I mean, its really not that good... every ADC can outburst your healing with one item, ok, they could outburst a Soraka with 99% CDR and infinite mana and HP healing you, but still...
Swains Ultimate doesnt feel like a power up, it feels more like "now I am able to actually do sth for a few seconds"... It could as well only rely on the Sould fragments and dont have any CD at all...
DiG JJ8 votesNo it doesn't need it. And I think it'll probably get proper scaling put in. I guess its better to be released underpowered than OP.
nelogis8 votesAnd then patched to 100% pick / ban
The Yasuo special
Edit: Can't wait to see the 9% max hp damage per 100 AP on his ult, the good'ol Galio one two buckle a shoe if you know what I mean
Infernape5 votesNever forget 7.21 Galio.
Samflash32 votesOr release the champion overpowered and people claim its to sell skins and champion packs?
LordGeovanni1 votesAnd then patched to 100% pick / ban
The Yasuo special
Edit: Can't wait to see the 9% max hp damage per 100 AP on his ult, the good'ol Galio one two buckle a shoe if you know what I mean
Galio had to throw a spell that required you to sit in it to do the same thing that mages do on just building ap with instant damage applied. while building the same full ap build and being melee and not able to farm with autos after level 4
nelogis1 votesI don't know of a single mage that instantly does 9% max HP dmg per 100 AP (plus a flat amount) on a basic ability.
And you don't really need to farm with autos if 2 Q's take care of the whole wave but this Galio mini rework after his rework was a massive fail.
He is still on a 45% WR or so right?
The Yetii Rider7 votesSwain's rework is clearly in preparation for the upcoming AP item changes, where AP champions are getting a heavy dose of CDR injected into their pool.
Steelflame1 votesYea, they tend to do that fairly frequently. Release a champion with the idea of itemization that doesn't exist yet in the live version but is planned soon, such as when they released the batch of assassins near the end of S2 and put in some more assassin itemization properly at the start of pre-season.
TraceNA6 votesI love basically every aspect of New Swain's kit. The Ult is super underpowered considering how little damage it does though. I suggest allowing it to drain all health from all enemy champions around him instead of just 3, that way it gives him way more sustain in late game teamfights, makes him more deadly when he uses the ult and lets you pop demonflare with enough health left to make an escape since Swain is like Vel'Koz with legs it seems like.
edit: gonna mention my favorite aspect is the pull. That makes for some awesome plays and it feels great pulling it off too.
Z3Sleeper2 votesYeah the pull just feels good. Just like... YANK!
The E feels really satisfying to land too.
Arakadia4 votesWent from one of the shortest cooldown ults with high up time to one of the longes cooldowns in the game beyond summoner spells and the like.
Foxstep3 votesYes cause it can easily deal up to 1k damage to three squishies :0
Raoul38 votesIf you are around an ADC for 12 seconds, you will be dead for 10 of them
JackMcSnipeyz2 votesI played him a bit and he blows any squishy that gets close to him, after rylies you cant escape his ult.
I agree tho, his ult needs to go down with levels, it's not that tide turning.
Z3Sleeper1 votesI honestly find Rylais to be a noobtrap on him. You're alot better off with GLP or just taking Glacial Augment.
It's effective if you literally don't have a team. But if you have a team just let them deal with keeping em locked down after you pop GLP.
Foxstep2 votesHis q can deal a huge amount of burst too late game, just get a full build in custom and Test out yourself, he doesn’t lack any damage.
Raoul21 votesStill doenst justify this insane high CD on an Ultimate thats mediocre at best...
Nyarlathοtep8 votesHe needs to be in melee range for q to deal that much damage. + the fact that he needs to wait 2.5 second for it to come back, while adc's are pumping 600 crit aa with 1.75 atk speed.
Z3Sleeper5 votes600 crit aa? You're underplaying it and yet it still sounds awful for him lol.
You are right my bad. It would be 700 crit damage if it was a critical oriented adc( jinx, jhin) and 200 physical + 55 magical damage if the adc is an on hit oriented adc ( varus, kog).
Pierce The Veal2 votesYou are right my bad. It would be 700 crit damage if it was a critical oriented adc( jinx, jhin) and 200 physical + 55 magical damage if the adc is an on hit oriented adc ( varus, kog).
I mean I regularly hit 1000+ crits on many ADCs with at 1.75 or above AS, so I can still see you underplaying it, but yeah perhaps maybe on sivir or something you'd be about right.
Eh im not playing adc much. So i dont really the exact numbers.
Pierce The Veal1 votesYeah I’m one of those assassin mains that have been recently playing ADC because that’s the only way I know how to assassinate anymore :D
Sort of sick how much damage ADC’s deal.
LordGeovanni1 votesHe needs to be in melee range for q to deal that much damage. + the fact that he needs to wait 2.5 second for it to come back, while adc's are pumping 600 crit aa with 1.75 atk speed.
and fighters have to be in melee range all the time and none of them get anything remotely close to swains q except nasus on a basic spell not to mention for that much cooldown. and his ult facilitates him being in melee range.
Nyarlathοtep1 votesTo be fair swain late game sucks a bit. Only his q does damage. At close range that is. But he cant survive close range during late game since his ulti heals for so little.
Romans VI XXIII2 votesPoint blank range, on a champion with poor gapclosing capabilities. Mean while zoes base damage is higher than glass cannan swain. Oh she also deals hers in an AoE.
Zero Skill Tank1 votesMaking this thread all about ADC hatetrain is PRECISELY the reason why Riot doesn't give a shit about boards anymore.
