And all the popular strategies for winning 2-augment Odyssey are being nerfed. The Ziggs augment strat got nerfed, Blade of the Ruined King strategy got nerfed (by 400 damage, putting a cap on non-Kayn damage). Are we just not allowed to do the mission the way we want, Riot? How about you tell us how to do it?
Furthermore, what is with the lux laser velkoz spam? Who can deal with that? It's not fun.
RiotRiot Mortdog33 votesThere have been no other nerfs besides the Ziggs one.
Håppy9 votesI'm noticing a serious decline in Space Blade of the Ruined King's damage, where once I was hitting for around 400-600 damage an autoattack on the mobs, I'm now hitting around 150-200. I'm not challenging your comment here, at least I'm not intending to, but what about that?
Wimbledofy4 votesis it not possible you are comparing different mob types?
Z3Sleeper14 votesYou're imagining it, it's been capped at 60 damage since release. It's basically a 60 damage on-hit item for this mode.
Ragnoraku4 votesWhat is currently being done to fix the toxicity for Onslaught diff? Of my 5-7 games I've tried to play, 4 or 5 of them have been surrenders/insta defeats cause people afked cause we either couldn't agree on what missions to complete or they just didn't get their way. This shit is frustrating and infuriating, are these players even going to be punished for their toxic attitudes in this game mode?
WeaselRune2 votesBlame Rito for making the missions so toxic...
Really, you can only do these with a premade and it insta tilts people who dont get the mission they want. Im tired of pulling slot machine handles hoping to get people of a mindset to do a mission I need. Its making me rage, and it makes me want others to suffer. The game is MAKING me want to make others suffer, I cant think of anything more toxic than this bullshit mission design.
Iv been trying all week to get 5 yasuo mission for the 1k BE, and there is always some shit who insta locks or if they dont, they claim they didnt see my request till after they selected. Then I have to go through ANOTHER run not getting what I want... I mean, people going AFK or trying to FF is a symptom of "encourage (FORCE) people to play with friends for long term audience health" mentality Riot is on that made them make "Dynamic queue" the only ranked mode for a whole season.
So again, Riot doesnt need to fix the toxicity of the behavior in the mode, they need to fix the toxicity of their mission design that makes people feel like their time is being wasted repeatedly.
Oleandervine1 votesSo why was the Ziggs one nerfed, when doing the Ziggs/Sona is such a bottleneck for the mission line? It's literally harder to do that one at 5 augments than it is to do the one without Sona/Ziggs and 1 Jinx. I've already done that multiple times, but I still haven't completed the Sona/Ziggs ones, because the damage output is so low and the fucking timer on Kayn ends the mode if you don't kill him as quick as you've determined he should be killed.
So do explain to me again why you nerfed the Ziggs strategy when this mission is already impossible enough?
Chembaron Yamada1 votesIf you take the on-hit Ziggs build, damage should actually be enough to beat Kayn.
The big problem is that as always you have to be lucky when it comes to spawns. But some tries with 5 on-hit Ziggs and you should be able to do it.
Oleandervine1 votesWhat is that build? I assume the 2 passive augments, as well as the one that converts attack speed to AP, but what else?
Chembaron Yamada1 votesYou got that right. You take Bounce, Shorter, Distributor, Overkill and either Hex Healing (If you want to increase survivability a bit more for your mates) or Fallout.
Items would look something like this:
and some more AP to fill.
Someone of us also used 
instead of Rabadons to increase his team's damage against Kayn.
You use your ultimate mostly to survive (reduced damage taken) and in the Kayn fight you use it to clear the mobs. You have to kite alot in the different stages, but the healing you get from throwing your passive into several enemies is immense since it counts as a single target spell for the healing.
ValyrianBlade1 votesMix Sona in for cc. Build some ziggs on hit, with augments for his passive (get nashors and Lich bane).
My problem was always that I was the only Sona (running ult augments). The ziggs on my team would die a lot, but that was fine. However as soon as I died, we lost. Finally got a team that built more damage on ziggs and didn't die so much (they could Dodge!) and managed the win.
