approx 4-5 days and that is with me spamming plenty of games everyday. What happens when I start working again? Do i just never get to have these champs? This system is inefficient for people who have to work or people in college or people in school. It sucks for everyone that isn't leveling up a brand new account. I honestly dont see the purpose in doing this change.

I like the no level cap but its unfortunate we couldn't just have that from the start without any rewards. We didnt get rewards for leveling back in season 2 when i first started playing all we did was unlock new summoner spells. We had to buy our runes and rune pages the old fashioned way and the only thing we bitched about was how a quint cost over 1k ip. Honestly one of the worst changes ive seen in the past 6 years ive been playing

Update: I just played 15 games got to level 35 and opened up my capsule only to get a 640 and 270 champ = to roughly 900 BE. the old system wouldve given me about 1.2k to 1.5k depending on how many of them were wins or losses and how long the game went on. now this is a little closer to what we used to get but its completely rng based. it just means i got lucky today. who is to say tomorrow when i get level 36 that i wont just get 5 90 BE champs.

146 Comments

RaveolutionNov 12, 201723 votes

I mean, it's no better for newer players either.. They doubled the experience per level for pre-30, so unless you literally just do the first win bonus and nothing else per day, you're getting fucked over. Around level 20 it takes 2k+ experience per level. Even if you win all your games, the first level of a day would take at least* ~8 games, and ~15+ after that. And that is on an account that isn't even able to do ranked, so the games mean literally nothing and you get nothing for them.

RiotRiot CactopusNov 12, 201750 votes

I've actually gotta jump in to correct this. We made leveling from 1-30 straight up faster. Proof is here: https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/developer-corner/hAaYMrEs-leveling-and-rewards-early-impressions-and-adjustments

BarcidNov 12, 20178 votes

Oh my god you cut down the leveling time by 20 games! That's insane!

It's out of nearly 180 games and only really factors out to about an 11% decrease in the amount of games it takes, but that's still like crazy super duper good or whatever!

BIG DADDY BARDNov 12, 201730 votes

He didnt say riot made it drastically faster, he said it was faster. The point of his comment was to correct misinformation, not to go around bragging about how much faster they made leveling.

RacoonHunterNov 12, 201726 votes

Except that the essences you receive do not match up your plans for "faster champion aquiring" My wife recently just started playing league, and at level 5 she only owns 3 champions with not enough blue essences to even pick up another. her first capsule which gave her the 3rd champion consumed ALL 2200 essences on the champion she loved (it matches her RL name and she's seen me play her a few times)

I understand that it is preseason.. but please riot, stop looking at pure math and instead focus on players concerns as well. I have faith that you'll fix the system for both new and old players.

RiotRiot CactopusNov 12, 201732 votes

In the same article we also proved that you get more BE when going from 1–30. So it's more BE under all circumstances and in fewer games.

I see your point about focusing not just on math, but on player concerns. The problem is we have to correct some misinformation out here first (like people saying you get less BE or it takes longer when going from 1–30).

Romans VI XXIIINov 12, 201763 votes

Yes you get more BE from lvl 1-30 ONLY cause you lvl faster. but once you hit 30 the amount of BE DRASTICALLY reduces....The math from lvl 30+ proves this as well, as many players have done this math for you.

Even if the amount of BE was gained at the same rate as IP was through loot boxes at lvl 30+, if it doesn't feel rewarding then the customer will eventually stop playing. The thing RIOT needs to take from this and learn from is that WE are the customers and its about making US feel like our time/money is well worth it or else we could easily put our money/time else where.

Ultra Rapid FyreNov 12, 201744 votes

[{quoted}](name=Riot Cactopus,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=JytcuuJT,comment-id=0000000000010000,timestamp=2017-11-12T19:36:01.713+0000)

In the same article we also proved that you get more BE when going from 1–30. So it's more BE under all circumstances and in fewer games.

I see your point about focusing not just on math, but on player concerns. The problem is we have to correct some misinformation out here first (like people saying you get less BE or it takes longer when going from 1–30).

