Sion's new kit is like most modern League kits; overloaded

mi ramfan··4 votes·1,385 views

Yasuo had double crit chance passive, shield reset on ult, and EQ combo. None of those things are really essential to his power or his playstyle; they're there because REASONS.

Azir has random towers out of nowhere. Again, because REASONS. It doesn't fit in with the rest of his kit, it's just kind of...there.

I like that you're trying to make new kits interesting, but you can do that without making every ability's description read like somebody's PhD thesis. Is there any reason that Sion's new E deals damage, shreds armor, and slows all in one? I'm sure that you could cut out the armor shred and nobody would use the ability any differently. Similarly, is there any reason that ability NEEDS to launch minions? Now that you're doing that with him, somebody else who would fit better as a minion launcher won't get that ability because you gave it to Sion already.

And then there's his passive. Sion gets to run around invincible after YOU ALREADY KILLED HIM for as long as it takes you to burst him down a second time. He's gonna be a godlike towerdiver because he can still get the kill even if you killed him long ago. Imagine his split pushing, too; he runs up to a tower and starts hitting it until he gets executed. Then he revives in place and keeps hitting the tower. He's already dead, so you get no gold for killing him, but if you don't kill him he picks up a tower.

Please consider taking some of the crazy mechanics back and saving them for future champions. Passive, Q, and R already make for an interesting kit with a lot of things to juggle as is. You don't need more crazy complexity on E to make him appreciated by us.

This is not to say that I don't like the Sion rework. It's been needed for a long time and I think the kit is pretty cool. Just...be careful with the overloading. It's gonna bite you in the ass eventually.

15 Comments

SnugglyBunnies2 votes

From all appearances, at least his kit seems to work together better now. It looks great actually, just what a top lane tanky bruiser should be, chok-ful-o lock down and beefyness (also noodles). I am excited to try him out! Also, now there is an answer to that jerk Aatrox. :p

SilentEternal11 votes

It steals a lot of other champions' thunder, too. His passive eclipses Tryndamere and Yorick's ults, in that he too can keep fighting once he's dead, and he doesn't even have to press a button or worry about wasting it. It also eclipses Olaf's passive, in that he gets increased attack speed and dps for playing fast and loose with his life. His ultimate competes with malphite for long range unstoppable knock up engagement, and he brings more aoe CC on top of that.

redniwediS2 votes

His passive is rather easy to kite though. All he gets is a move speed boost, and with the amount of CC he will likely be facing it actually seems rather useless to me.

Lord Graves III2 votes

Walls don't stop malphite. Azir ult and Anivia can't stop malphite.

Also, the thematic for Olaf Passive is very different, olaf fights to stay alive and finds himself most alive on the edge of death. Sion just loses his shit in his death throes. When you kill him he is dead. You got the money. Just get away from him now. Its like a fancy Kog Maw passive.

Death passives like Kog and Zyra are allowed to be strong because if they play perfectly the passive will never come up.

Also trynd ult is stronger because it can save tryndameres life.

Yorick ult also creates a second carry. Though Yorick needs a rework anyway.

It looks like you are searching for things to complain about.

ProfTayogasm2 votes

Glad someone is on the same page here mister Lord Graves.

ProfTayogasm2 votes

Youre missing the point of his passive compared to the other two.

Yoricks is about using it on an allied carry. Making it so you have 2 carries instead of one and the enemy has to decide whether to kill the clone, or kill the real one to secure the kill, only to have the clone last longer and probably pick up the kill on them again anyway.

Tryndemere's ult is about making so he can live during a duel with anyone no matter what or prevent an anticipated burst from an enemy and then getting away.

NewSion's passive is about being able to go ham on someone and if they ignore you that you'll deal a ton of dmg. You still die, you are easily kited if they react to you. The only thing thats strong about it right now is that it doesnt have a CD, if i remember right. Thats all they need to add to make it a balanced skill.

As for his ult competing with Malphites. There are a lot of people who do that in league. We also have Vi, Shyvana, Zac, Alistar, and Hec. This is just people that are Initiators there is nothing wrong with them having similar abilities that allow them to burst into a fight and start knocking everyone around.

Electro5221 votes

In my opinion, Riot needs to make these complex champions with built add ons that really seem unnecessary. If you look at the champs that are being used in the LCS, they are all consistently complex to some degree, with the most complex being the most sought after champs in the game (Lee, Yas, Syndra).

These "unnecessary" add ons adds a level of depth to their gameplay. The old Sion couldn't make any fancy plays. He would just charge in, stun a single person, and start hammering away at them with his axe. This new Sion, however, can now charge in at a horrific speed, knock you up twice in short succession, launch a minion at you to stick to you, and if you happen to kill him, you still have to deal with him, only now, he can stick to you even better, and deal even more damage in the process!

I don't know about you, but if I was a new player, the new kit would look FAR more appealing then the old one if I were given the chance to choose between one or the other.

Sunfield1 votes

You're overeacting. If anything "overloaded" kits make for healthy champion because there are lots of their aspects you can alter.

Besides, Sion might turn out to be weak as hell even if he had 3 kits merged into him. Wait for the actual gameplay

mi ramfan2 votes

If you have to tack on a bunch of random stuff to a kit to make it strong, is it really a strong kit?

Sion's new kit doesn't need the minion throw to function. It's just kind of there. If it was the full extent of the ability and there was no "effect that happens regardless of whether or not you throw a minion", that would be a good example of "mechanical complexity". Here, he kind of roars at you and it doesn't really make a difference whether you're around minions or not because it's damage+a slow either way.

Sunfield1 votes

So why not leave it? It has the juggernaut feel to it

mi ramfan2 votes

Because it doesn't add anything to the kit. It's just there, and it honestly doesn't make much sense. I yell really loud and objects go flying away from me?

Sunfield2 votes

Yeah got a problem with Skyrim?

Lord Graves III2 votes

Yeah actually thats exactly what happens. He shouts so loud that smaller weaker foes are sent flying. Mechanically it is there to give him a longer range slow to improve his odds of reaching farther out foes and trading in lane. while at the same time not necessarily making him a stronger ganker as a jungler.

You cant be in complete safety from sion just because you are outside Q range. Thats why it is there.

ProfTayogasm1 votes

I see what you mean. But in this case there is really only two scenarios that it would really be useful.

  1. To prepare for a gank on your lane.
  2. After lane phase to initiate a gank.

The thing is it would be amazing if he could actually jungle because he could sprint into lane with his ult and then secure the slow with the minion launch so whoever is in lane could help kill the target. Thing is, i havent tested myself, it doesnt look like he could jungle very well atleast not in the beginning. I think if they adjusted his kit a little it would make him able to jungle aswell and thus opening a whole new niche for him that i think he would fit into amazingly.

ProfTayogasm1 votes

I totally agree with his argument about his E, he does need a slow but the ability feels sort of tacked on. Its awkward. Like he said it does to much, I honestly would prefer a different ability to help sion be a jungler rather than a random minion launching slow/armorshred skillshot.

As for his Passive its not nearly as strong as you think. You die incredibly quick the only way you'd live longer than a few seconds is if you pump up your life steal to crazy levels and constantly have something to hit. The passive is the same as yoricks ult. You just run away from it and wait for him to die. You dont even need to fight him because he takes constant dmg until he dies the second time.

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