Smurfs Ruin the Gameplay and Balance of Lower Elo Games

GigglesO··75 votes·11,373 views

So after a few thoughts smurfing ruins ranked gameplay and the balance of this game. Not just that but the EULA says that you register for "an account". Which is a singular account. You guys dealt with smurfs playing on new accounts, now how about we deal with them playing on level 30 accounts.

Now I heard the argument that "there are a lot of things to learn from smurfs". Such as:

  1. Itemization
  2. Mechanics
  3. Objectives
  4. Team fighting

Now here is the problem with learning those things from smurfs.

  1. Itemization is very dependent on the game one shoe does not fit all feet, or at least if Riot's balancing system is working it shouldn't. However, if that was the case then we should only have one pair of boots in the store.
  2. Game mechanics are learnt through experience, you can watch someone play all you want, but that doesn't mean you will be able to pull off those mechanics.
  3. Objectives, come on really? A strong majority of us know that dragon, baron, and towers are important, but here is the deal. If you are getting extremely outplayed you don't have much of a chance to take objectives.
  4. Team fighting, there is something to be learnt here, at every level of play, but how are you supposed to learn how to better position yourself and play if you are being stomped so hard that you live for .5 seconds in a team fight.

Now that we have all of that information think about how Riot balances game play. Riot tries to balance game play by creating champions that are balance able all the way from bronze to challenger. How do they do this you might ask, well they do it by creating skill curves. Once you master that skill curve you can begin to rise the ladder, until you hit another skill curve that needs to be mastered.

Now ask yourself, what happens when you get a bunch of smurfs that dominate in games? How does this really offset the gameplay and balance of this game?

Well think about it Smurfs Promote inequality.

  1. How is riot supposed to balance champions by tier if you have random free radicals everywhere?
  2. How are players supposed to know what is actually strong in their tier if everything is determined by 1 smurf.
  3. It promotes gameplay toxicity, and angers players, again throwing off the game play experience.
  4. It skews balancing statistics because of those smurfs that afk or dominate games because they don't care.

Honestly I don't understand how, with smurfs, Riot can expect to balance the game. Look at the huge discrepancy of champions like Riven LeeSin. While in the past I have personally liked to complain about LeeSin, I mostly no longer do. The reason I haven't been complaining is because of the champions ability to be played at my MMR. The Lee Sin's of Gold are easily beatable, even with champions that are known to have a lower skill curve. However, when you see a smurf play him it feels like there is nothing to do to beat him; because your team hasn't developed the skills to beat him.

110 Comments

Bouncemaster Zac11 votes

I'm seeing a lot of "how can you tell someone is a smurf" in this thread and it's pretty simple. Smurfs almost always just outright say "oh I'm smurfing" in post-game. Because they want you to know you didn't have a chance at beating them. Because, yeah, they're smurfing "for fun," where their idea of fun is stomping helpless beginners and ruining their games. Smurfs are bad people.

Quil Evrything4 votes

{quoted}

I'm seeing a lot of "how can you tell someone is a smurf" in this thread and it's pretty simple. Smurfs almost always just outright say "oh I'm smurfing" in post-game.

You can only really KNOW someone is a smurf when they say they are. So claming "smurfs almost always..." is invalid. You have no proof of how many non-boasting smurfs there are.

oh, and PS: there are lots of reasons someone might do it. One of them being, "to help out friends". Which may or may NOT be "fun"

freeformline2 votes

Not all smurfs are bad people, but some (especially the type that points it out) are definitely not there out of any sense of goodwill. There are plenty of smurfs who are simply there to help a new player learn to play. If they are considerate, they may even hobble themselves by playing off-champions in odd roles so their skill doesn't ruin it for the other players.

T RexHasTinyArms2 votes

Smurfs who pub stomp and brag about it are bad. Some high Elo YouTube/streamers I like do unranked to diamond/masters accounts to talk about different mentalities and play styles across ranks. They are always polite though and pretty much never mention being on a smurf account.

