PSA: If I Ask For A Leash...

japan hate acc·Apr 21, 2016·96 votes·5,705 views

This is literally what happened: (me): Leash please : You can do it on your own : No, I can't : Please I need a leash : It's that simple : Do it yourself

[His support starts to walk over to me to help] [Graves starts spamming pings and tells them to go back] [Support stays in bot lane]

Luckily, in top lane was kind enough to let me clear some of his minion waves so I could reach level two. But my point is, if you explicitly refuse to leash, don't expect your jungler to gank. Ever. Or give you blue/red buff. Leashing is very important as a jungler. We need it. Also, don't be that d!ck who keeps on attacking the monster, so the jungler doesn't reach level two. It's a very important part and we need it. Thanks.

176 Comments

D3m37r1Apr 21, 201668 votes

Wait there are still people that refuse to leash?

IcyPepperApr 21, 201638 votes

There are people who also don't get ganks, coincidentally.

I mean, you're not going to lose cs or xp if you do it properly -_-

kile147Apr 21, 201612 votes

Even if you do lose a few cs leashing is important. I have given up cs as Nasus to help my jungler finish first clear because I'd much rather be down 3 cs than be down a whole player.

PDE5 InhibApr 21, 20164 votes

You jg should start bot lane if you have a nasus top.

kile147Apr 21, 201610 votes

It was a Karma jungle (thus the difficult early clear) so starting blue side was necessary.

Toa InnodenceApr 21, 20161 votes

props to you for making karma jungle work. how did you build her (just curious)?

NisakiApr 21, 20161 votes

When clearing save R for your W heal and you should be able to do a full clear with a good leash. Attack speed-cdr runes/masteries help a lot, since you can't trigger your passive on jungle camps I don't think. Honestly wasn't paying attention to the camps instead of the lanes, but I'm pretty sure it was faster. Kiting camps is easy because her Q already slows, which is why Rylais is pretty much optional and not really worth it, I'm just an asshole. Just try not to get invaded, save ward for 2nd camp and smite red if you have it. Lets be honest, your lanes won't come to help so just be ready for it.

Basically the idea is to snowball lanes and build as annoying as possible. Doesn't really fall off either because her team-wide shield is pretty great, even if that's all you have besides your root.

Because of the item changes I don't recommend it, but I used to take item 3027 , item 3116 and item 3512 as soon as possible, they seemed to give me a ton of hp, BM and damage. The W also slows with Rylais so people can't escape it, even Lee has trouble escaping if you get swiftness lol.

Either way I don't play ranked so it probably won't be any good unless you just want to annoy people with low mmr lol

crippler38Apr 22, 20162 votes

{quoted} Because of the item changes I don't recommend it, but I used to take , and as soon as possible, they seemed to give me a ton of hp, BM and damage. The W also slows with Rylais so people can't escape it, even Lee has trouble escaping if you get swiftness lol.

I see, this build gives you BM, noted.

Baby GhoulApr 21, 201635 votes

I feel like that's stupid of him to refuse to leash, since you want to give your team every advantage, but you shouldn't rely on a leash every game. There's going to be times when you get an AFK or invaded.

The real story is how controlling ADCs are becoming. It's on a whole other level. Yesterday I played with an ADC who would not stop pinging me and trying to control every step I took.

"Always B with me."

I'm not going to go back to base when I'm not ready to. Bot lane requires a certain amount of trust from both partners. I'm so tired of ADCs acting like I'm solely there to be their ward bitch.

Supports are their own role. They aren't there to take orders, just like everyone else. I can't tell you how annoying it is to step somewhere when I, the one responsible for map control, knows where everyone is and I get a huge red obnoxious ping right beside me.

I'm starting to feel like ping spamming should be reportable.

RaeyxxApr 21, 201614 votes

I especially agree with you on the ping spamming. You can't even mute it, so when you mute an abusive ADC, they just ping spam you instead. It's horrible.

Hello I am BirdApr 21, 20166 votes

I get turned on by my ADC telling me what to do :^)

YCitizenSnipsYApr 21, 20161 votes

I highly doubt either of these anecdotal stories actually are actually reflective of ADC's at all. Just seems like the typical boards ADC's are evil made up stories.

Baby GhoulApr 21, 20164 votes

{quoted}

I highly doubt either of these anecdotal stories actually are actually reflective of ADC's at all. Just seems like the typical boards ADC's are evil made up stories.

