@Ghostcrawler: How do you feel Orianna's early laning phase compares to pre-rework Cass's?

mi ramfan·Sep 12, 2014·3 votes·1,267 views

I'm of the opinion that Orianna's early laning is just as oppressive if not more so then Cassieopeia's. Once she positions her ball on your side of the minions, it's nearly impossible to escape her Q->W comboes every few seconds that chunk you for a third of your health. When she gets you low enough, Q->R->W into Ignite and autoattacks is a free kill without much counterplay.

Cassieopeia just got a rework because of her early game harass. Do you feel that Orianna could use some similar power shifting efforts to make her less oppressive early game? If not, why?

7 Comments

TenSlashTenSep 12, 20141 votes

If her ball is near you its not near her, meaning you can lay damage onto her because she can't shield. Try better positioning Unlike all these 2011+ champs ori actually requires braincells to play/play against. Ikr? actually having a skill cap. Amazing.

mi ramfanSep 12, 20141 votes

You're mixing up skill floor and skill cap. It's not easy to learn the ball positioning, but once you do you can force people out of lane with just QW spam. And after that, you can get kills with QRW ignite.

TenSlashTenSep 12, 20141 votes

no skill floor is how easy the champ is to play at an above average level and win. Skill cap is the depth of the champion and every mechanic there is to master about them.

For example. Skill floor for cass would be landing most of your Q's and knowing how to W so it picks up 80% of the creep wave in poison. And knowing when to ult. Skill cap is landing every Q landing 2 E's on enemy per Q(auto-E-Auto-E) Landing W to zone enemy and pick up CS Landing E only when poison is available to use. Landing R on 3+ enemies every ult outside of lanephase and being able to use the landed R to win a fight yourself.

BlackBeast41Sep 12, 20141 votes

You're missing a few details, some of which is the travel time of the ball, and the fact that she usually needs to used two abilities to lay out that kinda damage. Cass on the other hand could just prefer to use Q spam, which ticked damage at a fairly high rate, had a flat time delay, and if she landed it, she got an MS buff, and could choose to kite or spam E for more damage.

That said, I think there were likely a few points in their decision to change her. One of those being to shift some of her early game power, and make her late game even stronger. The second is to put more focus onto her twin fang, forcing her to make more decisions about how she lays out her poison, and give her more interaction on her damage. Where previously she could just poison enemies over and over to let her damage tick, her main focus is now to use her poisons as utility, and spam E on poisoned targets. I'm not confident this will fix her, as I believe she will still need some tweaks, but we will see.

JimMaruSep 12, 20141 votes

Cassiopeia got the rework because they were already doing a texture update and a themed patched for Shurima. She didn't really NEED changes, but they wanted to solidify her identity. The ball placement IS the identity of Oriana, where she moves her presence somewhere else and has to control not only her but the ball's positioning.

I'm not saying that Ori's laning is not oppressive or anything, just that this wasn't the reason Cass got the rework.

12talesSep 12, 20141 votes

It was a lot worse before they nerfed her base AD. It's a lot more manageable now, in my opinion.

KSHarrisonSep 12, 20141 votes

The difference is that Cassiopeia did >Ryze levels of damage (in fact she countered him). Big bully with hypercarry damage. This was how she worked in S2.

I am conflicted on Ori. I don't know if she should be the bar for other mids or her kit should be more exposed. She is the closest to a Thresh/Lee Sin/Elise class mid laner; she's been viable in just about every meta for years at a time.