What Should I Do To Deal With Zed??

japan hate acc··2 votes·663 views

Hey everyone, Sciraen here.

I had my first ranked game yesterday, and I had the joy of laning against a Gold V Zed. I am unranked. It was during this matchup I really began to see the problem(s) with Zed. We had been even for a good part of the game, at one point I was even ahead. However, Talon uses mana. Zed does not. This not only gave him better sustain and the ability to recall less, but also allowed him to slowly close the gap between us. I had been ahead in levels and cs earlier, but as time went on, he slowly surpassed me. We had good duels, and I nearly killed him, and he somehow made it out with 40ish health. Then he bought Youmuu's. Upon buying Youmuu's, he killed me, recalled with 100 health, then teleported back to lane, roamed, killed the top laner, then got a double kill bot lane.

He then snowballed, and by the end of the game I was 0/6/2. I had checked his match history; Zed wasn't his main. He was average with Zed, yet he could overpower me with Talon, and I have been maining Talon since level 8. The fact that he was Gold V probably had something to do with it, but the fact that we were neck and neck early game goes to show that it wasn't just rank.

This is not just a rant; I came here to ask a question. How am I supposed to deal with Zed? Zhonya's doesn't work well with Talon, QSS doesn't work, Cleanse doesn't work, I'm kinda bad at Kayle, and his ult makes him momentarily invulnerable, and, after he deletes the champion he ulted on, he can press ult again to escape. His passive allows him to last hit well, even without items, and once he gets items, well...

12 Comments

0pAL2NlcpJ1 votes

Get defensive summoners, Get hourglass.

ShinkoMinori1 votes

Ban him

japan hate acc1 votes

Yeah, at this point that's the only thing I can do.

sangchu1 votes

Both champions have their ups and downs.

Both talon and zed are amazing duelers, but zed is a tad better with a bit more space of outplaying.

ZED: in terms of laning, zed does have a better harassing skillset. Energycost, long ranged skillshot, amazing damage overall. An escape mechanism too. In terms of dueling, he's amazing, especially since his passive is built for finishing off players (his autos deal shit tons of more dmg to low enemies), along with the ulti deathmark. Can recast his ulti to teleport back to his first shadow. He's basically a jump in, kill, dash out, champion. ** TALON:** uses mana, weak ass harass early, and has no escape mechanism. In terms of dueling, he's pretty dam good too. He has a blink, auto amplifier (his Q), his short ranged cone skillshot slow (his W), and his ulti to damage anyone near him and making him stealth. That's where talon beats zed. His ulti can be used for more things than zed's ulti. Zed's ulti is more focused on one person, whereas talon's ulti can hit multiple targets. Since it makes him stealth, it can also be used as an initiation, where the ADC might not expect you jumping in, whereas zed's initiation may be a lot more obvious since he needs to be right in front of the target to ulti. The ulti can also be used as an escape, and a 2 second(i think it's 2 seconds?) stealth can give u almost a guaranteed escape if you play it well. Zed's escape after his ulti is also really predictable, since there can only really be two places he can dash back to (his w shadow, or his ulti shadow). Talon is more free, however.

TL;DR : Zed beats talon in harass, and 1v1 dueling. They're both good at assassinating, but talon has more aoe, with a bit more freedom (his ulti can be used before he initiates, or to escape).

Also, zed has skillshots. U can dodge them if u move around enough w boots. Talon has no skillshot / a really wide skillshot. Almost impossible to dodge.

japan hate acc1 votes

Alright, thanks! Great analysis.

l Helios l1 votes

Real talk:

He's vulnerable after he uses the shadow + shuriken. That's when you trade with him. All he can do is auto after he full combos for about 7 or so seconds, so you have time. Shadow cd is around 12 or so seconds, and it will be maxed last, so that cd won't change.

He's weak at level 1 - 3. 4 is when he starts to hurt with the Q.

Q only hurts if it hits you first and not minions first. Stay behind minions.

As Talon, you have outplay potential too. You can E as he casts W and get a favorable trade because he will almost certainly be casting his Q and E simultaneously with his W. You can also ult as his starts his ult on you. His CD is higher than yours I believe.

Zed almost always maxes the Q first, so dodging that is the key to it all.

For roaming, hope other lanes can respect his roam potential. You can counter roam and duel him if you play it well with those tips.

A lot of it is respecting his trade potential and trading around his CDs.

Hope that helps.

japan hate acc1 votes

Yeah, thanks so much. I honestly think that a lot of it was nerves; I had beaten Zed's in the past as Talon by E-ing them when they use their W, it just didn't click that time when I was facing. I'll keep in mind what you said about his Q, that really helps. Thanks!

l Helios l1 votes

Np man.

Yeah biggest problem is people just don't know what they're doing so they make QQ threads. Whole point of the boards is to get help if your struggling against something.

Good luck.

SwapShadows1 votes

well first things first, you should realize that Talon beats Zed.

there is a big difference between instant and 3 seconds in a 1v1.

MunchCrunchLunch1 votes

talon is better in team fights because of his aoe ult and W. zed is kinda meh there

RogueWill1 votes

Grab summoner 12. That way if things go south you don't fall that much behind.

Trade with him after he uses his shadow. Shadow only last 4 sec, whenever you see Zed use it mentally count the 4 sec and go in as soon as the shadow is about to disappear.

Trade ult for ult. Zed ult amplify his damage so use your ult right after he uses his to negate most of his damage, the most he will be able to do is throw shurikens blindly. Then position yourself close to the ult cast shadow (the one that most likely will return to) If i remember correctly mark last 3 sec so you should be ok to jump on zed right after the your ult finishes.

And lastly, don't focus much on poking to keep mana. As an assassin you should be able to kill someone from close to 60% HP or so, so poking without the intent of going aggressive is pointless (unless you just want to force them out of lane)

Noksterz1 votes

Fizz does really well against zed, if you know & understand how to play him. Also Lissandra b/c of her invulnerability too. Wait for him to use his shadow to wave clear or poke and then make your move. You dont always have to all-in everytime either. Just go in, get off some good dmg and get out. Zed is really oppressive right now thanks to riot changing qss

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