NO ONE CARES ABOUT 1-30

AbibyamaNov 12, 20178 votes

EXCEPT NEW PLAYERS PLAYING THROUGH 1-30

Ultra Rapid FyreNov 12, 201729 votes

{quoted}

EXCEPT NEW PLAYERS PLAYING THROUGH 1-30

dont you mean people who are smurfing? lets be real

Mega NoobNov 12, 201733 votes

[{quoted}](name=Ultra Rapid Fyre,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=JytcuuJT,comment-id=00000000000100000002,timestamp=2017-11-12T20:35:26.685+0000)

NO ONE CARES ABOUT 1-30

Pretty much this ++++

MaxDevil666Nov 13, 201719 votes

I start a new account im level 13 right now and i only have 3 champs... Warwick Janna Garen Ashe Janna and Soraka and i need 20 20 FUCKING CHAMPS to start playing THE ACTUAL game.

They told us: "We wanna help the new player" how? by giving me 240 BE after WE play 10/15 games.

OTHER THING: What if im not a regular? WHAT if i cant play all day every day...how much is gonna take me to own half the champ i had in my main account,why WHY u remove the win of the day? WHY? That was the better thing ever,waking up,play a game win and get like 200 IP in a week i could be able to buy a champ by only winning ONCE per day,now i need to win 10 games IN 10 DAYS to get 240? L O L

BE=BS

T4underboltNov 13, 201710 votes

Someone has counted that. Even if you grind hard you need around 100-120 games to buy 6300 BE champ. Before you would play 14 games to get around 1500 IP. Math is easy. This system is much worse, but Riot wants to make it look like its good to silence player base with their fake statistics. You know Riot is small indie company they have to get money from every corner.

Tomoe GozenNov 13, 20171 votes

"Fake statistics". I honestly cannot believe how dumb the community can sometimes be. First it's "proof or gtfo" comments and when you get exactly that, with graphs and maths, then it's "fake statistics". My god, people who have to create this new system actually have to do math to back it up and that means it's not made up.

But sure, some redditor who can do basic elementary math is the genius that revealed Riot's "secret" plan. Unless you can prove otherwise, kindly stop talking BS and spreading misinformation.

Here's a part of the entire post that's relevant for levels 30 and beyond, in terms of BE:

#COMPARING THE REWARDS SYSTEMS Okay, but here's the question that's actually on everyone's minds: Do you get more or less overall BE from leveling compared to the IP you got from playing games in the old system?** The answer is that on average, you will get more, no matter what level you are.** And the only way you'll ever get even slightly less from the new system is if you're playing a truly crazy amount of League every day. Time to back up that claim with data.

Note that all of the following examples are accurate after we make the aforementioned changes to FWotD and the post-30 leveling speed.

The only issue i've been seeing with this is that people have gotten used to drip-feeding of IP instead of now getting it in larger chunks after leveling up but even that was answered by a Rioter. And even a part of FWotD EXP will be converted to BE so that people can never be short a small amount of BE for a champ and have to level up fully to get that.

MuRk3mNov 13, 20175 votes

[{quoted}](name=Tomoe Gozen,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=JytcuuJT,comment-id=00000000000100000002000200000001,timestamp=2017-11-13T18:40:24.512+0000)

"Fake statistics". I honestly cannot believe how dumb the community can sometimes be. First it's "proof or gtfo" comments and when you get exactly that, with graphs and maths, then it's "fake statistics". My god, people who have to create this new system actually have to do math to back it up and that means it's not made up.

But sure, some redditor who can do basic elementary math is the genius that revealed Riot's "secret" plan. Unless you can prove otherwise, kindly stop talking BS and spreading misinformation.

Here's a part of the entire post that's relevant for levels 30 and beyond, in terms of BE: Okay, but here's the question that's actually on everyone's minds: Do you get more or less overall BE from leveling compared to the IP you got from playing games in the old system?** The answer is that on average, you will get more, no matter what level you are.** And the only way you'll ever get even slightly less from the new system is if you're playing a truly crazy amount of League every day. Time to back up that claim with data.

The only issue i've been seeing with this is that people have gotten used to drip-feeding of IP instead of now getting it in larger chunks after leveling up but even that was answered by a Rioter. And even a part of FWotD EXP will be converted to BE so that people can never be short a small amount of BE for a champ and have to level up fully to get that.

well from my exp playing about 28 games growing 2 levels getting 2 capsules. I got 3 total champ shards. 1 champ shard first capsule and 2 champ shards the 2nd capsule. 1st champ shard was worth 280 2nd champ shard was 270 and 3rd was dinger who was worth 680. When i disenchanted all 3 champ shards i ended up with like 1130 BE which is horrible. Now i think in old system with 28 games lets say at 90 IP a game im sure that's a a lot more than 1130 IP. With math 28x90 would be about 2520 IP. Even if all 28 games was worth 50 IP it will still come out to 1400 IP which is still more than 1130 and 50 IP per game is about half per game we use to get. So with that being said im getting less than half the amount of IP/BE i was accustomed to getting.

