I don't feel outplayed dying to basic attacks

OP Garen Support··5 votes·455 views

I don't feel outplayed dying to basic attacks. There literally is no counter play against basic attacks. You can not dodge them, you can not flash away from them, they act like homing missiles which is both unfair and unfun to play against.

ADC's have no real counters.

Story time

Once upon a time there used to be a class called Assassins which only job used to be to delete enemy carries. The cry of the ADC mains was heard by Riot 'No counter play nerf burst' . Assassins kit was changed to 'delayed burst'. (they dont do their job anymore). 1 less enemy for the glorious ADC's.

ADC's still got 2 enemies the sneaky mages who hit their skillshot and do damage and the Tanks who dare to stay alive longer then 5 seconds

The crying of the ADC's continued 'mages do damage when they land their skills'. Riot noticed their desperate cry for balance and nerfed most AP items.

Only 1 enemy remained Tanks who did not die unless you bought this very costly item item 3036 . The cry of poor ADC's continued and most HP scaling tanks became useless with no compensation. To ensure that the game was fair for ADC'S Riot took away item 3026 from mages and gave it to the poor ADC's which lacked items that gave both defense and offensive stats. (item 3139 item 3046 item 3812 item 3156 .

Now that ADC's got their slaves to keep them alive and the strongest items in the game to give them both damage and protection, the game is finally balanced. OR IS IT?

Jokes aside ADC can do everything nowdays. They got CC, sustain, steroids, DPS, damage reduction, attack speed, burst with crits, no counterplay, ability to destroy turrets in no time, range.

Late game basic attacks deal 500 -1000 damage even when building full attack speed items. Meaning in 3 seconds can out damage other carries by 2X damage. Mages have to at least land their skillshots which can be dodged: flashed away, side stepped, even canceled by powerful item actives.

ADC shape the META because Riot unjustly overbuffs them or nerf those that can stop their rampage.

Biggest problem is that the AD items are busted. Items give more stats then needed. Example item 3046 it gives 6 powerful buffs why? 45 % attack speed, 30% crit chance 5 % movement speed, 12 % damage reduction, +7 % movement speed towards enemy you can see, go trough minions.

Imagine if there was an AP item which gave the same for mages: magic crit 30% , 45 % casting speed, 5 % movement speed , 12 % damage reduction, +7 % movement speed towards enemy you can see, go trough minions all that in 1 item which is easy to build and is cheap.

Most ADC build the same things because they dont need to choose to sacrifice anything they get everything on "core items".

There is a perfect ADC which at least has a counterplay Jhin with his reload mechanic.

Grab your pitchforks because I'm gonna suggest an even more drastic measure to make ADC's fair.

Make basic attacks skill shots with faster bullet speed.

The last sentence made so many people butthurt :D . Everyone ignored the post and only focused on the last drastic idea instead of discussing the core of the post hilarious.

21 Comments

Mecha MaIphite2 votes

Make basic attacks skill shots with faster bullet speed.

you'd have to completely rework an entire class, spending months enduring a balance clown fiesta because of how much turmoil it would cause, just because "you don't feel outplayed"

here's a short list of things that this would screw up

  • every ranged champ's basic attacks; otherwise, people would start taking mages with good AAs (tf) as adc, and you still "wouldn't feel outplayed"
  • standing behind minions is now viable for stopping autos; this isn't "meaningful counterplay" it's just gutting them
  • speaking of minions, have fun missing cs for no reason because you can only hit the melees while staying safe from the enemy laners
  • you can literally bodyblock 90% of an adc's damage with a tank with thornmail
  • because of all of the above, every single adc and possibly a lot of mages would have to be compensated, leading to the aforementioned balance clown fiesta
  • and this is only what i came up with in 2 minutes

you listed a ton of problems with adcs, most notably them being too hard to kill between their support, their itemization, and their hardest counter having delayed burst

and this is the solution you came up with

OP Garen Support1 votes

-Very easy solution for that new stat penetration. Shots penetrate the target hitting targets behind it for the same or reduced damage. -Mage basic attacks are not guns. Magic can be homing. -My solution is just an opinion, not a fact -and this is only what I came up with in 10 seconds :p