Btw Sona with ult build is very underrated in this mode. With rhythm and cadence, you're basically able to cycle q-aa-w-aa, and once you get CDR you can ult (in every direction, with subsequent ults firing off your struck targets) probably every 4 or fewer seconds. The resets are unreal.
Oleandervine1 votesI do that for Sona, but I find the biggest issue is that her mana supply isn't large enough to accommodate those kind of resets, even with items like Archangel and ROA.
PaladinNO1 votes*Shh*, keep the icon rare. ;)
KFCeytron6 votesThis sort of thing always reminds me of when Ensidia snagged the world-first 25-man Lich King kill by having the entire raid switch to engy so they could throw Saronite Bombs at the platform to rebuild it. That's beyond neat; it belongs in a damn movie. And then that was patched out, their achievement was revoked, and they were banned.
PaladinNO4 votesYou're joking, right? Banned for exploiting a glitch in the game, where the responsibility lies solely with the creators? Surely there must be more to the story than that.
...Okay, I just had to look that up: https://www.mmo-game.eu/ensidia-s-world-first-lich-king-25-banned/
That shit is crazy.
RIP my only and 5-year old account then. Me and my full premade team DELIBERATELY ABUSED the Ziggs shield CHEAT / EXPLOIT / HACK to clear Odyssey: Extraction on Onslaught with 5x Ziggs before it got patched!
Might not even be that bad. I am waiting for a sign myself to leave.
NepgearDesu1 votesI was permanently banned from a game for finding an exploit that let one duplicate items, and explaining to the developers how to replicate it. Perhaps I should have kept it for myself, since a whole guild had been abusing it for months and only the staff was "unaware".
Game is Dragon Saga, so if you see Popcorn, tell them Homurasan says hi. Or don't, because he might ban you on sight just to be sure.
Daddy Ants5 votesOf course they will nerf the cheese strats.
They want you to get so pissed off that you just buy the skin.
Except I won't because I don't play Ziggs.
Chembaron Yamada2 votes? The 4 augments mission is actually really really easy. Just run 5 AP Jinx with comet, arsenal, plan a and plan z.
Run around the map, spam your ultimate to clear waves. Try it, it is really not that hard.
crippler382 votesDid it with all Yasuos with the ult upgrades and whatever else.
Chembaron Yamada1 votesHonestly, you can do the 4 augments mission with like any comp you can come up with. Part of the problem is people still using too "conversative" builds. I still see Jinx players running around with crit builds and they question me for going AP on her.
Dat Kat4 votesHow about you come sit in my chair and play on my behalf riot???
Pika Fox3 votesIm moreso annoyed that on onslaught without 
you cant dodge anything, and half the time skillshots still auto hit you unless you blow warp. Viktor fields are faster than you as well.
SugeMinPikk1 votesLiterally all you have to do is run in a straight line in a single direction and the skillshots miss lmao
Pika Fox4 votesNo, they still land. Especially since you need to stop to cast/auto eventually.
SugeMinPikk1 voteslol
Håppy7 votesThe problem arises when there are so many skillshots you physically can't dodge them. Between storms, lasers, blue velkoz shots, red velkoz lasers, gromp tongue, blue sentinel pillars, having to stay away from khazixes and skarners and cytes and all this shit? You only have 3 dashes, then 15 seconds for another one. All this, and we aren't allowed to have any items that stand out as particularly strong, because it "removes the challenge". Getting to Kayn now is a fucking miracle, and let me tell you, it's SUPER FUN fighting someone with over 70k HP dealing around 100 damage an autoattack.
SugeMinPikk1 votesI think every 2 augment run I've done so far, all the Yasuos just built pd, ie, death's dance, shojin's, and maybe GA if we got all the gold beads
Xhaiden1 votesThe problem arises when there are so many skillshots you physically can't dodge them. Between storms, lasers, blue velkoz shots, red velkoz lasers, gromp tongue, blue sentinel pillars, having to stay away from khazixes and skarners and cytes and all this shit? You only have 3 dashes, then 15 seconds for another one. All this, and we aren't allowed to have any items that stand out as particularly strong, because it "removes the challenge". Getting to Kayn now is a fucking miracle, and let me tell you, it's SUPER FUN fighting someone with over 70k HP dealing around 100 damage an autoattack.