OdogaronNov 13, 20175 votes

Forreal tho..unless you are literally on a Smurf account grinding to 30, there's no way a new player is going to be very successful once they hit 30. They will be stuck in bronze, even if their skill is above that due to the lack of resources to get additional champions that are either 'meta' or flat out fit the player's play style better. At least before I could look at a Champion and say THAT is the champ I want to grind for and learn because I played them well on free rotation and I only need x amount of games left to get the IP I need. Now it's like 'well fuck I hope I don't get 1 fucking dog shit champ shard that's worth 200 BE when I play 20 games and level up this time!!!!'

patmax17Nov 12, 20176 votes

Hi Cactopus!

Are you allowed to share more specific numbers of the system? On the topic you linked I asked you a few things because I tried to calculate my BE gain in the new system and I get that it's ~25% less (even with the 50BE on FWotD): https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/developer-corner/hAaYMrEs-leveling-and-rewards-early-impressions-and-adjustments?comment=001000000000

PokkuNov 12, 201721 votes

Riot is here just to correct mistakes that make them look bad. When there are actual facts that make them look bad, they vanish. [slayer-jinx-unamused]

MyozthirirnNov 12, 20173 votes

When i was lvl 5 i owned 0 champions and arround 1200 ip. And you have the balls to complain about "only" having 3 champions?

RacoonHunterNov 12, 20175 votes

you had the IP tho to purchase the champions that didn't cost a lot of IP.. example, Annie. You could have easily gotten Tristana and Garen from promotions as well that no longer exist.

MyozthirirnNov 13, 20171 votes

i had 1200 ip + garen and tristana if i sell my soul to facebook/twitter He has Garen+Ashe+brand and 3500 BE as a bonus for free. He has realisticaly triple the stuff i had, yet he somehow finds reasons to complain and i didnt. Honstly i dont even understand what he wants, you get lvl 5 by playing 7 bot games or so and he thinks he deserves 20k BE for that or what?

Tesla EffectNov 13, 20172 votes

{quoted}

i had 1200 ip + garen and tristana if i sell my soul to facebook/twitter

That just says a lot about the current messed up situation with internet social media in general.

Pika310Nov 13, 20176 votes

The problem is, Rito isn't actually looking at pure math, but like you said: they aren't focusing on players either. Players constantly tell Rito what they're doing is wrong, mathematics tells Rito what they're doing is wrong.

Rito changes this game based solely on their own whims. They ignore both common sense, as well as customer feedback. Been this way for at least 4 years now, by what I've personally seen.

Lit CornNov 12, 20172 votes

but isnt that risky ? like people geting level 30 really fast and kinda ruining ranked games tho ?

TactrixNov 13, 20175 votes

Actually it's not risky at all, no one can play ranked until they have 20 champs, and as his chart proves you won't be anywhere within even the remote ballpark of 20 champs unless you pay for them with RP.

Tesla EffectNov 13, 20172 votes

{quoted}

Actually it's not risky at all, no one can play ranked until they have 20 champs, and as his chart proves you won't be anywhere within even the remote ballpark of 20 champs unless you pay for them with RP.

A la, "pay-to-play"...or even worse "pay-to-win" if you factor in that some champions will be better and more broken than others. Getting those champions quicker would be considered in that "pay-to-win" category, no matter how insignificant the effects may be,

TactrixNov 13, 20173 votes

That's exactly it! This game has become that way, they have stepped over the line into "pay 2 win" territory. Now watch carefully as their pop numbers plummet.

doofer20Nov 13, 20174 votes

[{quoted}](name=Riot Cactopus,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=JytcuuJT,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2017-11-12T18:55:09.545+0000)

I've actually gotta jump in to correct this. We made leveling from 1-30 straight up faster. Proof is here: https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/developer-corner/hAaYMrEs-leveling-and-rewards-early-impressions-and-adjustments

OK but for the majority of players 30+ this Be is bad for a few reason.

if you are off by 10 BE to get that new champ you want its not 'well, one more game i guess' it becomes 'F%ck, one more level!!'.
on my first 3 levels ive added up the totals. to be 1250, 270, and 810. with at least 2 win of the days in each level and 8-10 games atleast 50% win rate with games lasting 30 mins on average, im losing a lot of BE

Thank you for the chromas im super grateful and happy about them i burnt all my built up Ip on but idk if thats the smart move in the long run with the lack of income source now

DarkRoosterNov 12, 201719 votes

Honestly when we have massive virgin war against Dota 2 players, their argument is that their champions are free, all of them. So i expected that Riot will change it so we can get champions way easier, like half year or year normal playing and you have them all, and they did the opposite. This is really hard point Dota 2 virgins have and somehow Riot doesn't care. You can't make core of the game hardly buyable, make it easy to get and sell cosmetics.

