Zileans ult with Rewind = 28.6 second cooldown

I Main Swain··4 votes·1,570 views

Zilean has gotten a LOT more attention recently, and for good reason. To keep this organized, lets start with his passive.

Passive: Heightened Learning - increased experience gain of all allied champions by 8%. this does not apply while he is dead. I thought rito has clearly shown their disdain of global passives when they nerfed the tf and janna passives? on top of that, his is stronger anyways. I personally have had several matches where I am zoning the enemy hardcore, but im still actually having a hard time keeping up with them in levels sometimes. Can we please either change this to an aura, or change it to a cdr passive aura?

Q: Time Bombs - personally, I don't have a problem with this, it has counter play (mostly at least) and its his only damaging ability so naturally it should be strong. I think its fine.

W: Rewind - heres the problem with Zilean. Reduces all other ability cooldowns by 10 seconds. early game, sure it has an 18 second cooldown, but at max rank it has a 6 second cooldown. if you have max cdr, that comes to 3.6 seconds. this is especially a problem with support Zilean, and I will get into its combo with his Time Warp and Chronoshift when I go over them.

E: Time Warp - Zilean can choose to either speed himself or an ally by 55% for 2.5 - 5.5 seconds depending on rank, or he can slow an enemy champion for the same amount for the same amount of time. the cooldown is 20 seconds at all ranks. max cooldown reduction makes that 12 seconds. throw in a Rewind and that's 2 seconds for the first one, 3.6 for every one after that because that's the cooldown of Rewind. Note, this is a shorter cooldown than the duration. that is a big no-no. flashed away? ok, ill just walk up again and slow you some more, or maybe ill just speed up this rengar like Royal Club, permanently. How do you think youre going to feel with a 550 ms rengar headed down the lane towards you?

R: Chronoshift - most people see this and theyre like "this is fine, sure it revives someone but theyre stuck there for 2 seconds and its got a 3 minute cooldown." it doesn't really have a 3 minute cooldown. assuming you have your w maxed and you have max cooldown reduction, it comes out to a 28.6 second cooldown. he will have his ult up every fight unless youre doing a bunch of small fights SUPER fast. imagine this with a team of something like kayle, tryndamere, zac, trox, and zilean. I feel as if once zilean grouped nobody would die - ever.

12 Comments

Old Man Teeto2 votes

Zileans ultimate is super strong, but at the same time he requires someone worth ulting and for the enemy team to actually be committed to fighting.

He works well against the popular assassin and all-in picks currently, however poke/kite/sustain wrecks him.

I Main Swain1 votes

yes, he is weak against poke teams, but that's why he usually plays on all-in teams (ex: sej, kat, jinx, zilean, and jax). most of the time, unless you are very behind against a very high poke team, you aren't going to just be poked to death all the time. On top of that, a champion shouldn't have the power to force a team to focus their whole comp around countering him. And having someone worth ulting isn't really a weakness, its just stupidity on your teams part of not picking any champs that are good enough to ult.

Rew7111 votes

But his ult has a good weakness. Like say you were to go off against an enemy team. The enemy team has a 4 v 2 (you and your arc) and target either you or the other guy. With that, they will group up and finish one of you, but you ult and they are revived. But that's where the problem lies. They notice that he is about to come back. They then wait on top of him (or you) then when you are back you just die again. They need to do something about that.

WeFlyNoLie2 votes

Well look at your situation, if is a 4vs2, one champion shouldn't give you the clear advantage of winning that.

If its an even fight, and they just sit on the person reviving, then they leave themselves open to attack from the rest of your team.

Rew7111 votes

But the guy still dies. When they just sit on him and unanimously attack, your comrades aren't just going to think "I've got to go back and risk my life for that one guy". They're more likely going to run. Even if it were even. It wouldn't be as soon as it became 4 v 3 and surely one guy will gain fear and leave making it into a 4 v 2 with no ult.

YGW Caspie2 votes

So his weakness is to force fights that are clearly favorable, e.g. 4v3, 4v2?

That is a not a very good argument for a champion weakness.

Aatrox, Anivia, and Zac all need a new passive then, not to mention how bad of an item Guardian Angel must be for the same reasons. What you could say however is that revival is not that beneficial when your team is behind but if your team is even or ahead it becomes increasingly beneficial.

Phoenix Kotori 1 votes

So his weakness is to force fights that are clearly favorable, e.g. 4v3, 4v2?

That is a not a very good argument for a champion weakness.

Aatrox, Anivia, and Zac all need a new passive then, not to mention how bad of an item Guardian Angel must be for the same reasons. What you could say however is that revival is not that beneficial when your team is behind but if your team is even or ahead it becomes increasingly beneficial.

Those passives and GAs have meaningful CDs. 28.6 seconds on a revival skill isn't meaningful.

WeFlyNoLie3 votes

But the point is still not relevant. If you're in a 4vs2 stiuation, it doesn't matter who you have for champions.

That isn't a weakness, its just a situation 9 times out of 10, you aren't going to win anyway.

I Main Swain1 votes

youre still assuming that your team is getting absolutely raped. First off, if you couldn't do things like that about Zileans ult then they call that no counter play and it would need even more work done. Second, unless your team is getting screwed over, or you just made a stupid mistake at some point in your teamfight, or you are all noobs, you aren't simply going to "turn tail and run because theyre getting destroyed". just because his ult can revive people doesn't mean your team is automatically losing...

Awesome Bowler1 votes

I don't know how much experience you have playing the wonderful Chronokeeper, but I have a few things to say about this. (Is it a proposal?) Playing Zilean, you hit the nail on the head that as he is dead the global xp passive is not a factor in game play. The revive is most definitely up within less than 30 secs in a team fight at max cdr and maxed 'w'. The speed boost is a very useful ability and can play a huge role in the turn of a fight.

Here is where I believe your problem lies with Zilean. Your problem is that he can turn the tides of a previously bad fight, so that your team can win the fight simply by reviving a fed Yi, Tristana, etc. This problem is simple to solve.

FOCUS HIM! Zilean is a very, VERY, squishy champion, especially in the support role and a touch less in the mid lane. It is quite easy to kill him before the rest of the team; this can have two outcomes:

  1. Zilean uses his ult on himself so that it can not be used in the teamfight.
  2. Zilean is unable to cast his ult because of a silence, a stun, a BURST of damage.

I believe that there is nothing wrong with Zilean right now, because of how vulnerable he is in all stages of the game. If you are frustrated with him, kill him early or ban him in draft queues.

Advocate for Zilean,

Awesome Bowler

Duke Anax1 votes

I agree here. i used to play a lot of Zilean when no one knew about him. It was Op, becasue everyone simply kept hitting my target and running away after "killing" them.

Knowadays a lot more people know how to handle him and I have trouble actually getting the ult up.

I Main Swain2 votes

I agree mostly with what you're saying, and I use the advantage of bursting him down to force his ult down often, but I feel as if it is too much of a game changer if it has a cooldown that short. yes, you can burst down zilean, but in an actual teamfight focusing zilean means letting his carries go free. sure its only a second or 2, but as anyone who plays league knows, that's an eternity in league time. on top of that, hes an easy champ to peel for himself and for someone else to peel for him because of Time Warp. Honestly, I think that I would be 100% fine with him if they just nerfed his w, whether cooldown time or the cdr it grants, and maybe give his q a shorter cooldown to compensate.

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