There's a random map generator - cause the maps are not always the same. And some are easier than others - so just try again till you find one that's more doable.
5050BS3 votesThat they nerfed a strat and let those that got the skin WITH the strat keep it shows Riot is bad at everything.
Chembaron Yamada4 votesTaking the rewards away just because they didn't think of this strategy themselves would be a dick move. It was already bad enough that they removed the strat (even tho it makes sense, it is supposed to be a challenge, not something you can do sitting in a corner for minutes).
Imagine the backlash if they had taken away the rewards from people who did it.
Besides it would need an extreme amount of work to sort out the people who used the strat and these who got the rewards in a legit way.
Nausicäa 2 votesIts obvious they made it super hard cause they dont want to give everyone a bag of free skins. Id assume only a small percentage of people have completed 2 augs. Its actually pretty cool to have such a good reward locked behind a hard challenge. Its only frustrating because its difficult to find like minded people to do it unless you have a group of competent friends.
P.S. Try 5 Jinx with Comet+ Arsenal. Did it in my first attempt after getting people from the recruitment forum and it was generally pretty easy. Its way easier than yasuos
KFCeytron2 votes[{quoted}](name=Nausicäa ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9YyUsGN7,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2018-09-24T09:25:10.635+0000)
P.S. Try 5 Jinx with Comet+ Arsenal.
Ah, the "all five of us are playing on high-end gaming PCs from the last year or two" team comp. It must be nice to get over 2 FPS with more than three of those on screen at once.
Saibbo2 votesU tried the 4 yas 1 malp?
Furthermore, what is with the lux laser velkoz spam? Who can deal with that? It's not fun.
it's suppose to be challenging not a walk in the park...
KFCeytron4 votesU tried the 4 yas 1 malp?
it's suppose to be challenging not a walk in the park...
Difficulty and fun are two distinct concepts. Odyssey uses fake difficulty and often fails to provide a fair challenge. It's hard - some spawns are nearly impossible, particularly with some comps - but not enjoyable.
Saibbo1 votesfake difficulty?? what are you talking about?
Bad technical aspects make it difficult.
where? it's smooth and have a simple scheme to follow and it plays just like any other game mode, i've found no bugs or problems whatsoever.
The outcome is not reasonably determined by the player's actions.
where? a part from the random waves that change every new game to not make it monotonous it's all about how you dodge the skills and use teamwork.
Denial of information critical to progress.
Nocturne ult??? other than that there's nothing that complicated to understand on how to beat it, clear the waves, collect ora, next level, kill boss.
The outcome of the game is influenced by decisions that were uninformed at the time and cannot be undone.
irrelevant here.
The game requires the player to use skills or knowledge that are either incorrect or have nothing to do with the genre.
literally uses the same skills and mechanics that are already in the game except the augments which just make it easier to beat.
It's hard - some spawns are nearly impossible, particularly with some comps - but not enjoyable.
obv it has to be hard, the rewards it's basically a guaranteed skin and icons/emotes/etc.. that's why you have to have a pre-made to think of a strategy to win the mode and not just blindly pick a random comp with random augments and expect to win easily, some people don't like challenges and it's fine but sure it's not un-enjoyable just because it's to hard for someone. The mode was great and challenging and fun to play and beat..(even tho it really isn't that hard anyway even with just 2 augments)
KFCeytron5 votesfake difficulty?? what are you talking about?
where? it's smooth and have a simple scheme to follow and it plays just like any other game mode, i've found no bugs or problems whatsoever.
where? a part from the random waves that change every new game to not make it monotonous it's all about how you dodge the skills and use teamwork.
