MoonFlair Spell Blade

GigglesO·Nov 25, 2016·53 votes·2,172 views

So, is there a reason we can't have it in SR? Its actually a decent, but not op IMO item. It adds an alternative armor/mr item than just ZZ'rot and GA, and it even gives an alternative to Merc treads for tenacity.

57 Comments

GigglesONov 25, 201620 votes

Also, as an added bonus, it has a really nice looking icon.

DanjengNov 25, 201613 votes

It does look pretty good.

item 3170

But it has pretty overpowered stats, they would have to tone it down a lot in SR (or raise its price).

BladeSingularityNov 25, 20163 votes

Overpowered? Really?

DanjengNov 25, 20168 votes

Why are there so many downvotes?

Moonflair Spellblade's base stats are 119.5% gold efficient, without the passive. I am NOT saying having this item on the rift would be bad. But this current one is really strong. It would need to be adjusted. Similar to how RoA is not the same in certain game modes.

My point is, it would not be the same. But ok, sorry for sharing my opinion :(

SpoofghoulNov 25, 20161 votes

it could simply be more expensive

DanjengNov 25, 20166 votes

or raise its price

That's what I'm suggesting. I think it would be nice to have alternative tenacity sources. Why have a whole stat dedicated to Merc's passive?

But if it's too cost efficient, it'll be Rylai's all over again. Mages would just buy it for the crazy stats rather than its passive.

I'm thinking 3000 G or 3100 G (still getting a bargain at this price). Zz'rot and GA both lose out on stats, because of how powerful their passives are. Moonflair Spellblade should not be an exception.

To those who down vote me. What is wrong with my comment? Is it not constructive? I put thought and time into it.

I am NOT shitposting. I am agreeing with the original post, but also pointing out that it is a very powerful item.

I am answering the OP's question

So, is there a reason we can't have it in SR?

If it were put into SR in its current state, it would dominate the game, because of how cheap yet powerful it is. I am trying to offer insight into your post, but I guess I'm just an idiot.

GigglesONov 25, 20162 votes

{quoted}

That's what I'm suggesting.

I am NOT shitposting. I am agreeing with the original post, but also pointing out that it is a very powerful item.

If it is considered too powerful, I think the ap should be lowered. Tanks need another item.

DanjengNov 25, 20161 votes

Proposed stats: 50 armor = 1000 G 50 magic resistance = 900 G 10 ability power = 435 G Value = 2335 G

For Moonflair Spellblade to be considered cost efficient, Tenacity must be worth at least 165 G (which I think is fair).

Defensive stats remain unchanged, AP is lowered significantly. So it's a fair item that still gets the job done without being overbearing. Similarly, you could argue why not have Wooglet's in SR to have an alternative to Deathcap or Zhonya's. It could be, but its already cost effective by itself (also has a powerful active), and would need a price up.

Black Market Brawlers had Deadman's Plate. It remained on the rift as a momento. It has received multiple nerfs since then.

GigglesONov 25, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Proposed stats: 50 armor = 1000 G 50 magic resistance = 900 G 10 ability power = 435 G Value = 2335 G

I could even see 45 armor and 45 MR, and then bump the ap back up to 25.

Votable JesterNov 26, 20161 votes

I'd say APs need another item as well, but this one isn't that item.

Very Hard EngageNov 25, 201611 votes

cant have it because everyone knows mages cant have armor. especially not tenacity against waifu assassins. they would cry for years until the item eventually got gutted into the ground. heavens forbid we see an equal prevalence of magic damage - physical damage in league.

GigglesONov 25, 20165 votes

{quoted}

cant have it because everyone knows mages cant have armor.

Yea, idk, I just think itemization really needs improvement, mages do at least have zhonyas already. on all sides of the table, for ad's, ap's, and tanks. This item does fill a unique spot in what it brings to the table.

To be fair I also think rylis should act more like frozen mallet... 700 hp with like 30 ap...

Legacy HydralphaNov 25, 20161 votes

To be fair I also think rylis should act more like frozen mallet... 700 hp with like 30 ap...

Agreed. I mean, the main problem is that Riot gave Rylai's too much AP and refuse to admit they made a mistake, so they gut the item to be worse when it could just be a health/utility item instead of AP.

SpoofghoulNov 25, 20161 votes

Yes that would actually be better

with the previous iteration of slows attached

35% single target/dot 15% on everything else 25% if that champion is melee

problem fixed

Sraeg2013Nov 26, 20164 votes

Except that Zhonya's is a borderline troll item only bought for the active.

