Warriors < The Rest

Vicarious117··3 votes·596 views

Yeah so warrior's just doesn't seem worth the buy anymore, it has relatively the same power as the old one with less AD and some armor pen, but less mid game power due to no armor pen at all, and the same shitty late game.

Yet it costs more.....

I mean, the old warrior's always seemed worth the buy cause it was a good easy access to some early game power since it was so cheap and had some mid game potential as well. But now, it takes more commitment to fully upgrade so you don't get the spike soon enough and the build path is far less rewarding as well since it's basically like buying half a brutalizer. I mean I get the brutalizer change, the two new item's are also great additions since they help out other item's build paths. It's just the end result for warrior's now doesn't feel even relatively worth the gold anymore.

Devourer is still slightly cheaper and has a beastly end game, cinderhulk still has decent early/mid game power with proper itemization and a good late game for tanks, and runeglaive is still all around a great item for most AP junglers (RIP fiddle). That just leaves warrior's, with it's poor flat AD for the same cost as the other more expensive jungle items and a not so great build path.

I'm not saying to just flat out buff warrior's, that could push it over the edge which would be especially bad in this new snowbally meta, I'm just saying adjust it. Either nerf the stats and make it a cheap buy, since it's an entirely early game focused item anyway, or reduce the AD and give it back it's armor pen so it has at least SOME staying power and kind of decent in the mid game.

Idk, I could be wrong about a lot of things here, but it still just feels like a wasted commitment for a lackluster item now.

22 Comments

Reaper Review3 votes

How was Runeglaive buffed?

It costs 425 more gold overall and grants 10 less AP. All it gained was 50 Mana. (It always had 10% CDR on it.)

It's only 525 gold less than Lich Bane is, and is far weaker for all purposes except killing monsters.

Vicarious1171 votes

"Except killing monsters"

There's your answer, it has always been basically a camp auto clear.

Still one of the best jungle items, but only for APs (other then fiddle... poor guy)

EndlessSorcerer2 votes

I'd honestly be happy if Warrior received the true damage DoT that Spirit of the Elder Lizard had in Season 4 when you deal physical damage.

Not really due to balance reasons, but just to that it provides something other than AD and CDR. Each of the other jungling enchantments have something unique about them; it kind of bugs me that this one is just a stat-stick.

Dominick Destine1 votes

Warrior is still good on Jarvan and Lee... at least I see it regularly in Diamond solo queue to good effect. Not sure about others though.

By the way, I thought this thread was about ; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fmI_Ndrxy14

Flyer Beast1 votes

I went over this issue in S5 And seeing how it hasn't changed much I think it might still be relevant. Feel Free. http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/RUcjEzMQ-the-warrior-jungle-enchantment-and-why-it-should-be-changed

dangopee1 votes

I only buy item 1041 and item 1039 then go straight for a real item.

Asayake 5150glow1 votes

The AD has gone from 45 to 60. It gives good AD now. As well as Cdr.

Vicarious1173 votes

It went up 15 AD and lost 10 Armor Pen for 375 Gold more..... so not even close to worth it.

Asayake 5150glow2 votes

{quoted}

It went up 15 AD and lost 10 Armor Pen for 375 Gold more..... so not even close to worth it.

_All _ jungle items went up 375 gold...

Vicarious1171 votes

Yes, and cinderhulk was too cheap for how much it gave you beforehand, devourer got slightly buffed with the magic damage cap being increased even with the slight attack speed nerf, and runeglaive got buffed in that it's build path is better and now has earlier CDR.

Warrior is the only one that got nerfed flat out and had it's gold cost increase.

Asayake 5150glow2 votes

{quoted}

Yes, and cinderhulk was too cheap for how much it gave you beforehand, devourer got slightly buffed with the magic damage cap being increased even with the slight attack speed nerf, and runeglaive got buffed in that it's build path is better and now has CDR.

Warrior is the only one that got nerfed flat out and had it's gold cost increase.

As guy below me said, runeglaive always had Cdr. It's just Sheen that doesn't give AP anymore.

The magic damage on Dev being slightly buffed isn't much of a buff, since most of the damage is attack speed anyway. All magic damage you do will be pretty useless, as you're not building Magic Pen. So that 60 becomes about 30~40.

And the attack speed got nerfed.

Vicarious1171 votes

The AP on sheen was negligible, especially since it doesn't even work on the sheen proc at that point in the build, so it being cheaper means earlier clearing and earlier power for all APs, except for fiddle.

And the magic damage is more important then the attack speed, well not in general but the increase in magic damage was greater then the loss of that small bit of attack speed.

In the end arguing this with me is sidetracking, both those items, cinderhulk included, were far underpriced for how powerful they were for junglers in season 5, warrior's was too but only because it had the armor pen and brutalizer build (an item widely known to be one of the best early game items, the main reason they split it in two). So now with the slight tweaks, whether you consider them buffs or nerfs, to the other jungle items has put them in line with the amount of power they grant, but warrior's was flat out hard-nerfed and had it's build path nerfed at the same time as increasing the cost.

Get back on track, or don't comment.