T RexHasTinyArms9 votes

In some cases a smurf or second account does make sense:

  1. True smurfs were originally when high elo players had such long wait times that it was easier to make a second account and play vs players who were slightly lower than the top. Now it isn't as much of an issue because even diamond I ques are much shorter than they used to be given he influx of the number of players who play the game. However, maybe it still takes a long que at like masters+ MMR so they would still use this method to play a smurf in high plat/low diamond in order to play games faster.

  2. If you main a particular role/champ to your highest elo, but want to learn something else then a second account may make sense. It's not a smurf in the sense of trying to avoid long que times, but rather just a second account to play something that your skill level is lower on, but still be in a serious game. If you played things you are MUCH weaker on than your main while using your main account you would ruin people's games at your elo. However, at the same time most people play normals much less seriously in ranked so you can't be sure your practice is really competitive. I hit gold V and can play a half dozen champs at that level and maybe 1 champ at gold IV level or so. I don't play ADC at all anymore because of how much it would hurt my team (I play Heimer bot lane bc he does good damage and more importantly brings the ability to fast push that you need from an ADC). If I wanted to play ADC I'd have to play it on a different account bc I'm at best mid bronze or so as an ADC.

  3. It's not the best of reasons, but I've done it myself so I can't really say I think it should never be done. If you are division V of a tier and duo qued your promos and games that got you there, then playing a second account and not using duo when you are within 2 divisions of your main account's ranked can be a way to check if you can get to that tier yourself or have to have the consistency advantage that duo que can provide to the quality of teams you get.

Red Ryu3 votes

I find playing against Smurfs of players ranked higher than me to be very fun and helps me learn how to play against.

Might just be me though. I love playing against people better than me.

RISE Shlack1232 votes

So if you're in your Gold 5 promos with 2 wins and 2 losses, you're okay with having a Diamond 1 smurf on the enemy team? The majority of us aren't because it isn't fair. It would be like playing beer league softball but the opposing team has a major league player on their team.

Red Ryu2 votes

{quoted}

So if you're in your Gold 5 promos with 2 wins and 2 losses, you're okay with having a Diamond 1 smurf on the enemy team? The majority of us aren't because it isn't fair. It would be like playing beer league softball but the opposing team has a major league player on their team.

I am, and I would ask this.

You play someone gold 3 who is better than you and lose, you play someone diamond 5 and lose.

I would say the same thing.

You need to learn how to beat it, no matter the elo and situation.

That is what I accepted as a player of fighting games. Bracket will be made to help you play against people around your level, more or less, but you will face someone well beyond you at some point.

You either win or you don't.

That is why I am ok with it, if you are not. I hate to say, get good, but that is the only answer I got for that. I think learning to improve is better for everyone no matter the elo and that is why I am ok with it.

Croanin2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Red Ryu,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=HP7dF0G6,comment-id=000500020000,timestamp=2015-10-10T02:29:27.032+0000)

I am, and I would ask this.

You play someone gold 3 who is better than you and lose, you play someone diamond 5 and lose.

I would say the same thing.

You need to learn how to beat it, no matter the elo and situation.

That is what I accepted as a player of fighting games. Bracket will be made to help you play against people around your level, more or less, but you will face someone well beyond you at some point.

You either win or you don't.

That is why I am ok with it, if you are not. I hate to say, get good, but that is the only answer I got for that. I think learning to improve is better for everyone no matter the elo and that is why I am ok with it.

I'd rather win or lose a promo game because I ran into a smurf then a because of a toxic player or a negative player who says "GG surrender at 20"

RISE Shlack1232 votes

Well the skill disparity between myself, Gold 5, and someone in Diamond 5 is so big that I would be salty if I lost because the match wasn't fair. Sure, after the game was over and I accepted it, I'd watch the replay and try to learn from it, but it doesn't stop the frustration of facing it in a crucial game.

And "get good"? How old are you? I'm above average at this game, but I would simply prefer to play with people of similar skill level.

Biffolo2 votes

It wasn't fair because you aren't good enough. If you were able to play at a higher level it wouldnt be as bad.

Biffolo2 votes

Funny thing, that actually happens with my local softball league. The guy used to pitch for the braves AAA team. You know what the neat thing is? No one bitches. You try and learn and play around him.

GigglesO1 votes

{quoted}

Not sure how much you can learn from getting completely dominated in lane but okay.

