League is starting to compare to WoW PvP

BestKarthusEU··4 votes·1,351 views

I quit WoW a long time ago because I wanted to PvP but the way they managed it, it was horrible.

For those of you unfamiliar, when I was playing (early MoP), there were two major problems

  1. Too much healing
  2. Too much CC

League doesn't have the first problem for sure. Healing is extremely scarce in this game.

What League does have is the second problem. The amount of CC is ridiculous.

I remember playing arena one day in my WoW days, and, although I was a decent player, I still got wrecked on occasions. This one occasion I most certainly got shrekt.

There is a certain specialization for the class "mage" in WoW, called, "Frost." It revolves around limiting opponent's mobility and dealing high amounts of burst damage.

And, well, basically, the arena ended in 5 seconds. The mage blinked into me, rooted me, stunned me, and then proceeded to crit me 5 times in a row, each dealing about a quarter of my health.

Sound familiar? Sound a lot like League of Legends? That's because it is. The title of the game is "hit cc, win game"

You may argue that point and click CC has been on the fall. No champion released recently has point and click CC. That's true. It's also true that most CC can be dodged.

But herein lies the issue. You may say, after you die, "wow! I got stunlocked! They used all of their CC on me!"

The reality is, really, you just got hit by that first CC, whether it was a root, or a stun. That first CC allowed the rest of their team to use CC on you, and you had no chance to dodge.

WoW was bad, but had this extent to a lesser degree. WoW's massive amounts of healing counteracted the massive amounts of CC, and WoW also has "diminishing returns" where multiple stacks of CC are less and less effective.

So yes, you can get thrown by Voli, into a Lux snare, into a morgana snare, into a Riven Knockup.

But really, the first part was the only one that mattered. As soon as you got thrown you were dead, because you had zero chance to dodge it.

This creates extremely not interactive gameplay.

TL;DR - LEAGUE HAS FAR TOO MUCH CC, AND CC ON AN ENEMY WHO ISN'T A TANK ALMOST ALWAYS MEANS CERTAIN DEATH. GETTING STUNLOCKED CREATES VERY NON INTERACTIVE GAMEPLAY.

13 Comments

WukongMain4 votes

Solutions : item 3140 summoner 1 item 3111 item 3026 item 3157 combination of item 3053 and item 3156 seriously, the sudden shields you get..makes you so hard to burst down, you can even throw in a item 3190 that someone can buy on you team, and they can use it. Hell you can even take summoner 21 and have a Janna on your team or a Zilean ...cause you cant kilean the zilean. You can pick Olaf ?? hes Ulti basically stops all the cc. You can pick Warwick orMalzahar and just surpress the people with cc...by ccing them. you can pick people that give you a second life like Aatrox Zac Anivia ...you can make yourself immortal with Tryndamere Kindred Soraka . you can make yourself super tanky with Volibear DrMundo ..you can go untargetable with Vladimir Fizz Elise.

[slayer-jinx-catface] There are ways to play around CC and Damage, you just have to prepare yourself.

Roxxe2 votes

I'm answering to an year old thread but I googled a similar topic. I think my answer is relevant, however. No, you can't compare WoW PvP to LoL PvP. WoW is a MMORPG and LoL is a MOBA. WoW has both a huge PvE and PvP content while LoL is exclusively PvP oriented.

My analysis is rather simple:

  • WoW PvP is too complicated. It can be funny and interesting, but otherwise the ability bloating makes the game confusing to play. Too many abilities. When it comes down to decision making in a split second, the game often leaves you unable to do so when you have dozens of abilities to use or need to click across the screen to select an ability. Therefore, it's necessary to use addons and have a good system of keybindings and macros along with knowledge of abilities to have some degree of sucess in battlegrounds and rated arenas. The keyboard does most of the job in WoW. Otherwise, you will feel obsolete. Also, PvP gear which is essential.
  • LoL PvP outshines, at least in my opinion, WoW PvP in several aspects, mostly because of it's simplicity. 6 Abilities, 4 Champion Abilities and 2 Summoner Spells. Mouse does most of the job. Shop Clarity: It's easy to understand what items do, which are best for the champion you play and which aren't, what to buy, what not to buy, what are the alternatives. Easy to understand, easy to play, easy to perform well. Not implying, LoL is easy. It takes alot to be sucessful in LoL. Only a small fraction of players are in Challenger.
  • There isn't too much CC. I think CC is essential. Healing isn't necessary. I don't think it fits LoL. Healers are good for PvE and bosses and whatnot. Keep in mind, it's hard to balance a PvP game. Even WoW has a broken PvP system. You just have to hope that Riot has the common sense to keep things as balanced as possible.

My regards!

Dominick Destine1 votes

{quoted}

LEAGUE HAS FAR TOO MUCH CC

No it doesn't.

Furthermore, the biggest problem champs right now have either always had a disable or don't have a disable Jax Zed Fiora Ezreal

disregardable1 votes

Once you're more experienced, you'll be able to play around CC better, and you'll feel differently.

ValyrianBlade1 votes

I think the problem is the cooldown length of item 3140 item 3139 item 3222.

I agree entirely that they shouldn't be open for use multiple times in the same fight, but they should be available each fight. If these are my only options to counter stuff like Malz/WW/Lissandra ults, then a team shouldn't be completely unable to challenge any objectives while they're on cooldown.

I'm fine with the QSS cooldown because it's a low tier item. Make Mercurial and Mikhael's have even a 60/90 second cooldown respectively though (Mikhael's at 180sec seems especially atrocious).

