Why most supports should take thunderlords

forresto··1 votes·409 views

This was originally going to be a comment in reply to someone elses post, but after I wrote up a 2 page essay I decided it would be better to just make it a post of my own.

basically there are 3 kinds of supports. tank support, poke support, and sustain support. of course, some champs fill multiple roles but thats a matter of preference. Regardless all supports have varying degrees of cc, and tools to defend their carry.

1: there isnt really a good enough tank support mastery. the 6% damage reduction mastery is negligible(if your ally takes 1000 damage, you reduce that by 60 damage which is basically nothing/less efficient than the other picks.) and the other 2 final tier tank masteries are inherently selfish picks.

2: sustain supports have a mastery in the the utility tree which boosts heals/shields by 10% and give bonus armor/mr to the target on heal/shield. The problem is that basically every sustain support except soraka and taric doubles as a poke support which leads to

3: thunderlords. unless you're very focused on sustaining your ally/bodyblocking skillshots for them, thunderlords is the optimal mastery. it is balanced so most of the damage is based on per level scaling which basically gives you a chunk of free damage, and you don't need to spend money to scale the damage into usefulness. doing the math:

the tank mastery reduces damage by ~40-80 depending on level before your carry dies. It only benefits the nearest ally, so the really negligible damage mitigation is really not very good for much of anything.

if you heal for 200 with the sustain mastery, you give an extra 20 healing, and give 5-22 armor/mr based on level. overall you might save your ally about 80-100 hp in an extended fight, and that's being generous toward the armor/mr buff. The other problem is that the efficiency of this depends on when you use it. in order to get much out of this mastery, you would have to heal someone right when they first get damaged so the resistances have the maximum time to mitigate damage. the problem is most people reserve heals for when someone gets below 25-50% hp which means it has very little opportunity to function. it's also not beneficial for trades since if you heal someone after the trade you might get a bonus of 10-30 hp(most champions don't get much above 300 healing strength without massive investment into ap at which point you really should take thunderlords to maximize your ap), but the resistance bonus completely goes to waste. Shields benefit more, as they can be used more freely such as at the beginning of fights, and are allowed more strength than heals. Ultimately shields are the only place this mastery shines which basically means janna and karma are pretty much the only supports who can take much advantage of it. fitting since the actual picture on the mastery looks like janna. The fringe support who really benefits from this is shen since his q healing will resistance buff anyone who hits the target.

As far as thunderlords, the damage bonus may not seem like much on paper aka 100 at level 10, but the key here is gold efficiency, and poke. if you can consistently get 3 hits off, you can add a decent chunk of damage without spending any gold. since supports basically have no spare gold to spend on selfish items until well past lane phase the bonus damage from thunderlords is hugely economical for them. The benefits extend beyond that though: killing an enemy faster means they have less damage output. That's situational and hard to measure, but if you kill an adc 1 auto faster(a reasonable possibility given the numbers), you just saved someone ~60 hp in early game. Even if you don't kill them, forcing them to retreat earlier will have the same effect. as carries get more powerful, that number gets ever higher which means the more powerful your enemy is the more valuable this mastery is if your team does get a kill. More than that, if you're a support who builds any ap this mastery makes your purchases more gold efficient, and supports need any kind of gold efficiency they can get. additionally, this is very beneficial for trades especially in the early game. 70% of the time, the enemy adc likely has the crit mastery, and get's very little advantage from it until mid-late game. since your mastery will proc, while theirs wont, you have a decent advantage when trading. 50-100 damage one way or another can make all the difference there. Finally, many supports are based around high cc combos which give them the opportunity to take good advantage of this mastery.

11 Comments

ProfDrDeath2 votes

Shield/heal-possessing supports:

Sona Soraka Janna Taric Nami Karma Lulu Alistar Bard

http://champion.gg

Windspeaker's is better on:

Janna Sona Soraka

Thunderlord's is better on:

Nami Karma Lulu Bard

Bond of Stone is better on:

Alistar Taric

forresto1 votes

idk I think it could go either way on sona. thanks to the mechanics of thunderlords a passive-empowered auto counts as 2 meaning you can just q-auto and that will proc it.

Death by Glamour1 votes

Or

The other mastiers beside grasp of the undying and the shared damage are terrible

forresto1 votes

I do like grasp of the undying I'm just kindve skeptical about taking it on a support because it's inherently only about sustaining yourself. other than that though, I agree it is pretty good. The shared damage mastery is just meaningless because you only block 36 damage for every 600 that your ally takes, plus you take that damage yourself. even if the damage just dissapeared it would still be a useless mastery because the numbers are just so small.

Jorencice1 votes

There is nothing wrong with sustaining your self. Especially on tahm Kench or thresh.

The longer you stay alive the more chances you have to CC the enemy.

forresto1 votes

I suppose that's true, I was just trying to think like a support, and usually when I support I try to design everything around helping others XD

Death by Glamour1 votes

I was just pointing out that they are the only other decent ones

6% damage reduction is nothing to turn your nose up at

LF Annie1 votes

i feel grasp is actually strong on naut, but i run full resist runes, and cheeze unsuspecting adc's at lvl 4/6, getting ahead and carrying my usually bad soloQ adc.

forresto1 votes

haha ya, I have a 30 armor/12 mr rune page I use with certain tanky supports. It's amazing how strong that can be.

LF Annie1 votes

i found that 23 flat and 21@18 armor and 27mr@18 works wonders because u don't need much mr in lane, and it opens for a stronger mid/late transition/

LF Annie1 votes

i'm going to downvote, just because realistically, you have to be selfish in soloQ, because if you trust random people you are putting your eggs, in someone else basket.

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