Irelia BotNov 25, 20164 votes

Only if Zephyr comes back would I be alright with this.

JVlasterQuinnNov 26, 20162 votes

[{quoted}](name=Irelia Bot,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=I8sMZjtf,comment-id=000a,timestamp=2016-11-25T23:39:18.187+0000)

Only if Zephyr comes back would I be alright with this.

This. Add Zephyr back with Moonflair and the game is balanced. Mage have Moonflair(AP Tank as well), AD have Zhephyr and generalist class have Mercury thread.

Adrian BlackbearNov 25, 20162 votes

Moonflair is one of my core items on AP champions in Twisted Treeline. I can only wish that they would add an item like that into SR.

SckullzzNov 25, 20162 votes

I loved this item! I was super sad when they took it away from SR...

GigglesONov 25, 20164 votes

{quoted}

I loved this item! I was super sad when they took it away from SR...

I actually don't remember it ever being on SR...

sunden12Nov 25, 20161 votes

Cause it never was lol. (edit) oh i never new that o.O

CasterGilgameshNov 26, 20161 votes

it was lol a long time ago this was when Xerath still had his old passive that gave him armor for building ap

Sraeg2013Nov 26, 20161 votes

Introduced in the Vayne patch on 10th of May 2011 it was available in all game modes and removed in the Nami patch, on 4th of December 2012. Reintroduced later on 30th of July 2013 as a Twisted Treeline/Crystal Scar-specific item.

CasterGilgameshNov 26, 20161 votes

it used to but riot made it 3V3 map only this was a long time ago though

Sraeg2013Nov 26, 20161 votes

It was available in all game modes beginning in May 2011 and removed on December 2012.

SckullzzNov 28, 20161 votes

{quoted}

I actually don't remember it ever being on SR...

I was briefly, like not even a full season. I think pre and not even the first half of season 5?

General Esdeath Nov 25, 20162 votes

I think it would make someone like Diana Gragas too strong for Riot's liking.

GigglesONov 25, 20162 votes

{quoted}

I think it would make someone like too strong for Riot's liking.

how would a tenacity armor/mr item with only 50 ap make them op? They need more ap than that to be op... and they don't rely on staying un-crowd controled. They rely on nuking people... It's all a trade off tank or damage.

MiraweaveNov 25, 20161 votes

{quoted}

how would a tenacity armor/mr item with only 50 ap make them op? They need more ap than that to be op... and they don't rely on staying un-crowd controled. They rely on nuking people... It's all a trade off tank or damage.

Because it gives insane tank stats and tenacity and AP all rolled up into one efficient ball. It'd be the absolute best first item on either of them.

Sraeg2013Nov 26, 20161 votes

Quick! Everybody get item 3026 before it gets nerfed, because it gives insane tank stats!

MiraweaveNov 26, 20162 votes

{quoted}

Quick! Everybody get before it gets nerfed, because it gives insane tank stats!

That doesn't also give 50 ap lol.

It gives literally everything a tanky mage wants in one efficient item. It would be incredibly broken.

Sraeg2013Nov 26, 20161 votes

The point is that neither gives "insane tank stats".

GA's niche is preventing your death. MSB's niche is giving a little AP and Tenacity.

Look... the AP is so small, there is only one full item in the game which provides less AP. How that can be broken?

GigglesONov 26, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Quick! Everybody get before it gets nerfed, because it gives insane tank stats!

The reason people buy it isn't for the tank stats, its the revive... which is only conditionally useful.

Sraeg2013Nov 26, 20161 votes

Exactly.

General Esdeath Nov 25, 20161 votes

Dude, AP and tank stats? That's what they're all about. It's not that 50 AP is too much, it leaves 1 or 2 slots free for anything else.

TargonNov 26, 20162 votes

I would love to see this item added! It would make AP fighters more viable. I don't think it would be too broken. It adds great tank stats but you'd still need to build some HP to make them effective and 50AP is rather low so it would reduce burst output of AP champions that buy it.

MiraweaveNov 25, 20161 votes

It would break Diana, Swain, Vlad, Aurelian Sol, Gragas, and Rumble, among others.

AkabaneKunNov 26, 20163 votes

{quoted}

It would break Diana, Swain, Vlad, Aurelian Sol, Gragas, and Rumble, among others.

