Boards›Gameplay

A moment for Skarner

Grimmrock··10 votes·1,394 views

This is not a rage thread. I play Skarner. I am Agreeing with the point that he needs to be tuned back. This is a discussion on how to do that without killing him. Seriously, its like Frankenstein vs the mob right now.

Alright! that out of the way, lets see some paths that might be viable!

A: Do not touch his passive or the gains of his passive when crystallizing enemies, he already loses out on BEING Skarner outside the shrines, and if you went and said that jinx couldn't get a move speed passive after killing an enemy if she wasn't near dragon, I think we would all call BS. Leave it alone.

B: Trim back his E damage: its a utility skill, and in order to save its utility, somethings gotta go, shave off the damage by a significant amount. like starting at 20, R5 at 100.

C: trim back his shield. Keep same base values, change scaling to 10-15%. the shield scaling is a good idea, simply needs to be adjusted.

D: Lower Q damage, or Increase its cost, Or remove the reduced CD on AA. One of these, not all.

These are what I would consider advisable, not overly rushed, not "Gutted GG" nerfs, I would pick any 2 between B and D and see where that left him.

20 Comments

MLDzXnRRR8 votes

People don't know his kit and probably try to fight him near the checkpoints. I doubt that he is really op.

Nightmist Dark2 votes

{quoted}

People don't know his kit and probably try to fight him near the checkpoints. I doubt that he is really op.

better words couldn't be said :) he already is losing games versus smart people that know what to do. he ain't as OP as people claim. just a bit, which Meddler said they will hot-fix soon.

fasega2 votes

This is so true everyone is complaining he is op and I tell them he isn't they call me an idiot when the counterplay to him is actually displayed on the map. I mean His powerpoints are around objective and the buffs making him naturally weak in the side lanes.

Beoridas1 votes

first of all. its difficult not to fight at baron and drag eventually. Second of all, calling everyone idiots up to challenger is pretty darn ridiculous. Besides, no one cares about his attack speed that his spires provide. Thats not even close to what makes him that strong. His stats show him currently as the strongest champ in league at all elos, with the highest powerspike in the game with trinity. With among the lowest dmg taken and somewhat ok dmg. that just means his tankyness (his W) is super out of line.

SpecterVonBaren1 votes

I keep trying to tell people that old Skarner could do a lot of the things the current one is, it's just he didn't need to be in one of six spots on the map to do it.

Grimmrock1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Venus Project,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EQLFEcAO,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2015-08-22T12:56:56.630+0000)

better words couldn't be said :) he already is losing games versus smart people that know what to do. he ain't as OP as people claim. just a bit, which Meddler said they will hot-fix soon.

Im with you in regards to not as OP as people claim, but certainly overtuned for what he is supposed to be. I agree that his winrate will naturally decline as people adjust to his kit, this conversation is had any time something seems strong out the gate ::Kalista:: but once the technique to counterplay is understood, the winrate drops dramatically.

Shénzhì3 votes

Some of your thoughts considered, I have an alternative instead of simple changing numeric values which is just too easy to do. Updating the kit further to be more juggernaut-like.

Fracture [E]: ought to be remind more of the danger of being hit with Crystal Venom. I propose an unpleasant crackly-crystal weeping to audibly notify the player hit with Fracture, and that they're about to be stunned. Crystal Venom damage is kept.

Crystalline Exoskeleton [W]: The movement speed buff needs to be progressive and consequently longer. Juggernauts were intended to be slow-moving and yet [W] was not updated. [W] should incorporate Momentum gradually improving speed (immediately full Momentum with Crystal Spire buff). (It is important that the movement speed within Crystal Spire is kept instant!) Casting and landing Fracture [E] on a champion should allow free movement so that his Momentum is not interrupt by ability-casting.

Dead Man's Plate is an item that should have been kept in the Bilgewater event..

LankPants2 votes

Make him land more skills in order to get his stun off I'd say.

His old Crystal Venom required 3 skill hits and an auto, now it's down to one skill and an auto. This is a huge buff, his stun went from situational to on-demand. He can also stun post ult now, which is something he couldn't do before.

I'd say Crystal Venom should probably require 2 Q's to prime, that way his kitability becomes a major weakness again.