Nocturne ult??? other than that there's nothing that complicated to understand on how to beat it, clear the waves, collect ora, next level, kill boss.
irrelevant here.
literally uses the same skills and mechanics that are already in the game except the augments which just make it easier to beat.
obv it has to be hard, the rewards it's basically a guaranteed skin and icons/emotes/etc.. that's why you have to have a pre-made to think of a strategy to win the mode and not just blindly pick a random comp with random augments and expect to win easily, some people don't like challenges and it's fine but sure it's not un-enjoyable just because it's to hard for someone. The mode was great and challenging and fun to play and beat..(even tho it really isn't that hard anyway even with just 2 augments)
> smooth > from 60+ FPS normally down to 2 FPS with 4+ Jinx ults on screen, or during Sona Crescendo ult
"Apart from the random waves" - yeah, apart from the thing that makes you wrong, nothing makes you wrong.
Funny you mention the Noc ult fog of war effect - combined with a technical issue, it does indeed deny you information: abilities cast from that fog don't render. I've eaten a lot of lasers, area hazards, etc. that were invisible to me because they were cast from outside my vision. I wonder why I died, the effect ends, and I see my champ lying on the edge of a fire hazard.
I could make the argument that e.g. Brutal Strikes Malphite leapfrogging over targets so he can ult across the map is a little different from the way he usually plays, but eh.
All in all, there are a lot of things that make this fake difficulty. I didn't even mention things like the biggest Ornn pillar, which is not dodgeable with regular movement and can burn all your Warps if there's a group of them spamming it.
And you're still responding to a complaint about enjoyment with an argument of difficulty. They are not the same concept. Odyssey is challenging, but not in a fun way.
Saibbo1 votesWhat are you on about?? is it the game problem if you can't run the game well? sure i agree that the game doesn't run that well either but it was still a decent 60 fps for me and i have a shitty dualcore with a 1030, not a super high-end nasa pc... even an APU could run this game.. That's not a "fake difficulty" if it's your PC that is giving you that issue, and that's the first thing.
"Apart from the random waves" - yeah, apart from the thing that makes you wrong, nothing makes you wrong.
dude it was the same as the star guardian event, there are 3-4 different pattern of spawns to make it somehow not boring to play always the same one, they are still always the same, there are just different scenarios..
it does indeed deny you information: abilities cast from that fog don't render.
that's an issue with the game itself, even in SR when a skill is cast in a bush you don't see it, and yet doesn't always happen at least it wasn't an issue that i run into while playing the gamemode or that sure wouldn't be the main reason you could lose the game
Brutal Strikes Malphite leapfrogging over targets so he can ult across the map is a little different from the way he usually plays, but eh.
wow.. really reaching there, it's not something that you pick if you don't like how it works, you know.. you can always change augments they are there to make it **easier **not to add difficulty to the game mode... and sure they make it easier even if they somehow "tweak" what a skill does... yet fundamentally the skill works in the same way.....
I didn't even mention things like the biggest Ornn pillar,
you know you can dodge those... you also kinda also have 3 dashes on a low cd.. and yes is still dodgable you're just making excuses for not being able to do so..
Odyssey is challenging, but not in a fun way.
may not be fun for you which is fine, but sure i did have a lot of fun completing all the quest, all the complains just sound like excuses for not being able to complete it(which is understandable, i think they expected some people to not be able to complete all the quests), which i can guarantee are 100% doable
NepgearDesu2 votesMy computer can run an ARAM teamfight in highest settings with over 100 FPS. Sometimes in Onslaught it drops to two frames a second, in mid quality, and I'm not sure that's my laptop being who-knows-what. The game demanding gigantic jumps in performance (technically spikes at over 50 times the highest demand in ARAM) isn't normal and my frame rate crashing down when I least need it (third form Kayn, tons of monsters) is some undeserved handicap.
I played a number of other games that were limited, not by your PC, but by the game's rendering engine. You could have the highest performances in the world and the engine would not make use of them, by being gated in its program to using only 1 Gb of RAM at most for example. In LoL's case, I'm unsure how it works, but I'm pretty sure no one in the development team was really concerned with augments permitting e.g. Yas' tornado map-wipe (two Last Breath augments, can hit 30+ monsters with the small cytes spawning thus release 60+ tornadoes). Maybe they didn't think about it, or they thought it wouldn't be a problem, or they didn't have the time / resources / means to downgrade graphical effects when the performance demand spikes, or maybe they didn't care.