NiaphimNov 12, 20174 votes

You can, but it becomes a shitty mobile lootbox type economy with monetization that everybody hates.

TactrixNov 13, 20172 votes

This game has always been that way, they only changed it now to become harder to get champs on top of it, so your point is moot.

Gone LethalNov 12, 201718 votes

I have played between 10-16 games per level. Im currently sitting at level 33 and here are the results, 1260 BE , 900 BE and 810 BE for a combine total of 2970 BE. The one thing I want Riot to explain is why is THIS RANDOM REWARDS AND AMOUNT OF BLUE ESSENCE. Listen, they have been turning things we used to have a bit a control (ex:Key Fragment Drops) and now Blue Essence to a RANDOM FREAKING AMOUNT. Why does everyone receive a different amount when WE ALL PLAY THE SAME AMOUNT OF GAMES!. Please return the damn IP/Blue Essence after every game.

hazerddexNov 12, 20179 votes

because loot boxes

TactrixNov 13, 20178 votes

Because they're greedy and want everyone to spend money on RP instead, but all they're going to do is drive their population into the ground. Because a good deal of us already quit this junk game because of all their "quality of life" changes.

Bait for SaleNov 12, 201714 votes

3rd year playing this game, I like the concept of the new blue essence system, but if you don't earn anything after playing a single game it gets old. You lose a lot of potential because now players feel less rewarded for a good game and experience points honestly doesn't make me a better player, yeah its nice that the level cap got taken off so you can see who puts in time and who doesn't, but exp points alone just doesn't cut it. If there were atleast 50 blue essence for playing a game this would add to players being able to play more champions, wanting to play more games, and essentially learning each champion's abilities better to be a better player in the long run. That's what makes a game great is the ability to improve from mistakes, have a challenge and over come it. Another idea would be winning champion capsules off of earning an S-, S, or S+ grade. This would also make champs that are max level valuable as well. This is my first time posting so I hope its helpful. Catch you on the rift!

bànNov 12, 201713 votes

main purpose is for you to spend real money. its so blatant

KwattigorNov 12, 20177 votes

the new system is crap redo your math way more then 5 days for champs unless its cheap cheap champ in past 4 days playing 10-15 games a day ive only earny 1600 be so playing almost 9 hours a day i get around 45 be per hour compared to loss b4 change average game 35 min would be 60-65 for a loss 80-90 for a win thats more than double what you make with this new garbage setup riot will lose tons of players from this unless they fix it i have over 8k games played btw

spagnutNov 12, 20177 votes

I have been playing this game since the first season, since ARAM became a thing I have been playing it almost exclusively. People here are saying they are able to play 9 games a day, I am lucky if I find time to play 3 to 5 a week, considering each game takes about a half hour, that's still 6 hours of time a week. This new system gives me very little incentive to play now. I am sitting on what appears to be a massive pile of this BE now and only about 40 champs I don't own, but actually doing the math on what the BE is worth 40k BE doesn't even go very far... Between this and the new rune system which is IMO a mess and has made ARAM significantly less fun, I have very little motivation left to play this game. Which is sad because I have put in so much of my time over the years.

YiffMeImAFurryNov 13, 20177 votes

Literally all they had to do was merge BE and IP.

Leave everything else alone. Everyone would've been fucking ecstatic. Wow, no more having to disenchant shards for BE? Hot damn!

No lets throw in an exp system for good measure totally necessary yay...

There's nothing more disappointing right now than leveling up and getting a shitty as champ shard.

UnoGetGoldELONov 12, 20176 votes

we all dislike this BE change and its clear as rain that changes for the better are going to come if @Tryndamere plus staff fight Tencents asian thievery back.

edit: otherwise this game is going to drive people away en masse that aren´t 6-7year old accounts that couldn´t care less with their heaving pile of BE to sit on.