Typical? So you're saying that many other people are sharing their similar stories on the boards?

Wow, I wonder what that could mean. :^) Think it through for a bit.

YCitizenSnipsYApr 21, 20161 votes

That you can make something up with no proof and still be considered right as long as you are crying about the right thing.

I could hop on an alternate account and start crying about ADC's, making up stories about how toxic one was, and a circle jerker like you would up vote me. Think that one through.

Stories on these boards never reflect what is true in game. My chat logs from three years would probably be proof enough that I have never run into a single toxic Vayne, Yi, or Riven, despite their reputation on these boards.

Baby GhoulApr 21, 20162 votes

{quoted}

That you can make something up with no proof and still be considered right as long as you are crying about the right thing.

I could hop on an alternate account and start crying about ADC's, making up stories about how toxic one was, and a circle jerker like you would up vote me. Think that one through.

Stories on these boards never reflect what is true in game. My chat logs from three years would probably be proof enough that I have never run into a single toxic Vayne, Yi, or Riven, despite their reputation on these boards.

I'm so happy for you.

That is great news, for you. When people are bringing up the same problem over and over again, a pattern starts to form.

Let's look at your ridiculous standards for a second, you're claiming everyone is lying and that you're the only one telling the truth. Okay. Prove it. Bring in the chat logs. Let's see each one of your chat logs to make sure that what you say is true.

It's not realistic. You can highly doubt the Earth is round for all I care.

I don't record my games, but even if I did naming and shaming someone is against the rules on the board. The controlling aspect of ADCs are becoming common enough for me in each of my games. I'm a support main, and that's all I know from my experience. You injecting yourself and calling me a liar is just plain silly.

When people are saying they experience the same problem then something is wrong. You can be upset about that and tell everyone they're making everything up, but don't expect to be taken seriously either.

An interesting side note though. You can actually find a ton of videos online of toxic Riven and Vayne players. They aren't that difficult to find. In the end that "evidence" brings nothing new to the table.

YCitizenSnipsYApr 22, 20161 votes

Nope I'm not saying everyone is lying, just most of them. Since crying about ADC's is such an easy up vote farm on these boards. And we all know what is up voted is true. As I stated ME, the guy you don' agree with, could hop on an alternate account with a made up story about how toxic adc's are and you would believe me just becasue thats the popular opinion on the boards.

This shit happens all the time, people dream up stereotypes for certain roles and try to pretend they are true 100% of the time. Also Lol at "Toxic adc's being brought up again and again." Over 95% of the player base doesn't even use these boards. NA's size alone makes these boards irrelevant and its the smallest major region.

Look at your own stupid statement. From this one game that we can or cant verify that is true we can conclude that all ADC players controlling. Then you go on to bring up the same anecdotal eveidence from your experiences that you say aren't credibly for me, without proving it with chat logs either. Should I be the one worried about being taken serious?

Baby GhoulApr 22, 20163 votes

{quoted}

Nope I'm not saying everyone is lying, just most of them. Since crying about ADC's is such an easy up vote farm on these boards. And we all know what is up voted is true. As I stated ME, the guy you don' agree with, could hop on an alternate account with a made up story about how toxic adc's are and you would believe me just becasue thats the popular opinion on the boards.

This shit happens all the time, people dream up stereotypes for certain roles and try to pretend they are true 100% of the time. Also Lol at "Toxic adc's being brought up again and again." Over 95% of the player base doesn't even use these boards. NA's size alone makes these boards irrelevant and its the smallest major region.

Look at your own stupid statement. From this one game that we can or cant verify that is true we can conclude that all ADC players controlling. Then you go on to bring up the same anecdotal eveidence from your experiences that you say aren't credibly for me, without proving it with chat logs either. Should I be the one worried about being taken serious?

Holy crap I've never seen a bigger fallacy in my life.

You did say people were lying. On top of that you're insinuating, without any proof, that we're all hopping on separate accounts to upvote each other on a board that you again say makes no impact.

Then you're claiming that people do it all the time, a statement that makes everything you're saying hypocritical because you provide no proof. What a trip.

You're saying that just because a bunch of people share their experiences on the boards, and they all share a similar pattern, that does not make them true because it is anecdotal. A word you keep using because I assume you have a word of the day calendar on your refrigerator. Yet you're doing the exact same thing right now.

Bravo sir, bravo.

I guess you're always right when you don't hold yourself up to the same ridiculous and unnecessary standards.

