Instead of nerfing it, can you please rework Jax's ultimate.

Speak or Die·Nov 30, 2018·5 votes·3,221 views

Jax's ultimate not only gives him stats equal to a tank, it's absolutely not counter-able at all.

Not to mention it's really boring. Like, you just click it and he glows and has lines fly around him for 8 seconds. And a boring 3 hit passive.

He becomes un-killable and has the such high mobility when he has points into his Q.

How about reworking his ultimate into something that has a lot of power, but actually has counter-play.

If you took the damage and stats away from his ult, this could leave room for a really good concept, to fulfil that "Grandmaster" archetype. And maybe something visually appealing

13 Comments

OneMustFallNov 30, 20185 votes

I'm on board with this. I always felt that Jax's ult was underwhelming. Like it's just a big stat boost that you can't really tell is active or not. Give him like a giant lamp post for 30 seconds or something that catches people on fire. Now that's an ult.

PhDs NutsNov 30, 20182 votes

"Take the damage and stats away from his ult"? What's left?

Speak or DieNov 30, 20182 votes

[{quoted}](name=Gajalaka Doodle,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Gdhf9G3B,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2018-11-30T15:05:15.444+0000)

"Take the damage and stats away from his ult"? What's left?

The reworked ultimate..???

GravesingerNov 30, 20181 votes

To be honest, Jax should be in line for a full-on VGU, same with Yi and several other champions from that era.

Back in the day when League was still a fledgling title, these kits were pretty much okay. Simple, easy to learn and play, nothing noteworthy or overcomplicated about them.

Now? Not so much. Champions are constantly being released with more and more complex mechanics and interactions. I'm not saying simplicity is bad, but something you never see on new/reworked champions these days (something I'm extremely happy to get away from) is what I like to call PBGS: Press button, get stats.

There are a number of (old) champions that do this. Yi (E): get AD and true conversion. Yi (R): get speed. Jax (R): get Armor/MR. Garen (W): get resistances (and tenacity, if I'm not mistaken). Sure, sometimes they go a little deeper than that (Yi R and its reset, for example). But the point is that champ abilities which are nothing more than PBGS are not only frustrating to play against (zero skill expression for a big old steroid), but are downright uninteresting to play with or against.

Yeah, the turbo-mobility trend isn't God's gift to man, but it's better than "I pressed W, so you can't damage me anymore, even though you're still hitting me." bleh.

OleandervineNov 30, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Ainz Ooal Gainz,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Gdhf9G3B,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-11-30T13:58:52.162+0000)

To be honest, Jax should be in line for a full-on VGU, same with Yi and several other champions from that era.

Back in the day when League was still a fledgling title, these kits were pretty much okay. Simple, easy to learn and play, nothing noteworthy or overcomplicated about them.

Now? Not so much. Champions are constantly being released with more and more complex mechanics and interactions. I'm not saying simplicity is bad, but something you never see on new/reworked champions these days (something I'm extremely happy to get away from) is what I like to call PBGS: Press button, get stats.

There are a number of (old) champions that do this. Yi (E): get AD and true conversion. Yi (R): get speed. Jax (R): get Armor/MR. Garen (W): get resistances (and tenacity, if I'm not mistaken). Sure, sometimes they go a little deeper than that (Yi R and its reset, for example). But the point is that champ abilities which are nothing more than PBGS are not only frustrating to play against (zero skill expression for a big old steroid), but are downright uninteresting to play with or against.

Yeah, the turbo-mobility trend isn't God's gift to man, but it's better than "I pressed W, so you can't damage me anymore, even though you're still hitting me." bleh.

Unfortunately, Riot has expressed that they believe Jax is viable for a minor, Ezreal level VGU, which I do not agree with at all. I'm with you in that I find his kit too "stat stick" for him to be viably transitioned into the modern with most of it intact.

SukishooNov 30, 20181 votes

Master Yi already had a VGU in 2013 which has held up decently. He's meant to be a simplistic champion.

Jax definitely needs more but Riot unfortunately see him on the smaller scale rework list.

Mace of SpadesNov 30, 20181 votes

On the other hand, it is important to have champions with simple kits, which is why they reworked Warwick the way they did. Champions with simplistic "zero skill expression" kits allow new players to learn the game much easier, and older players who possess more game knowledge and macro than the average yasuo main to bypass key spamming micro and focus on their strengths. Also, it is far more boring for every champion to follow some trend of high mobility than it is for some of them to use walking positioning and exchange that for tankiness or damage. Just because a champion doesn't reflect new kits doesn't mean it's unhealthy for the game

GravesingerDec 2, 20181 votes

You're right, just because something doesn't follow the new trends, doesn't mean it is unhealthy. But one thing you'll notice about what I said, if you actually take the time to read it, is that simple kits are not bad by definition. In fact, and I quote:

"I'm not saying simplicity is bad"

is a sentence ripped directly from the original post. I don't dislike simple kits. I don't dislike giving new players a crutch to aid them in surmounting the extremely steep learning curve of the game. What I do not like, as I said once before, is Push Button, Get Stats. These abilities do not have simple interactions, they have no interactions. There is nothing even remotely interesting about playing Garen, clicking W, and simply taking less damage for a bit. They are uninteresting to play, they are uninteresting to fight against, they are flat out boring, and something that shouldn't exist in the game anymore. Stats attached to other abilities is fine: Aatrox E is an interesting tool in his kit, for example. But Yi E, a perpetual AA damage buff, feels less like an ability and more like you tacked some extra AD on to his kit because you couldn't fill up another ability slot with something interactive.

Also, I never said turbo-mobility was good, I said it was comparatively better than Push Button, Get Stats.

Moody PNov 30, 20181 votes

the counterplay is to kite him out, hard disengage or bring true damage

Speak or DieNov 30, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Moody P,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Gdhf9G3B,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2018-11-30T14:30:58.543+0000)

the counterplay is to kite him out, hard disengage or bring true damage

Kite a 2.4 second leap with massive range?

Moody PNov 30, 20181 votes

are you talking lane or late game? late game you should be with your team and yeah, you can definitely kite and peel a jax with your team

he's a hypercarry, and a melee one at that; hypercarries need to have strong steroids.

NetorareNov 30, 20181 votes

There is no point in reworking jax ult, he is gonna get a full rework anyway together with the remaining champs...

Ignika DNov 30, 20181 votes

the prob with his ulti is he already can dodge and reduce aoe damage with counterstrike so is just a little helper in case he dodge too early so is bad design