Mecha MaIphite1 votes

-and this is only what I came up with in 10 seconds :p

i can tell

it still wouldn't change the fact that skillshot basic attacks, even with compensation, are fundamentally different from targeted ones; the problems aren't solved, they're only changed, and in some cases, exacerbated

standing behind minions and bodyblocking autos is still an issue, albeit reduced every adc now has built-in waveclear and aoe damage in teamfights mobile champions will still be able to dodge autos with ease, while immobile champions will get hammered down as usual

changing a mechanic that is so fundamental to adcs is bound to result in problems, no matter how many band aid fixes you slap on it

OP Garen Support1 votes

Now that you have managed to ignore 99 % of my post. Can you come up with a better solution for the future of the game?

EcchiOtakuTM1 votes

Completely rework the entire game*

Durzaka2 votes

Make basic attacks skill shots with faster bullet speed.

This isnt Smite. There is absolutely no way that a change like could could EVER work in a MOBA like this.

OP Garen Support2 votes

Not wanting it to try and it never working are not the same thing.

Durzaka1 votes

No, they arent the same thing. Who said they were?

You would have to be both blind and dumb to think that you could make basic attacks skill shots in a game like LoL.

OP Garen Support1 votes

Other then trying to shit talk me can you backup your claim? "Anyone who do no agree with me is dumb" mentality makes you look like the stupid 1.

Durzaka1 votes

Others have already said why it wouldnt work.

You would have to rework the ENTIRE game from the ground up. Literally everything would need to be changed in order to make skill shot auto attacks work. You might as well create a new game in LoLs place if you wanted that.

Executioner

Also the only thing that even remotely comes close to what that guy wanted, is graves. He is the closest you ever get to what he wanted. Graves bot lane? Fuck no, dont kill yourself down there. However this is graves as an example.

Oh, another that bothered me, you would indeed have to rework the entire game. Oh and the items he took like phantom dancer for example, it had all that shit for the longest time. The only thing really added, was the damage reduction thing. However how many adc build item 3156? Fucking barely touch that item.

EcchiOtakuTM1 votes

Yea would have to rework the ENTIRE system to even try to do what master x master already did. Idk why they think it's changeable this late in development plus it would fk up anyone who's trained.

Executioner

So true, god I would hate that system.

EcchiOtakuTM1 votes

Not to mention it would never even be remotely close to how good it works on MxM because that change alone would destroy so much fundamentally built in like sheen/AS/champs who rely on occasional auto-attacks like xerath, to keep it short, it would destroy this game that's built around point-click not wasd.

Executioner

I also hate smite for that every reason.

DNFVixen2 votes

There is a simple solution, buff assassin items, buff mage items AND support items, fix tank items, and most of all turn leathality back into mother fucking armor pen. Leathality was the worst damn idea rito ever bloody had, they know it is, we have told them as such, but they won't listen because "riot is ever wrong" which is total bullshit.

Executioner

Why? If were buffing assassin to bring back the good old one shot days. Nerfing the support items would bring the opposite, they would never be able to protect a soul.

I am fine with mages being buff, but you ever let a oriana full combo you with both people at max build? I died. Maw included? Almost died, however if anything touched me, I would die.

Sir Fuzzi2 votes

ADCs just need something that pulls them away from crit and lifesteal. These just skew everything out of proportion.

Executioner

You mean the masteries. We've had around 15% lifesteal for the longest time. Nothing really changed. However add in all the crit builds, and warlords <--- key to the super lifesteal.

TwinkiePro1 votes

Then there's kog'maw, being one of the best ADCs and building neither of those.

Shuyin1781 votes

ADC's have no real counters.

So no tank stats, barely any disengage utilities on most of them, and anything that can CC them for half a second to ram their foot up their anus cavities aren't counter. Makes sense.

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