Where are your chat logs? Where is your evidence for any of the crazy claims you just made? Let's see it. I'm waiting.

You look irrational, but please keep going. This conspiracy theory is getting interesting.

YCitizenSnipsYApr 22, 20161 votes

Nope I said people make things up because its easy to farm up votes. And up votes equals true as far as these boards are concerned. Toxic adc is just a stereotype that has basically become a meme at these points on these boards. And when you consider how insignificant these boards are, even if its complained about a lot on these boards doesn't make it true for the majority of the player base.

Never said anything about people using alternate accounts to upvote one another, that is something you made up. I said that some one like me, that doesn't feel the same way about this topic, could get on another account and make up a story and it would get upvoted. People would be unknowingly upvoting the same guy that truly doesn't believe what he says. Thats the credibility of these boards.

Once again my evidence is the same as your evidence that adc's are controlling.

Baby GhoulApr 22, 20163 votes

{quoted} Once again my evidence is the same as your

And here's the statement you need to understand. Don't throw stones when you're sitting in a glass house.

If that's the arena you're putting us all in, then hold yourself to the same standards.

You've provided no proof about any your claims, and you truly don't need to.

I trust my BS meter like most people who post here.

YCitizenSnipsYApr 22, 20161 votes

No shit Sherlock, thats my whole point.

You claiming adc's are controlling isn't true becasue you say so and a handful of boards users agree with. If you don't like what I'm doing then don't do it yourself.

People always claim adc's are toxic but never have any proof. The just say it and since its the popular opinion on the boards people believe it.

Another thing that is apparently true becasue it gets repeated on the boards a lot is that Riot really does balance the game around flashy champion that make LCSBIGPLAY$, even though most of the champions that this is said about aren't actually LCS main stays.

Baby GhoulApr 22, 20162 votes

{quoted}

No shit Sherlock, thats my whole point.

You claiming adc's are controlling isn't true becasue you say so and a handful of boards users agree with. If you don't like what I'm doing then don't do it yourself.

People always claim adc's are toxic but never have any proof. The just say it and since its the popular opinion on the boards people believe it.

Another thing that is apparently true becasue it gets repeated on the boards a lot is that Riot really does balance the game around flashy champion that make LCSBIGPLAY$, even though most of the champions that this is said about aren't actually LCS main stays.

No that's not your point. Your point is some sort of elaborate upvote farming is taking place. I have no problem with what you're doing.

I have a problem with your attitude sis. You can say whatever you like, but don't hold people to different standards. It's annoying.

Do you want to know why I believe OP's story happened? Because I've experienced something similar, so it's not outside the realm of possibility.

Now his experience could be falsified in some way, but I went through something similar on more than one occasion so I see it as a legitimate issue. Naturally other people do too. I don't believe he's lying, and I don't believe the people that have expressed similar stories aren't either.

This board is here to discuss gameplay, and OP and similar people were discussing a frustrating aspect of the game.

Then you come in here, more obnoxious than any unnecessary big red ping I've gotten from an ADC, and asked for receipts, then provided none of your own.

That's what I have a problem with. Come back when you have evidence supporting anything you just said before you request it from others.

In the end even if you did it would make no difference because my experiences are my own, you can like them or not, that doesn't change what I and other people went through.

If that frustrates you so be it.

YCitizenSnipsYApr 22, 20161 votes

"elaborte up vote farming" Lol. There is nothing elaborate about it, just make a story about adc's being toxic and people will up vote it becasue they think its true. It's blatant, people even joke on these boards about being able to do so. That's why there is the thread about triggering people on these boards, with a mastery of champions most often complained about. Even though most of these boards users don't actually commonly play against those champions that much, much less a good one.

My point is that you can't go making generalizations about a class just becasue of your own in game experiences. Especially if your defense is that its must be true becasue it gets repeated a lot on the boards. You don't like me calling you a liar and proclaiming the opposite of a class with nothing but anecdotal evidence than don't do the same thing.

You want me to back up my claims but will believe anyone that expresses something similar to your view with no evidence, because you went through the same thing. So you see my point about how I could get on a different account tell you what you want to hear and you would believe me even thought its false and you actually disagree with me.

Your experiences are your own, and it doesn't change what you and others went through. It just doesn't make it true that adc's are controlling, or that it is the standard behavior of those players. Just you hopping on the adc's are evil circle jerk.

