How Many Autoattacks does a marksman need to reach the same damage a full mage rotation does?

Stattik gives you AOE damage once every like 5 seconds. Nice try.

Runaan's Hurricane is closer, but you can still only hit three targets, not 5. And the damage from Runaan's isn't really that much. It's 50% of your AD, and it can crit, but still. You have at least two item slots (Runaan's and Boots) that give you no AD at all. Runaan's is a good item, definitely, but only if you have time to output sustained damage. Mages will still far outdamage you.

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So youre saying a mages job is to be a support and not damage?

That's not what he said and you know it. Stop putting words in his mouth.

What he said is that average mages have a power budget that includes more utility and CC than the average ADC's (barring Ashe, of course). They also deal most, if not all of, their damage instantly. As in 2 or less seconds. An ADC is only getting off 5 attacks in 2 seconds if they have absolutely maximum attack speed. As in 2.5 attacks per second. Which gives no damage what so fucking ever.

Mages also deal damage in an AoE. AoE damage is generally less to a single person than single target damage, but it's usually more total. They're also generally more mobile, meaning more safety.

So? Mages damage is concentrated in a single time frame, what's your point?

except mages get good early games from skill based damage can stomp adc into the ground with their cc and do all that from a very safe distance while also scaling somewhat well lategame in some cases with tank killing potential also you can downvote me all you like it doesn't change the fact adc at 6 items outclassing mages after their damage falls off is the whole point, with expensive build paths, very little safety due to getting into danger range of any mage that can and will one shot them by sniffing in their direction just to do any damage, and in less general aoe to boot. a 6 item adc is not the same as a 6 item mage, fact. mages by nature fall off lategame with some several exceptions in dps mages, fact. mages and casters have a generally better early to mid than carries with fewer items, fact.

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Not wanting to play Devil's Advocate here but I just want to point out that just because Tristana is a hypercarry doesn't make her autoattacks somehow stronger. She's a hyper-carry due to her kit (as every hyper-carry is), in which none of her abilities where upgraded. Her only "advantage" over other adcs in this situation would be her auto-attack range which has no effect on her damage, so literally any adc would do that damage in the same situation.

If he was playing Vayne with upgrades on his W then that argument could be made.

Not quite. We no longer live in a world where ADC builds are cookie-cutter. If he played someone like Ezreal, Corki, Jhin, Quinn (is she still an ADC?), MF, or Lucian you wont see such high numbers for damage - they have less crit chance and in some cases no IE. Also, some ADCs dont build double-zeal items - meaning they dont crit as often and their attack speed is much lower. They wont hit 2.0AS with 80% crit chance like this Trist.

Also, it is kind of rediculous to have an ADC do as much damage as a Mage's full rotation in 5 seconds imo. 2.0+ att speed means they can put out as much damage as a mage in just over 2 seconds, which is often times the same (if not less) time it takes for a mage when incorporating cast-times and animations (think about how long it takes for Veigar's Comet to fall for instance).

Want to know whats ridiculous? Trying to say a 6-item Veigar only does 1963 in total burst. The post is obviously pushing an agenda. A 1000 AP Veigar (which you should be close to in late game, 6 item situations) can do that much with his ult alone to a 1/2 health target. Or saying that Annie only does 2300 in her burst, when she can hit multiple enemies with 2/3 of that damage - if you land a 5-person Tibbers, you increased that to almost 7500 damage!

The argument could be made that not only do ADC's have better DPS and similar burst qualities of a mages, but they also have access to better penetration/flexible build paths and aren't limited by situations to output damage. By that I mean that while Veigar often times has to wait for his stun to land, Ahri's charm, or some other cc to hit for their burst to be able to be output, adc's can just "pelt away at whoever is near" without any restrictions outside of "don't die".

The argument can be made, but it isnt a good one. They dont have similar burst qualities of mages in terms of up-front DPS or AoE in most cases. Also, most of the times ADCs have less flexible builds - a mage can decide to rush a Zhonyas against a Zed but an ADC will be left helpless until they cant straight up fight toe-to-toe. It isnt really optimal for an ADC to rush a GA against a fed Assassin if they dont have their core items.

Plus, youre not mentioning range or CC, which can be just as valuable (if not more valuable) than raw damage.

I'm not saying ADCs are weak or anything like that, but the post is obviously pushing an agenda. "How is that fair"? Because different champions and different roles do different things in different parts of the game. Youre comparing mages to ADCs in a situation that heavily favors ADCs - lategame with 6 items comparing single-target DPS. Mages heavily win out at level 6, level 11, 1-2 item powerspikes, CC, and AoE. Also, ADCs are required to hit a target that entire time - a mage can blow their rotation and back off, giving less of a window where they are vulnerable. THATS why its fair.

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lets see.. has everything has everything with hurricane has no hard cc but maybe the best zone control u can wish for aswell as the best aoe in the game has everything if you want to count a snare has everything if you want to count a snare has everything has everything if you want to count a snare has everything if you want to count a snare has everything

i honestly dont know what you are talking about.

yeah, and they all share one thing in common, that they all die to Syndra R, Ori RW, Cass QE spam, Ahri EQ, the list goes on..

Isn't that the truth

Lets be real, veigar was a terrible choice for this topic though. His end game ap numbers are double your average mage and his ult is an execute. lux or victor or syndra would be better choices to compare.