Grimmrock1 votes

{quoted}

Make him land more skills in order to get his stun off I'd say.

His old Crystal Venom required 3 skill hits and an auto, now it's down to one skill and an auto. This is a huge buff, his stun went from situational to on-demand. He can also stun post ult now, which is something he couldn't do before.

I'd say Crystal Venom should probably require 2 Q's to prime, that way his kitability becomes a major weakness again.

I get where you're coming from, but in a game that seems to really accentuate the ability of people to kite or run away, it seems too punishing to remove his ability to actually stun you. Id use riven as an example, but I think we may all agree that her mobility is a bit insane, so instead Ill example someone like say, kennen. against a kennen, even if you landed E perfectly, and landed a Q, he would be gone LONG before you were able to acutally stun him, and that negates his purpose. he should be able to get on you, maybe not stay on you forever, but at least be on you and do something to you. likely, they're going to peel back some damage and durability, so I hope to god they done deathstroke him with utility too.

LankPants1 votes

At the moment Skarner has an Uydr tier stun along side his ult. It's just too much CC to deal with, especially since his E gets a partial CD refresh whenever he CCs anyone (which is definitely something he could stand to lose).

At the moment with some CDR he can E-auto-wait for stun duration-ult then have another E auto almost ready for you. He's laying down single target CC better than Naut and something has to be done about it.

Phoenix Kotori 1 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Grimmrock,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EQLFEcAO,comment-id=,timestamp=2015-08-22T10:18:51.702+0000)

This is not a rage thread. I play Skarner. I am Agreeing with the point that he needs to be tuned back. This is a discussion on how to do that without killing him. Seriously, its like Frankenstein vs the mob right now.

D: Lower Q damage, or Increase its cost, **Or remove the reduced CD on AA. One of these, not all. **

Please anything thing but this it's only thing that separates his q from hecarim's q and only part of his original passive that remains.

Other nerf suggestions are good.

Nebuul1 votes

I don't like the shrines. They are too binary. If Skarner has shrine by dragon, they get dragon. If Skarner has the shrine by baron, they get baron. His entire kit is based around this concept of "OP champ if you are in a shrine!" while at the same time giving the enemy literally no way to counterplay that, as you cannot capture a shrine if an opposing player is standing on it. Every single teamfight late game is just Skarner wrecking everything while someone on his team prevents the other team from recapturing the shrine, which isn't too hard since they also take for-freaking-ever to capture in a teamfight.

Grimmrock1 votes

{quoted}

I don't like the shrines. They are too binary. If Skarner has shrine by dragon, they get dragon. If Skarner has the shrine by baron, they get baron. His entire kit is based around this concept of "OP champ if you are in a shrine!" while at the same time giving the enemy literally no way to counterplay that, as you cannot capture a shrine if an opposing player is standing on it. Every single teamfight late game is just Skarner wrecking everything while someone on his team prevents the other team from recapturing the shrine, which isn't too hard since they also take for-freaking-ever to capture in a teamfight.

While he is potentially more likely to get dragon, him simply having the shrine at dragon doesnt mean he's going to get it, you can be outsmited or simply out manned.

LostFr0st1 votes

Pretty sure he also synchs too well with Titanic spray from hydra. Once you get it you click on a camp and can afk clear it better than ww.

Beoridas1 votes

actually, champion.GG reports win rates from both new and vet alike.

He is the strongest champion in League at the moment. with a 72% win rate with trinity force. 65-68% for vets. 55-62% for somewhat new and new players.

Also, having played versus and as him myself. I can tell you that having a 300-700 shield every 6 seconds (after cd) while it lasts 6 seconds itself is perma shield essentially. That and with this item item 3053 i dont have issues with his dmg, which is decent. But his tankyness cause of W.

And its absurd to blame it all on the spires. thats a grossly exaggerated mockery, Thinking ohh people are just idiots. He is completely out of control in high elo. Like i said: even fighting in his spires: no one worries that much about his late game dmg or attack speed that it provides with it. its his W.

Meddler also didnt say he was just a tiny too strong. He said WAYY too strong. Hotfix nerf. other than that i think he should be ok but time will tell. Juggernaut items are strong overall.