Baby GhoulApr 22, 20163 votes

{quoted}

"elaborte up vote farming" Lol. There is nothing elaborate about it, just make a story about adc's being toxic and people will up vote it becasue they think its true. It's blatant, people even joke on these boards about being able to do so. That's why there is the thread about triggering people on these boards, with a mastery of champions most often complained about. Even though most of these boards users don't actually commonly play against those champions that much, much less a good one.

My point is that you can't go making generalizations about a class just becasue of your own in game experiences. Especially if your defense is that its must be true becasue it gets repeated a lot on the boards. You don't like me calling you a liar and proclaiming the opposite of a class with nothing but anecdotal evidence than don't do the same thing.

You want me to back up my claims but will believe anyone that expresses something similar to your view with no evidence, because you went through the same thing. So you see my point about how I could get on a different account tell you what you want to hear and you would believe me even thought its false and you actually disagree with me.

Your experiences are your own, and it doesn't change what you and others went through. It just doesn't make it true that adc's are controlling, or that it is the standard behavior of those players. Just you hopping on the adc's are evil circle jerk.

You completely misunderstand what I'm saying.

I don't care if you have video evidence of a mass number of people logging onto different accounts to upvote things. I seriously do not care. It effects me in no way because I am able to figure what is true and what is not based on my experience. If someone is talking about something specific that I do not go through, then I look at the source of where it's coming from. For example issues that may plague higher ELOs.

This is the problem I have with you, so read closely. I don't care about any evidence you have or don't have. You could have just replied, "I disagree. Thats not the experience I've had."

Instead you tried to hijack everyone's voice and that's not okay with me.

Don't come in here and say what we're saying is wrong or false, claiming we need evidence to back up our posts, then not hold yourself to the same standards, because clearly you don't.

Which is fine, just don't push that onto other people.

tl;dr Stay in your lane.

Baby GhoulApr 22, 20163 votes

{quoted}

"You tried to hijack everyone's voice." You mean just like you are doing with the sweeping generalization that adc's are controlling based on your own experiences.

I do hold myself to the standard of using proof, Its just in this case I'm not going to because you aren't either. I'm just going to keep doing what you are doing and making generalizations about a class with no proof since its ok for you to do.

If you don't like this then don't do it yourself.

No not like I am doing, because I specifically let it be known in my post that it was my experience. People happened to agree. You didn't, that's fine. Don't try to create a story behind it though.

You could have easily just said you don't agree. Instead you tried to conjure up some magical story that ironically was based on no proof.

You're not rubber in this situation, so either hold yourself to the same standards you're enforcing on everyone else, or be quiet. I didn't bring up that silly little requirement, you did. So you better practice what you preach.

blkh1Apr 21, 201620 votes

even being his support, I would have still leashed. Then gone back to bot. You care for your team as support. You are there to Support all 4 others. If he couldn't handle 1v2 for the few seconds it takes for you to leash, then he sucks anyways.

TrídentApr 21, 201616 votes

If I were the support, I would've leashed then left the graves to help the friendly Tryndamere

QuephaApr 21, 201611 votes

It is technically possible to perform a leash-less clear on Evelynn But nah, he was being a jerk.

Only Play DariusApr 21, 20169 votes

Leash-less clears can be a death sentence

Walking around your jungle with that low HP can screw you for the rest of the game should the enemy jungler show up. No reason to take that risk.

Only Play DariusApr 21, 201611 votes

Please tell me you left botlane to rot away.

Gregor GysiApr 21, 20164 votes

Please tell me you did everything you could to win the game instead of acting childish.

JariApr 21, 201613 votes

How is that being childish?

Graves in this scenario literally refused to help the jungler, despite how they wouldn't lose anything for helping. Based on how he acted, specially ping spamming the support that wanted to help, ganks wouldn't work. He'd probably just ignore Evelyn's gank and go, "You can kill them yourself" kind of mentality. It isn't worth wasting the time with someone who isn't going to play with the team.

And to be honest? I would have ganked the shit out of Tryn's lane for helping to fix the problem.

Malix FarwinApr 21, 20164 votes

{quoted}

How is that being childish?

Graves in this scenario literally refused to help the jungler, despite how they wouldn't lose anything for helping. Based on how he acted, specially ping spamming the support that wanted to help, ganks wouldn't work. He'd probably just ignore Evelyn's gank and go, "You can kill them yourself" kind of mentality. It isn't worth wasting the time with someone who isn't going to play with the team.