I doesn't break them on a 3vs3 map why would it break them on a 5vs5 map? Don't get it.

Earl EulrichNov 26, 20163 votes

noone knows, that´s whys you won´t get more than the "would break them" statement ever - sadly that´s all this discussion ever leads to as it´s around since years and monflair is still not in SR.

Ignoring the fact that both effective health and tenacity are stronger in 3v3 than in 5v5 (the cced member is 1/3 of the team, not "just" 1/5 + you only have 3dmg sources against you not five, which makes tanking later on more viable in TTT than in SR) and thus there´s just no chance this item that is already niche in TTT would break anything in SR.

GigglesONov 26, 20162 votes

[{quoted}](name=Don Eulrich,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=I8sMZjtf,comment-id=000700000000,timestamp=2016-11-26T14:31:42.960+0000)

noone knows, that´s whys you won´t get more than the "would break them" statement ever - sadly that´s all this discussion ever leads to as it´s around since years and monflair is still not in SR.

^^ I'm pretty sure I'm going to have to agree with this one.

Ignoring the fact that both effective health and tenacity are stronger in 3v3 than in 5v5 (the cced member is 1/3 of the team, not "just" 1/5 + you only have 3dmg sources against you not five, which makes tanking later on more viable in TTT than in SR) and thus there´s just no chance this item that is already niche in TTT would break anything in SR.

Not just that, but what people fail to remember is that its a trade off item, more tank = less upfront damage.

The issue that they are having with rylis right now is that they made it a core ap item, but it also has a lot of tank stats. 50 ap is in no way a core high ap build.

Sraeg2013Nov 26, 20162 votes

If it isn't broken in 3v3s, then how would it be in 5v5s?

ZerenzaNov 25, 20161 votes

This would be an amazing item for AP Melee Assassins, though it might be TOO good cause of the armor and MR so maybe it should go up in price to 2800-3000 somewhere inbetween there or they could remove some of the resistances (maybe 5 or 10 for each) and increase the AP it gives. Idk but that would be a great add to SR for Melee AP's bruiser and assassins.

Edit: It would also need to be made an item that can't be bought by mages cause mages already get Zhonya's+Abyssal to get to 100 resistances so this would give them 150 resistances in each and that would be broken af.

FairyfleurNov 26, 20161 votes

Buying all three and boots would only leave two spots open.

ZerenzaNov 26, 20161 votes

If i were to play katarina i'd imagine a build something like this at level 18 item 3116 item 3001 item 3157 item 3170 item 3285 item 3020

Armor: 170 Magic Resist: 165 Health: 2350 Ability Power(without runes): 380

So i'd be REALLY hard to kill, in certain circumstances i could image that i'd also want to take a liandry's instead of ludens or a deathcap instead of ludens or one of the resistance items so my AP would be well over 400 and that's alot.

A Basic IslandNov 26, 20161 votes

is it the same one that used to be on SR?

if so it's because it sucked back then, didn't have the stats to be worth the slot, and was overall a huge noob trap item.

You were usually dead before the cc reduction even mattered

Sraeg2013Nov 26, 20161 votes

Back when it was available on SR it had:

50 AP
25 -> 35% Tenacity
1290 -> 1200 Gold

The cost was lowered on the next patch and Tenacity buffed like half a year later.

Basically a Zeal-tier item. I bet if it wasn't removed it'd end up being a component for an item similar to the current Moonflair Spellblade.

Meep ManNov 26, 20161 votes

Because it would probably be the next Rylai's as far as how stupidly generic it would be, and it would be bought in 90% of games.

GigglesONov 26, 20163 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Toast Lord,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=I8sMZjtf,comment-id=0010,timestamp=2016-11-26T07:01:15.077+0000)

Because it would probably be the next Rylai's as far as how stupidly generic it would be, and it would be bought in 90% of games.

I'm pretty sure that's because they already pigeon hole everyone into building pretty much the same subset of items (based on class). There really isn't item diversity, or choice, besides a few niche items.

My Waifu VanillaNov 27, 20161 votes

I mean it is rarely bought on Twisted Treeline as is because it is too niche of an item. Yes, it IS gold-efficient, but it doesn't give enough of each stat to actually be slot efficient unless you can benefit from every single bit of it (mages are going to want more than 45 AP on an item so that leaves AP Tanks like Mao, Grag, or even Elise).

Sraeg2013Nov 26, 20161 votes