GGLineaR1 votesIf you are around an ADC for 12 seconds, you will be dead for 10 of them
If I had a really fancy picture frame, I'd hang this comment on my wall to remind me that every second I'm complaining about getting one shot by assassins is a second I should actually be complaining about ADCs.
Because they do that burst damage per second.
Z3Sleeper2 votesDon't worry, he's gonna get buffs next patch for sure. What exactly they'll buff? Idk.
But that ult definitely has way too long a cooldown. Lategame when teamfights are happening every minute you can only use it every other teamfight.
Saianna2 votesIs he a mage that requires abilities to reliably kill?
Yes? Then fuck him, you and any other mage. 2 minute cooldown, now gtfo.
On the other hand ADCs get low CD ultimates AND lots of CDR, because Riot does shit for balance.
Nausicäa 2 votesI mean, its really not that good... every ADC can outburst your healing with one item, ok, they could outburst a Soraka with 99% CDR and infinite mana and HP healing you, but still...
Swains Ultimate doesnt feel like a power up, it feels more like "now I am able to actually do sth for a few seconds"... It could as well only rely on the Sould fragments and dont have any CD at all...
This is why the short range mage concept is fundamentally shit overall. You are forced to build AP items in order to do damage and the small amount of tanky items you build isnt nearly enough for you to survive anything mid- late game.
A Nunu2 votesRiot Balance Team: So what you're saying is we need to buff ADCs again?
OP Garen Support2 votesYeah it does feel kind of bad. Overall the swain rework looks awesome but feels bad. Its arguable he needs more damage but im sure the 2 min CD on ult is unnecessary.
Nyarlathοtep1 votesNope. It really doesnt. But its riot we are talking about. Yasuo and zoe might still have game breaking ( or rather match breaking) bugs but swain cant have a respectable ulti. The cooldown coupled with the actual numbers is just embarrassing. I totally agree with you post.
DarkSoul19941 votesI think literally the only thing Riot could change about Swain is his R cooldown. Everything else is actually great.
45% CDR + Fully-stacked Ultimate Hat @ Rank 3 is still a 56.1 second cooldown.
EDIT: I also think the cooldown is bugged because the tooltip says 56.1 seconds but when the Ult Duration Ends it goes to a 62 second cooldown.
Steelflame1 votesIts probably the same bug Rakan had with his The Quickness. The Cancel/end of the skill was getting the CDR from Ult Hat, not the actual cast of the skill itself.
AmazoX1 votesGet 40% CDR with Items. 5% extra CDR from Cosmic Insight rune. 15% CDR on ultimate from The Ultimate Hat Rune.
Taadaa 60% CDR on R.
Steelflame1 votesUlt hat CDR is multiplicive, not additive, so it isn't 60%. It ends up being 53.25% CDR. Not that it matters, because Swain's new ult is bugged with ult hat and doesn't actually get any benefit from it.
AmazoX1 votesUlt hat CDR is multiplicive, not additive, so it isn't 60%. It ends up being 53.25% CDR. Not that it matters, because Swain's new ult is bugged with ult hat and doesn't actually get any benefit from it.
I am lost, does ultimate hat not grant you 15% cdr after using it 5 times?
Done251 votesI am lost, does ultimate hat not grant you 15% cdr after using it 5 times?
It's 15% off the CD post any CDR you already have.
AmazoX1 votesIt's 15% off the CD post any CDR you already have.
Sooo its not as good as I thought..? Sorry I am confused. [zombie-brand-mindblown]
Done251 votesSooo its not as good as I thought..? Sorry I am confused. [zombie-brand-mindblown]
Here's an example: Base CD of 11 seconds. Your have an item that gives 10% CDR. The CD is now 10 seconds. You have another 10% CDR from Ult Hat The CD is now 9 seconds.
Get it?
Lord Galvatron1 votesYea he completely got Olafed from the PBE. I'm not sure what patch the LCS is playing on (if that even matters) so it might be that. Hopefully he'll end up like Bard or Tahm and be continually buffed until he's in a nice place.
RainbowIcee1 votesHis ult is more defensive than offensive though but it's not meant to make him a tank. ADC's outburst everyone even themselves so that's not really saying much. I think he's a pretty safe pick and landing his combo is easy not to mention he can deal a good amount of damage even if it's not burst it's good enough to dwindle on squishes and even duel some tanks. Because of the nature of his damage ofcourse an ADC will out damage him and so will some assassins, but then some AP's will not stand a chance fighting him.
AirKingNeo1 votesHe's been out for 2 days. I think your opinion is ill-informed.
Illâoi Evê Siôn1 votesPlease wait longer than a day before asking for buffs like this. Swain's still new and on a learning curve.
TeknoTel1 votesSwain is underwhelming. I just laned against a mundo. He can dive you two towers with ont MR item, you can land every single spell, constantly hitting him in the face with your Q, he will leave 2nd tower on full health after killing you.
Even in a team fight you will die before the ult procs usually. Even if you dont the burst damage at the end is like a tickle to enemy team, like a 10th of their hp or something.
I really love the idea and he feels fun to play, just seems completely useless unless you are playing aganst new players or something. Like you land your full combo, E into W with a Q to the face. Its not easy to lane, but most champions have one spell that does more damage, or one targeted cc that roots for longer and is much simpler to land.
So you think, ok must be a game changing ult.... nope.
RIP Swain.
RainXBlade1 votesI tried out the new Swain a few days ago as soon as it hit live and I have to say, the ult is kinda underpowered. The healing is nice, but the cooldown is way too high. I could suggest bumping down the cooldown by at least 10 to 15 seconds.