And to be honest? I would have ganked the shit out of Tryn's lane for helping to fix the problem.

Thing is, rather it is childish or not, Bot lane is actually an important lane to win, if they lose top winning won't somehow counter that and in a meta where ADCs snowball hard i would assume you would make sure your Bot wins, unless you don't really care about winning the game i suppose.

Only Play DariusApr 21, 20169 votes

So ADC can treat others like absolute shit and act however they want and you still have to put up with them because they're too important to neglect. This is the reason why people hate ADC mains so much, we have to draw the line somewhere

NichtHurzApr 22, 20162 votes

Man...it's always the same...I'm being friendly to everyone, cheerful if my team does good stuff and I try to help others if possible, but I seem to always choose roles and champions everybody hates (Shaco, Teemo, Akali, Jhin...). And here I am being an adc "main" right now

Ulquiorra995Apr 21, 20163 votes

That is what will happen regardless if he wants to or not. It is quite simple: jungler gets no leash > jungier takes much more damage than necessary > jungler can't pull of early ganks.

I always say that to teammates when they don't want to leash. Either leash or say goodbye to early ganks. Works every time.

KrinuApr 21, 20168 votes

I main Soraka .

I typically just send my ADC to bot lane (most people at my elo don't try for all-in engages at level 1 so it's fairly safe in addition to giving them an XP lead), pick W first, and then run around hard leashing the jungler through golems and red/blue.

Not only does it pretty much guarantee first blood if the enemy jungler is an overly aggressive Lee Sin or Shaco, it means that our jungler can finish a first clear without backing and ahead of schedule. Grateful junglers with gold and XP leads gank more, and ganks help offset the relatively low kill pressure Soraka offers a lane.

I absolutely love it when the enemy bot lane says something on the order of "WTF JG DO YOU WANT A TENT?"

SwaidApr 21, 20166 votes

This looks like an interesting topic, wonder what its about... -Reads original post- No, that can't be right, someone refused to leash for the jungler? Only human trash would even toy with the idea... -Adjusts glasses, reads again- No...No, whyo wouldn't have the common decency to leash? This...THIS IS UNACCEPTABLE!

Okay, first off, if I were the support I would have helped you leash regardless of what the ADC said; he would have lost my respect as soon as he refused to leash for you. Second, if the jungler is ever in need of a leash and is denied such by a nearby lane, I don't care which lane on the map I'am (top or mid), I will come and leash for the jungler even if I miss out on gold and experience from the first wave. The name of the game is teamwork and 'people' that don't leash are disgusting 'human' trash that probably only care about their KDA rather then actaully achieving victory.

TheOvermindApr 21, 20166 votes

IF you refuse to leash ~~don't expect your jungler to gank~~ don't expect your jungler to get experience gold or items fast enough to contribute by any meaningful wayto the team , that includes: pressuring the enemy jungler pressuring lanes pressuring objectives

and then they say "this jg gg"

LasslowApr 22, 20164 votes

To be fair, is it really their fault or Riots for you needing a leash.

ZeeWolfZApr 22, 20164 votes

If you want ganks, Leash. Help your jungler save HP dumbass

YuGiHoApr 22, 20163 votes

well most people dont know that eve has a horrible clear and often runs the risk of dying in her own jungle.

PikmintsApr 22, 20163 votes

Later

Graves : WTF EVE NO GANK?! Evelynn : You can do it on your own

XelnexApr 21, 20162 votes

whats PSA?

Hello I am BirdApr 21, 20164 votes

Public Service Announcement.

XelnexApr 21, 20162 votes

ty, and whats that?

Hello I am BirdApr 21, 20165 votes

Just explaining something that the public should know, if I remember correctly

High5Apr 21, 20162 votes

-1 for whining. Eve has been a weak pick in the current meta for this reason. Don't blame others. Work on improving yourself.

macromiteApr 21, 20167 votes

-1 for whining, some junglers need leashes to work, and it's your job as a laner to help them, unless you would rather they exp drain in your lane until they hit 6.

BootiesRule1234Apr 21, 20161 votes

That's what you get for playing Evelynn . Maybe if you were playing a SKILL BASED champion your bot lane would feel more inclined to leash for you. If Charles Manson was asking you to make him some tea would you do it?

Only Play DariusApr 21, 201622 votes

Eve is hands-down one of the hardest champions to play correctly.....