So what people in this thread don't understand, there is a difference from learning from your mistakes, and being stomped so hard, that you don't even know what your mistakes were. Normally as players climb the ladder they figure out what mistakes they are making. However, against a smurf that is good enough you don't even know what you are doing wrong. Take for example a smurf Lee Sin that executes a Q dash kick from tower to a ward hop, and then compare it to a non-smurf. Not only is the timing more flawless, but you have less time to try and make a move that would allow counter play. This is all because a smurf is more efficient at doing those things in those steps.

Just look at the difference of Riven in a "skilled quick combo" and a normal "non-quick combo". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0qO715z_OKk

{quoted}

So if you're in your Gold 5 promos with 2 wins and 2 losses, you're okay with having a Diamond 1 smurf on the enemy team? The majority of us aren't because it isn't fair. It would be like playing beer league softball but the opposing team has a major league player on their team.

Honestly, this is exactly what it is like. Even though it might happen, that isn't a fair game play experience.

[{quoted}](name=Red Ryu,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=HP7dF0G6,comment-id=000500020000,timestamp=2015-10-10T02:29:27.032+0000)

You need to learn how to beat it, no matter the elo and situation.

It isn't about learning how to beat it, it is about learning how to control 4 other people on your team. 1 good player can play safe enough not to feed (even a smurf), but one player can not stop the rest of his team from feeding, or afking.

[{quoted}](name=T RexHasTinyArms,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=HP7dF0G6,comment-id=000900000000,timestamp=2015-10-10T03:04:54.181+0000)

I mean, if I had to wait 30 minutes to an hour every time I qued up before the game could find teammates for me I don't think I'd play. Would you?

The funny part about this is that if people would stop smurfing, there would be more players in the pool, and that would allow shorter queue times.

RISE Shlack1231 votes

Edit: You make good points. I was just confused why you only replied to me with lots of quotes from other people instead of making it a new post under this thread.

yukonl3 votes

To be honest most of the smurfs I've met were diamond were streaming and coaching. So sometimes it can be beneficial.

RISE Shlack1232 votes

It can be beneficial, but they should still keep that crap in normals so us normies can have a shot at climbing.

Croanin4 votes

{quoted}

It can be beneficial, but they should still keep that crap in normals so us normies can have a shot at climbing.

If you can't climb because you bump into a smurf every now and then your problem is your skill level. Your shot at climbing as to do with you improving and being the common denominator in your game. Smurfs, trolls, feeders, afks all part of the chaos of solo queue that your consistency needs to be above in order to climb.

RISE Shlack1232 votes

Your comment is true to an extent. I can climb, so that's not my point. My point is the times you do run into a smurf, troll/feeder or an afk happen more and more frequently and can add up. Not only that, but they can happen during promos and ruin your motivation to keep playing the game.

I don't know about you, but if I'm tilting, I stop playing. So if a smurf just completely roflstomps my team and costs me my series, I stop playing. And the statistics of troll games (games including smurfs, troll/feeders or afks) are on the rise, so it's very easy to have these issues stonewall your climb.

Oh, and I have a job and a daughter. I only get to play a few games a day, so those troll games are bigger than you can probably imagine. I get my "me" time ruined by people who give 0 fucks about other people.

Edit: It's also hard to argue with my ranked stats: http://na.op.gg/summoner/champions/userName=shlack123

I'm clearly playing well enough to climb.

Croanin2 votes

{quoted}

Your comment is true to an extent. I can climb, so that's not my point. My point is the times you do run into a smurf, troll/feeder or an afk happen more and more frequently and can add up. Not only that, but they can happen during promos and ruin your motivation to keep playing the game.

I don't know about you, but if I'm tilting, I stop playing. So if a smurf just completely roflstomps my team and costs me my series, I stop playing. And the statistics of troll games (games including smurfs, troll/feeders or afks) are on the rise, so it's very easy to have these issues stonewall your climb.

Oh, and I have a job and a daughter. I only get to play a few games a day, so those troll games are bigger than you can probably imagine. I get my "me" time ruined by people who give 0 fucks about other people.