In any case, it's just poor coding if you're expected to play this mode with 98% of your PC's resources unused until the storm hits, takes a hold of all your processing power for two seconds, then goes back down to 2%-ish resource usage. It's like a rock concert with speakers' volume so low you had to hold your breath to hear the music, and suddenly everything jumped to maximum power for two seconds, then dropped down to minimum again. Your ears would be bleeding before you even understood what had happened.
Also: volcanoes deal absurd amounts of damage, and when your screen is obscured they won't appear to you until you set foot in one. That can be a good 500 true damage if you instantly step out, but if anything kicks you into it (anchortail, razorheart, hogtongue, dozermaw...) and you're killed mostly because the volcano popped up from nowhere, I dare say you don't lose because you were bad; the fault lies mainly with the fact that you couldn't see something that was extremely important. Imagine Kayn turning invisible when doing his Q dash-and-slash, that wouldn't be any less fun.
This is an example of fake difficulty, because of critical information being denied. Other examples could be the fact that monsters gain more damage and HP (artificial, it doesn't change much to the way you play); some maps are extremely binary (right comp, win; wrong comp, lose) and you have a chance of encountering local wildlife that you won't be able to take down, no matter how well you play; the boss fight has a timer represented by unavoidable damage over time once you exceed the limits of Kayn's patience. It's all pretty unnerving, and while it does contribute to making the fight difficult, the are other levers to pull that could do the same. Lower difficulty settings could feature less wildlife diversity, with e.g. only alphacytes, shimmerstrikers and arcraptors in the Intro difficulty, then more species up until Onslaught. It could be Kayn growing more active, with e.g. a cooldown time on most abilities in Intro level that are decreased / removed in higher ranks. The difficulty of objectives could increase gradually, with intro as "just kill stuff" and Onslaught with the more elaborated "look for Ora blossoms", or even some king-of-the-hill-style thing like Star Guardians' moving safe zone. There are possibilities, and a simple increase in damage and HP is really just tasteless. So now I'll need twenty hits instead of ten to slay that alien thing? Why not a hundred, or a million? It would be more difficult, but not more fun.
That said, I could use a hand in completing the Universal legends mission, as well as the Morning Star veterans one. If you have time and will this week to help me out, then I'll be most pleased. I'm afraid I can't give anything in return, though.
Saibbo1 votesYes I totally agree with you on the first point, it really bad optimized to take full advantage of even mid-range hardware, my GPU runs at 30-50% but i fall below 60 FPS anyway. No doubt about that one but yet at least in my personal experience in this game mode it wasn't nothing worst that a team fight late game in SR.
Even for the second point i agree, sure people have issue with the mode but because they simply don't know how to deal with the mobs skills and same for the velkoz looking mob(i assume) are annoying when they stack, but that's part of the fun imo, when all goes batshit crazy (it's the hardest difficulty after all)
And again I agree with the 3rd point as well, it happen to me to get pushed by kayn or pulled by a skarner in a 'erupting terrain' and lose, yet you'd have at least 1 dash to get out of there and also that's something static that doesn't move once you know it's there you'd remember, kayn being invisible it's way worse since he moves, that's kinda the point of the nocturne ult, not let you see what's around you (expect for the map obv), I'm more upset when in SR kayn use an invisible W on me while in the wall.
KFCeytron1 votesWhat are you on about?? is it the game problem if you can't run the game well? sure i agree that the game doesn't run that well either but it was still a decent 60 fps for me and i have a shitty dualcore with a 1030, not a super high-end nasa pc... even an APU could run this game.. That's not a "fake difficulty" if it's your PC that is giving you that issue, and that's the first thing.
dude it was the same as the star guardian event, there are 3-4 different pattern of spawns to make it somehow not boring to play always the same one, they are still always the same, there are just different scenarios..
that's an issue with the game itself, even in SR when a skill is cast in a bush you don't see it, and yet doesn't always happen at least it wasn't an issue that i run into while playing the gamemode or that sure wouldn't be the main reason you could lose the game
wow.. really reaching there, it's not something that you pick if you don't like how it works, you know.. you can always change augments they are there to make it **easier **not to add difficulty to the game mode... and sure they make it easier even if they somehow "tweak" what a skill does... yet fundamentally the skill works in the same way.....
you know you can dodge those... you also kinda also have 3 dashes on a low cd.. and yes is still dodgable you're just making excuses for not being able to do so..
may not be fun for you which is fine, but sure i did have a lot of fun completing all the quest, all the complains just sound like excuses for not being able to complete it(which is understandable, i think they expected some people to not be able to complete all the quests), which i can guarantee are 100% doable
Sometimes, yes, it is a problem with the game and its design if a player is bad at it. That is the thrust of fake difficulty.