Qìyana ReevèsNov 12, 20175 votes

They should make it so u get BE after a game and not just xp alone, it takes too long to get champs with the new system

Tesla EffectNov 12, 20175 votes

Their statistics are intentionally false to the actual rewards we are getting with the level up system just to quiet up the players. They have already been proven wrong when it comes to game average time rewards of the old system, and now with each users experience with what actual BE shards they have been getting, which is way lower than the lowest said amount, and lower than in the IP system.

Lajinn5Nov 12, 20175 votes

They could at least remove 450s from the loot pool. Getting a capsule stuffed with them is essentially a worthless level up, since they gutted disenchant Blue gains.

Oh, and you know, at least give us SOME currency for just playing. Having to rely on random drops to be able to get champions is fucking absurd and stifles the ability to actually get them.

PurrloxxNov 13, 20174 votes

I agree entirely, now i'm not going to go into a bunch of maths but in BOTH champion capsules, I ONLY got duplicate champions that were: Wukong for 800BE, Malphite (I lied I upgraded this to permanent) 400ish BE in the first one, and the second one? OH only 2 Kayle for 90BE so 180 total and Akali for 600BE which they are both dupes...so lets see i earned around 1560BE not counting Malphite cause he was upgraded to perma. THANKS RIOT so now when i went Zoey or Xayah or HECK even Karma now ive still gotta wait till im about level 40 for both cause im not spending money anymore, i spent money in season 7 but season 8 has gone downside, give us IP back or atleast the system it used but for BE you are RUINING this. Whats even worse is when me and my friend are bad at the game and go on a 16 lose streak meaning we got not even ONE LEVEL in 16 games!!! COME ON like what is this! i wont be suprised at this rate if Smite takes over league because Smite gets it shit right hence why i hvave 800 hours playtime and all my money goes into it

FakeGravityNov 12, 20173 votes

what if the amount of BE you get from the capsules was more...symetrical? if the shard you get is low cost you should get either more shards or extra BE, if the champion cost 6300 i be ok but it feels bad to get a single champion most of the time with any BE to even get close to craft it

IsilioNov 13, 20173 votes

This is actually what I thought the system was going to be when it first hit. I was thinking that no matter what, you should receive the same amount of BE regardless of the composition of the capsule. Man, oh man, was I wrong.

FullmuteAll playNov 13, 20173 votes

Upvoting this. I am barely earning for new champ who costs 4800. And when I get 90BE for 2 random champs I looted it is freaking ridiculous. And with these 2 rune pages RIOT left us I can barely earn for more rune pages. Basically new runes now are old masteries. I had ALL 20 mastery pages utilized before new season. Now I have only 7 rune pages which I bought on old IP converted into BE without 5 other useless runes RIOT gave us for some reason.

SirCrumbsNov 13, 20173 votes

I really got screwed by the new system. I just hit level 30 before the update and have been playing normals. The issue is that normals is filled with diamond and plat players probably due to the ranked season being over. I want to play ranked to maybe get people more in my skill level but i only have 13 champs and you need 20. I cant earn enough blue essence to buy champs to get to ranked. I cant win games to hopefully earn more xp to level up. I am tired of letting my team down game after game.

Tearin TrueNov 13, 20171 votes

Honest question...what if lol went with a subscription based model?

You could opt to sign up for a subscription Say a monthly fee of $1 and if you did so you can have the the BEreward per game that is on par with what you use to get with IP.

Tesla EffectNov 13, 20173 votes

[{quoted}](name=Tearin True,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=JytcuuJT,comment-id=001a,timestamp=2017-11-13T01:03:48.664+0000)

Honest question...what if lol went with a subscription based model?

You could opt to sign up for a subscription Say a monthly fee of $1 and if you did so you can have the the BEreward per game that is on par with what you use to get with IP.

Then I would stop playing it, the only reason why I was its because the game itself was free to play, not counting the ingame stuff that wasnt (which was more along the lines of acceptible issue, rather than something that would just outright disinterest me from playing it...well at least until the rescent changes). Plus I doubt the service provided by Riot even with the subscription would change, they would still do bad jobs with balancing 140 champions because ffs they have 140 champions.

Not only that but their game bacame popular because it was free to play, I doubt they will continue to be popular in the long run if they continue making bad decisions like devaluing the Orance Essences, and Blue Essence system wonkyness.