My point is if Riot is going to address the issue of smurfs they need to address toxic players, afkers etc, while their at it. A smurf is just a another thing out of your control along with all that other crap you deal with in Solo Q. If you focus on your own play and keep improving you should climb regardless otherwise your just not good enough to yet.

I'm not sure how many smurfs I've run into, since it can be hard to confirm there a smurf. Sometimes they just claim their Diamond one, sometimes it's evident in their match history, but w/e Live and Let Die. I'll beat them anyway (unless its' a smurfing jungle Lee Sin...your screwed lol)

RISE Shlack1231 votes

I never said Riot can/should do anything about smurfing. I'm simply putting it on the same level as trolling. And I do focus on my own gameplay - I frequently watch my replays, especially when I lose, and I apply it to my future games.

Me not liking people who ruin lower elo because they don't like playing at their own elo isn't me trying to say "Riot control everything in this game". I simply don't like it because it skews the numbers and sets my whole team on tilt.

Croanin2 votes

{quoted}

I never said Riot can/should do anything about smurfing. I'm simply putting it on the same level as trolling. And I do focus on my own gameplay - I frequently watch my replays, especially when I lose, and I apply it to my future games.

Me not liking people who ruin lower elo because they don't like playing at their own elo isn't me trying to say "Riot control everything in this game". I simply don't like it because it skews the numbers and sets my whole team on tilt.

Lol I just don't see how though bro. First of all the only way to know someone is a smurf is if you do research on the enemy as the game loads. I personally don't think you should do this. If you perceive the enemy to be bad you might go to aggro and get yourself killed, if you perceive the enemy as very good you might play more cautious then normal. Researching your allies in champ select imo is more effective to see what roles there best at so you can play around them.

Teams are going to tilt if someone is feeding regardless. Don't get me wrong I think some plat player smurfing bronze just to get their rocks off is lame. However out of all the toxic ways to lose a game I think that's the way I'd rather lose the most.

What I can't stand are people on my team that just up and quit. They assume the game is over and stop trying when the game is still winnable.

RISE Shlack1232 votes

Gameplay is more telling than stats, as there are many smurfts, boosters and account sharers out there. And it puts your team on tilt by one of your lanes feeding to a Diamond smurf (you don't have to know the player is a smurf - all your team knows is that one of your lanes is feeding hard), and the entire team loses morale as the game quickly gets out of hand.

I agree that I hate it when people just throw their hands up and surrender. This is why I'm also an advocate of not checking stats before a game.

I'm simply saying that people don't learn by getting stomped by a smurf. Learning comes over time and is incremental. You learn best by playing against gradually increasing the skill level of your opponents. To use education as an example - you can't jump from 5th grade math to College-level Calculus and even hope to learn anything. You have to learn on your own over a gradual period of time. You don't learn by making huge leaps in skill level.

Treeofwar2 votes

people smurf to have fun its not very fun to have to play ranked super seriously ever single game. Its a way to release the stress that builds up without picking a troll pick to have fun they can pick their favorite champ play around and still win. Also people say that this person is a smurf but sometimes they are not they might just be good.

GigglesO24 votes

{quoted}

people smurf to have fun its not very fun to have to play ranked super seriously ever single game. Its a way to release the stress that builds up without picking a troll pick to have fun they can pick their favorite champ play around and still win. Also people say that this person is a smurf but sometimes they are not they might just be good.

Here is the thing though, people go to ranked to play seriously. What is so wrong about playing normals, or aram, or dominion when you want to have fun or even troll pick? Why should it be allowed for them to ruin some ones' game play, and the balance of this game?

Treeofwar1 votes

{quoted}

Here is the thing though, people go to ranked to play seriously. What is so wrong about playing normals, or aram, or dominion when you want to have fun or even troll pick? Why should it be allowed for them to ruin some ones' game play, and the balance of this game?

they dont ruin the balance of the game and they dont play norms because they still have to play vs people of their skill level which means i still have to try to win they want to win in a relaxing way. SO they make a smurf and play ranked or norms and "ruin" the game for some players there is nothing riot can do about it, its not like they can just look at a player and say yup smurf and ban him.