I get 60 FPS normally, but Jinx and Sona ults massively tank my framerate. Funny you mention an APU, because I have one of those as well, and it barely gets 20 FPS at best in a normal match. League is barely playable on it, with a generous definition of "playable." I wouldn't dream of trying Odyssey on it. I understand that Riot didn't intend that, but maybe if the mode had been on the PBE for a while before release the issue would've shown up and possibly been resolved, or at least mitigated.
I didn't play the SG event, but just because random spawns have been used before doesn't make random spawns good.
Abilities cast from fog are supposed to show up when they extend out of fog (with specific exceptions like Nunu ult).
Most sizes of the Ornn pillar are dodgeable with regular movement. The largest ones aren't, unless you correctly guess the landing spot and start moving as soon as you see the mob start the animation (hopefully they're not in fog). They are huge. There can be more than three of those mobs, which means you will run out of Warps.
I'm glad you had fun. I don't know how, because it's fake difficulty which most people do not enjoy, but good for you. No one's saying the missions are impossible. They are possible. They're just terrible because Riot is terrible at design (including the way queues work, with no concession for missions) and testing. :)
Beatrice falls2 votesU tried the 4 yas 1 malp?
it's suppose to be challenging not a walk in the park...
There is "difficult but do'able if you're skilled" and "pure rng and hoping you don't get 800 skarners". I mean, I'm ok for difficulty as long as it's do'able (raid bosses from WoW for instance), but trying stuff like "5 Sona" when Sona barely deals any damage and is mana hungry as hell, this is just a joke
Xhaiden1 votes[{quoted}](name=Beatrice falls,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9YyUsGN7,comment-id=00080001,timestamp=2018-09-24T14:27:22.867+0000)
There is "difficult but do'able if you're skilled" and "pure rng and hoping you don't get 800 skarners". I mean, I'm ok for difficulty as long as it's do'able (raid bosses from WoW for instance), but trying stuff like "5 Sona" when Sona barely deals any damage and is mana hungry as hell, this is just a joke
That's why most did that mission with Ziggs. Since it works with either Ziggs or Sona.
Saibbo1 votesbut trying stuff like "5 Sona" when Sona barely deals any damage and is mana hungry as hell
then use 5 ziggs, is easy as hell... also it's all about the augments you use and mana ain't a problem with sona in this gamemode.. is basically infinite, but yes 5 sona sucks.
Bisaknosp2 voteseasy af with the right comp did 1 sona 1 jinx 3 yas ezpz were lucky with the maps though xd
AggressiveWolf2 votesIm glad I managed to finish everything quickly before everything got shit on
ValyrianBlade1 votesThe ziggs strategy is just unfair to those of us that earned the icon with a normal strategy.
As someone who beat 2 augment on an early day as malphite in a malphite- 2 yasuo - ziggs - Jinx team, it felt like a huge accomplishment at the time. Fast forward to the discovery of the ziggs strategy, and suddenly everyone else had the same icon.
The icon is listed as ultimate tier, and the mission as insane. It should be a rare icon, as in sufficiently rare that when you see someone in game with that icon, you'd probably comment because it's impressive. Due to the ziggs strategy, that will never happen now.
2Charmnot2Charm1 votesThe Ziggs augment strat got nerfed
Yes because it takes so much effort to afk in 1 corner and become immune to damage /s
ZT Xperimentor1 votesI'm surprised they even made any changes to the extra game mode since it didn't sound like they'd bring it back. Yet I'm not surprised either with their control-freak nature showing.