Spoofghoul1 votes

What do you mean cinderhulk is good . . . .

I think its a noob trap

Vicarious1171 votes

Well it's not, you can't just build it on anything and still 1v1 everyone else while becoming impossible to kill at the same time anymore, true, but if that's what you think cinderhulk is supposed to be then you're already a noob anyway.
It's great on tanks still, gives them exactly what they need, the only problem is that tanks aren't as good in the meta atm with all the ADC buffs and new items specifically meant to tank-bust, so maybe you have the wrong perception based on the meta shift.

Spoofghoul1 votes

item 3068 outclasses it since the latest nerf.

Vicarious1171 votes

And sunfire is more expensive to reflect that.

Spoofghoul1 votes

only 75 gold more that is like 1 jungle camp.

jaymc11301 votes

Actually, the only jungle item at the moment that is basically useless is devourer. With games being so fast on this patch even purchasing the item is basically asking for a loss in diamond and up. Warrior is in a fine spot and with lee sin being the top jungler on the patch along with elise it's just about the most common jg purchase.

Source: I'm diamond.

Vicarious1171 votes

Lee Sin will always be a top jungler, no matter the state of his jungle item. The only times he's fallen off the popularity charts is when another jungle item is flat out broken OP, like cinderhulk on release, so other junglers are simply played more due to being too strong.

And Elise means nothing to warrior's state....

Devourer has always been like that though, in fast paced games and metas it's bad and in slow paced and long lasting metas it's fantastic. That's the way it was designed, so no it's not in a bad spot at all, the meta just doesn't favor it currently.

And idc if you're diamond, basically the only things that matter are if you're above bronze or in master tier, everything else melds, for the most part. The differences at that point are luck and the ability to act on what you know in-game, doesn't necessarily make diamonds more knowledgable then silvers, just better at using what they know...... mostly, there are exceptions the further apart you compare ofc, but using it as a reason for everyone to just take your word for w/e the fuck you're saying is presumptuous at best.

jaymc11301 votes

{quoted}

Lee Sin will always be a top jungler, no matter the state of his jungle item. The only times he's fallen off the popularity charts is when another jungle item is flat out broken OP, like cinderhulk on release, so other junglers are simply played more due to being too strong.

We went almost this whole season where he wasn't the go to factor out of the jungle and it was nice. Best season in league history for jungle.

And Elise means nothing to warrior's state....

Only in the sense that if she gets picked it makes a lee sin pick more likely to match early pressure for early pressure provided he's not banned. But yeah, the elise mention was more a statement of the over all game changes than anything about warrior.

Devourer has always been like that though, in fast paced games and metas it's bad and in slow paced and long lasting metas it's fantastic. That's the way it was designed, so no it's not in a bad spot at all, the meta just doesn't favor it currently.

Devourer, like FF, was only competitively viable for a short time period. That type of item tends to be either overly oppressive because the power spike is too dramatic too quickly, or it's weak beacause it encourages non interactive game play for a lackluster and insignificant reward payoff. Such is the problem with items in that niche.

And idc if you're diamond, basically the only things that matter are if you're above bronze or in master tier,

Formerly master tier. Demoted, I suck. I know.

everything else melds, for the most part. The differences at that point are luck and the ability to act on what you know in-game,

Kind of true to a degree. The system is so bad at ranking players and matching players that the sample size to be placed accurately is quite large indeed which contributes to the grindy feel of the game for players who don't have significantly high skill levels. Silver through plat is largely the same with higher level players showing only slight improvement in attitude, mechanics, and gameplay knowledge.

doesn't necessarily make diamonds more knowledgable then silvers,

Of course we are. The single most important factor in climbing the ladder is game knowledge and game sense. Your personal mechanics are largely unimportant below diamond. Understanding the game matters far, far more in terms of determining success on the ladder.

just better at using what they know...... mostly, there are exceptions the further apart you compare ofc,

It's hard to do this part unless you know more than players who know less...

but using it as a reason for everyone to just take your word for w/e the fuck you're saying is presumptuous at best.

Sure, you can take it like that. If you want. It's not like I made the comment to offend any one. I made it to explain the relevance of my opinion. It comes from the highest level of play, the top 1% of the ladder, it's an opinion formed by the most competitive portion of the playerbase and thus has quite the degree of validity. I was only here to help clear up some misconceptions, warrior is in an ok spot. Neither overly strong nor undertuned. It's pretty balanced.

Vicarious1171 votes

Whoa, sorry TL;DR, gonna assume you're arguing with me and we'll just have to agree to disagree, cause I seriously don't have my glasses on me and don't want to make the effort to read all of that lol

Maybe another time, once I get my glasses back :P

jaymc11301 votes

{quoted}

Whoa, sorry TL;DR, gonna assume you're arguing with me and we'll just have to agree to disagree, cause I seriously don't have my glasses on me and don't want to make the effort to read all of that lol

Maybe another time, once I get my glasses back :P

Oh it's not a real argument really, I just separated your points so I could respond to each in turn and make understanding what I was responding to more simple. Take a read when you've got time mate! Ain't like it's going any where.

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