GigglesO4 votes

{quoted}

they dont ruin the balance of the game and they dont play norms because they still have to play vs people of their skill level which means i still have to try to win they want to win in a relaxing way. SO they make a smurf and play ranked or norms and "ruin" the game for some players there is nothing riot can do about it, its not like they can just look at a player and say yup smurf and ban him.

Actually, they can do something about it, how do you think they catch boosting? Also, ruining games for other players is against the summoners code, which is something they are adamant about protecting.

Treeofwar3 votes

{quoted}

Actually, they can do something about it, how do you think they catch boosting? Also, ruining games for other players is against the summoners code, which is something they are amendment about protecting.

how would they know if someone is smurfing? Just because they are good at the game? my friend is a gold player who got placed in bronze he climbed out in like 2 months should we say he is smurfing and ban him for it just because he stomped them?

GigglesO1 votes

{quoted}

how would they know if someone is smurfing? Just because they are good at the game? my friend is a gold player who got placed in bronze he climbed out in like 2 months should we say he is smurfing and ban him for it just because he stomped them?

I don't know how riot catches boosted players, I saw one person get banned just for being boosted in his promos. If I knew how they got banned I'd be working for them, now wouldn't I.

Treeofwar1 votes

{quoted}

I don't know how riot catches boosted players, I saw one person get banned just for being boosted in his promos. If I knew how they got banned I'd be working for them, now wouldn't I.

riot cant ban smurfs for just being good at the game because there is no way of knowing if he is a smurf boosting is another thing.

GigglesO3 votes

{quoted}

riot cant ban smurfs for just being good at the game because there is no way of knowing if he is a smurf boosting is another thing.

But they can make new rulings on how smurfs are treated, and stop them from ruining games for others.

Treeofwar2 votes

{quoted}

But they can make new rulings on how smurfs are treated, and stop them from ruining games for others.

how would they know they are a smurf?

Axis the Dragon2 votes

How do they know someone's boosting?

The same arguments can be made for both cases, yet Riot seems to be pretty accurate with their booster bans

Biffolo3 votes

Booster bans are based off drastic changes in playstyle, different hotkey setups, different champ pool, and many other things. None of those would be evident on a smurf account you own.

Treeofwar1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Axis the Dragon,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=HP7dF0G6,comment-id=0000000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2015-10-10T02:14:08.072+0000)

How do they know someone's boosting?

The same arguments can be made for both cases, yet Riot seems to be pretty accurate with their booster bans

riot can find elo boosters by their mmr just suddenly jumping form gold 5 to plat 1 if you played in gold 5 for 100 games and are still not out. Look it up but how can you find a smurf who does not need to stay in gold 5 for 100 games they can just ruin it for 30 game go to the next teir and do it again.

Tehlawlfirm1 votes

Not entirely true and if it is that's a shitty system. People can jump elo but the roles/positions they play. If someone mains support and slowly climbs and then switches to adc and climbs faster it's not that their account is being boosted it's that they are carrying games harder then when they did as a support which means more win %

Aerilus1 votes

Either way it would still be a pretty reliable way to check boosters. I doubt it pays attention to 'fast boosting' unless it is something like a player in Bronze suddenly is playing at high Gold level within 2 or 3 games

The example you gave is more of an exception than the norm.

Catastrop10 votes

Why not just play ARAM then? ARAM is where you go for fun without the need to play like a pro. Sure you're going to find a few ARAM Nazis who just go full retard but they can be brushed off.

Treeofwar4 votes

{quoted}

Why not just play ARAM then? ARAM is where you go for fun without the need to play like a pro. Sure you're going to find a few ARAM Nazis who just go full retard but they can be brushed off.

most people dont like aram you cant really have tons of fun. what if i wanted to play zed but man i just got temmo i dont get to have fun with the champ i wanted to play. Most people play the normal summoners rift where they can actually go back to base without haveing to kill themself.

moohannamtat 24 votes

{quoted}

most people dont like aram you cant really have tons of fun. what if i wanted to play zed but man i just got temmo i dont get to have fun with the champ i wanted to play. Most people play the normal summoners rift where they can actually go back to base without haveing to kill themself.