The other problem with stun-lock in league is that while you can dodge most CC, you only need to be hit by 1 to be dead. The whole "I can dodge a blitz/thresh hook the first 9 times in lane and only get maybe 20-30% hp harass out of it, but when they hit the 10th one I die 100-0" problem.

I don't think the amount of CC is too bad really in most normal team comps. It only shows through in those huge CC heavy team comps. Ever try to fight against a team with a tank top/jg/supp AND a malphite/cho'gath mid? It's hard enough to beat the 3 tank teams, but once these guys became viable AP mid laners the team comps that can be made are pretty insanely hard to play against.

I had a ranked game this season against a Garen top, Volibear Jungle, Malphite Mid, Braum Support, and Vayne ADC. I was playing ADC.

Want to take a quick guess at how that game went? I won lane (obviously, against a Vayne), but we lost the game pretty badly. Damage graph at the end of the game? Vayne did the least damage on their team (except for Braum, who she only had slightly more damage than). Garen/Malphite/Volibear each had more than twice as much damage dealt to champions as Vayne. Please tell me how that kind of a game is winnable? If they get ahead they have so much CC and initiation to force anything (what ultimately happened was they grouped 5 as soon as Malphite hit level 6). If they're behind they have so much peel that Vayne will get to scale until late game almost guaranteed. Our team recognized their insane teamfight and tried to respond with splitpushing, but they just rotated as 5 coming up from way behind anyone and tower dove everything non-stop.

Jorencice1 votes

{quoted}

I think the problem is the cooldown length of item 3140 item 3139 item 3222.

I agree entirely that they shouldn't be open for use multiple times in the same fight, but they should be available each fight. If these are my only options to counter stuff like Malz/WW/Lissandra ults, then a team shouldn't be completely unable to challenge any objectives while they're on cooldown.

I'm fine with the QSS cooldown because it's a low tier item. Make Mercurial and Mikhael's have even a 60/90 second cooldown respectively though (Mikhael's at 180sec seems especially atrocious).

The other problem with stun-lock in league is that while you can dodge most CC, you only need to be hit by 1 to be dead. The whole "I can dodge a blitz/thresh hook the first 9 times in lane and only get maybe 20-30% hp harass out of it, but when they hit the 10th one I die 100-0" problem.

I don't think the amount of CC is too bad really in most normal team comps. It only shows through in those huge CC heavy team comps. Ever try to fight against a team with a tank top/jg/supp AND a malphite/cho'gath mid? It's hard enough to beat the 3 tank teams, but once these guys became viable AP mid laners the team comps that can be made are pretty insanely hard to play against.

I had a ranked game this season against a Garen top, Volibear Jungle, Malphite Mid, Braum Support, and Vayne ADC. I was playing ADC.

Want to take a quick guess at how that game went? I won lane (obviously, against a Vayne), but we lost the game pretty badly. Damage graph at the end of the game? Vayne did the least damage on their team (except for Braum, who she only had slightly more damage than). Garen/Malphite/Volibear each had more than twice as much damage dealt to champions as Vayne. Please tell me how that kind of a game is winnable? If they get ahead they have so much CC and initiation to force anything (what ultimately happened was they grouped 5 as soon as Malphite hit level 6). If they're behind they have so much peel that Vayne will get to scale until late game almost guaranteed. Our team recognized their insane teamfight and tried to respond with splitpushing, but they just rotated as 5 coming up from way behind anyone and tower dove everything non-stop.

To be fair garen and volibear have always dealt obscene amounts of damage while ahead.

And if they are rotating as 5 simply keep the jungle warded and split push all 3 lanes. Backing as soon as they even look at you.

ValyrianBlade1 votes

Yes, their damage was as usual.

What ended up happening was: If someone went to clear a lane up at all, they'd tower dive. Vision is great when you have it, but once they got a lead they controlled the map entirely.

Teamfights were brutal. I thought Quinn was a brilliant pick in to Garen/Voli/Vayne, but when they last picked Malphite it was doom. As Voli/Garen charged at me and I kited back, eventually I need to vault and Malphite would always ult as I vaulted, resulting in me being right on top of Garen+Voli+Malphite (and often the teammates trying to peel Garen/Voli getting hit as well).

I'm not saying the game was outright unwinnable, but simply that in solo queue you're not going to beat that sort of a team unless there's a large skill difference. There simply isn't the communication (and even if there was, the ability to come up with a good counter-plan in the heat of the moment) in solo queue (especially below diamond) to win that sort of matchup. Besides, Vayne+Garen would probably have won the splitpush war if it resulted to that anyways...

ModWulf Helhammer1 votes

Picking Quinn into Voli isn't really that smart. His flip can cancel Vault, which means if he catches you with it, your one escape is down

ValyrianBlade1 votes

I wasn't aware he could cancel vault. Are you sure about this, do you have a video?

Vault applies a slight knock back that I would think would prevent him from auto'ing me when within range.

Regardless, Quinn also gains a MS boost by attacking marked targets. She gets 1 or 2 free marks from her passive, as well as a mark when she applies her blind to him. That's plenty of time to run away while his Q is active, then E simply recreates the kiting gap after his MS boost is gone (since he still has higher base MS and more MS items).

If it wasn't for the malphite ult hitting me as soon as I vaulted on to anyone, I wouldn't have been caught all game. At least, the way they played it - as it was only when malphite ulted me during a vault that I did ever get caught that game.

ModWulf Helhammer1 votes

If it's timed right, because he can technically auto you before you land, which cancels it. Same thing with Singe flip as well

ModWulf Helhammer1 votes

League has been that way since it started.

Any game with CC has been like since it started.

TimX24968B1 votes

this is when you get paladin and you use divine shield, and say "fuck your roots and damage, i'm tryndamere AND OLAF"

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