Grimmrock1 votes

{quoted}

actually, champion.GG reports win rates from both new and vet alike.

He is the strongest champion in League at the moment. with a 72% win rate with trinity force. 65-68% for vets. 55-62% for somewhat new and new players.

Also, having played versus and as him myself. I can tell you that having a 300-700 shield every 6 seconds (after cd) while it lasts 6 seconds itself is perma shield essentially. That and with this item item 3053 i dont have issues with his dmg, which is decent. But his tankyness cause of W.

And its absurd to blame it all on the spires. thats a grossly exaggerated mockery, Thinking ohh people are just idiots. He is completely out of control in high elo. Like i said: even fighting in his spires: no one worries that much about his late game dmg or attack speed that it provides with it. its his W.

Meddler also didnt say he was just a tiny too strong. He said WAYY too strong. Hotfix nerf. other than that i think he should be ok but time will tell. Juggernaut items are strong overall.

I agree with you that he has too much of something, but Id rather have the tankiness and lose on the damage, the reason Ive always played skarner is to lockdown and skirmish, he feels powerful with that intention. his ability to kill is too much at the moment, but im hoping the shield, which is the favorite part of his rework for me, is not where they decided to hit him.

Beoridas1 votes

tankyness is ok. perma xtra renewd 700 health is way op man. that means hes both highly resistant to sustained dmg and immune to burst. how am i supposed to kill him? specially for a duelist that auto win all trades and moves pretty darn quick cause of the same perma W.

Being the last in dmg taken means hes barely getting scratched. It means he really doesnt die a lot. When these are all combined, that gives a very unhealthy pack of nightmare.

Like i said, i dont mind tankyness, juggernaut in general. But a skarner with a perma renewd shield means there isnt any weakness for opponents to take him. Specially if hes ahead which is a lot more often than not.

jDVL20eCYs1 votes

i find it funny scarer q cost 14 mana at rank 5 xd you can basically spam its like no day tomorrow and your mana bar will not move a inch. sepciily since it have 3 sec cd since you max e first now

TahmKench Expert1 votes

Remember Cassiopeia? Why would Skarner escape the same fate?

Cenobite Azaziel1 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Grimmrock,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EQLFEcAO,comment-id=,timestamp=2015-08-22T10:18:51.702+0000)

This is not a rage thread. I play Skarner. I am Agreeing with the point that he needs to be tuned back. This is a discussion on how to do that without killing him. Seriously, its like Frankenstein vs the mob right now.

Alright! that out of the way, lets see some paths that might be viable!

A: Do not touch his passive or the gains of his passive when crystallizing enemies, he already loses out on BEING Skarner outside the shrines, and if you went and said that jinx couldn't get a move speed passive after killing an enemy if she wasn't near dragon, I think we would all call BS. Leave it alone.

B: Trim back his E damage: its a utility skill, and in order to save its utility, somethings gotta go, shave off the damage by a significant amount. like starting at 20, R5 at 100.

C: trim back his shield. Keep same base values, change scaling to 10-15%. the shield scaling is a good idea, simply needs to be adjusted.

D: Lower Q damage, or Increase its cost, Or remove the reduced CD on AA. One of these, not all.

These are what I would consider advisable, not overly rushed, not "Gutted GG" nerfs, I would pick any 2 between B and D and see where that left him.

Or do it like Ryze remake. Just gut him and throw in the garbage.

More from Gameplay

3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay764 comments
7,167
votes
3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay156 comments
3,510
votes
UPVOTE FOR URF
Gameplay606 comments
2,440
votes
Yes plz.
Gameplay456 comments
1,721
votes
3 Refunds per season, up vote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay114 comments
1,716
votes
When is ANYONE at riot going to address the awful new player experience?
Gameplay634 comments
1,383
votes

More by Grimmrock

%HP True Damage
Gameplay38 comments
41
votes
The Buff Sion Needs
Gameplay20 comments
22
votes
Proposed Nerf to the Kench @Riotmeddler
Gameplay9 comments
11
votes
Just did smite Skarner top.
Gameplay9 comments
5
votes
what a tower looks like when you dive lv 3
Memes & Games7 comments
5
votes
Special announcement
Gameplay3 comments
4
votes