Smurf shut the fuck up.

brad6 votes

[{quoted}](name=Slasher 7777,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=HP7dF0G6,comment-id=000000000000000100000000,timestamp=2015-10-09T22:37:00.819+0000)

Smurf shut the fuck up.

fucking amazing contribution to the conversation. this guy has been nothing but formal and respectful and is trying to have an actual fucking conversation and you come in saying 'fuck you smurf' as if it puts you on some higher moral position and yet here you are with +3 and there he is with -20 reddit style forums are just amazing

Baddest Hooker1 votes

You missed the point....

At least for me, that's what I was thinking through out all his replies.

Aerilus2 votes

Yeah the point was: Every time TREEOFWAR mentioned 'fun', he really meant it was more fun to play on a smurf account cause he can crush beginners. That is a large reason why people smurf, the 'fun' in crushing a beginner.

GigglesO9 votes

{quoted}

Why not just play ARAM then? ARAM is where you go for fun without the need to play like a pro. Sure you're going to find a few ARAM Nazis who just go full retard but they can be brushed off.

I agree, aram is a pretty easy solution to this whole issue. It avoids the whole issue of people stomping lower elo players.

MohawkBird2 votes

[deleted]

Croanin1 votes

{quoted}

So basically what you're saying is ruin other people's experience who are actually trying to climb for the sake of your own fun. Get real man, if you want to have fun how about to play a normal instead of ruining other's days just so you can make yourself look good.

Even if you want to smurf, don't do it in a ranked match. People are there to try to climb, and when they get shut down by a player 4 tiers above them it's not fun, and it ruins their chances.

Whether it's ethical is debatable but dealing with a smurf is better then dealing with a toxic player, afk, rage quitter or a "GG surrender at 20 were 3-0"

Aerilus1 votes

The toxic player is a different issue: no one wants a smurf or toxic player Smurfs often create a lot of toxicity, or bring out the toxicity of players, even if they are completely silent the whole game.

A Liberal2 votes

When I was first starting the game (right after I got smite), I was spamming ww jungle because I went against one who was really strong and I liked his splash. One game I encountered 2 silver smurfs in a duo bot lane, who were actually really nice.... except they told me that the best start on ww was to not follow the reccomended build path and instead rush item 3026, than get a item 3004, and than a item 3035. Being so low level and not having a grasp of the game, I played WW this way until about level 23 or so when somebody was like WTF ARE YOU DOING PLZ STOP and than told me about mobafire xD.

Smurfs r bad mkay

Croanin3 votes

{quoted}

When I was first starting the game (right after I got smite), I was spamming ww jungle because I went against one who was really strong and I liked his splash. One game I encountered 2 silver smurfs in a duo bot lane, who were actually really nice.... except they told me that the best start on ww was to not follow the reccomended build path and instead rush item 3026, than get a item 3004, and than a item 3035. Being so low level and not having a grasp of the game, I played WW this way until about level 23 or so when somebody was like WTF ARE YOU DOING PLZ STOP and than told me about mobafire xD.

Smurfs r bad mkay

That's cruel. But what anyone can just google Warwick guide and not have to deal with crap like that. Abuse the information age people.

Squidblimp1 votes

I had a Platinum smurf playing Vayne top in my promos to Silver 3. It was instantly obvious. She got a double kill on the Garen top and Ekko jungle, Garen raged and stole mid from me, I was Veigar. After going top, I was greeted with a Vayne that perfectly attack moved after every CS, dived in for harass and dipped out as soon as I fired skill shots. She was also running full AD runes for the early lane dominance and rushed Beserkers Greaves, because she knew she could get away with it, and solo carried team fights.

Said she played in Silver because she was bored.

Croanin3 votes

{quoted}

I had a Platinum smurf playing Vayne top in my promos to Silver 3. It was instantly obvious. She got a double kill on the Garen top and Ekko jungle, Garen raged and stole mid from me, I was Veigar. After going top, I was greeted with a Vayne that perfectly attack moved after every CS, dived in for harass and dipped out as soon as I fired skill shots. She was also running full AD runes for the early lane dominance and rushed Beserkers Greaves, because she knew she could get away with it, and solo carried team fights.

Said she played in Silver because she was bored.

You should learn how to attack move in order to climb. Hell I"m plat and I still suck at last hitting. I'd be more upset at the Garen for raging.

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