Now that Riven is getting "detoxified", can Annie maybe get the same treatment?

SIayton·Oct 1, 2015·4 votes·944 views

I'm not crying for Annie nerfs but she's been in such a low counterplay, low risk, high reward state for a while I really would like to see some of that addressed. Having the ability to instantly dump all of your (good) ratios with no wind up animation, skill shots, or anything really has always been kind of ridiculous to me and a fed Annie is basically the most low interaction champion ever outside old Veigar.

Maybe a cool bear toss animation? Maybe a lower ratio on W? Maybe Q as a skillshot? I know she's not tearing up the competitive scene but she's always been a pretty miserable champion to play against if she's even remotely in the game. Fighting and beating Annie has always been a stat check. Can you survive her burst? Yes? Whelp you beat Annie, she has no fall back pattern. No? Well looks like you don't get to play this game.

11 Comments

GoldenMeanOct 1, 20151 votes

Annie mid main here (skill-capped at Bronze 2). I will note that when they nerfed her range it was a really sad day.

Annie's counterplay is high mobility champs that make you miss your W, stuff like yas, akali, ahi, etc. Also poke champs give her a hard time (lux, xerath, etc.). Also horrible suppression champs give her a hard time: swain, malzahar, etc. The enemy needs to know when you can flash and really concentrate on forcing teamfights when you do not have your flash, because at that point you're a lot less dangerous. They should also avoid being caught out because you can burst them if they get picked. Having a JG camp mid does a huge amount to prevent annie mid from going ham late game.

As a support, Annie's even weaker. Basically she doesn't have enough sustained dps due to mana reliance, she doesn't have enough cc due to her long time to get her stuns back (and it's cost!) and she doesn't really have any mobility to speak of. Make one misstep and your flash is gone, then make another within the next 4.5 minutes and you die. It doesn't seem as though the enemy has that same limitation.

I love Annie but I'm not amazing at her (or any other champ) right now. I feel like she's in a good spot right now, though. Some of her counters seem OP in general. I agree that Annie doesn't seem like she has a lot of counterplay though, but she does have it.

SIaytonOct 1, 20151 votes

Any reasonably skilled player isn't going to miss her W. Its an instant cone. Just make sure they're in it and release the button. Its not like there's travel time. There's really no way to reactively dodge any of her abilities, which is the main problem I have with her. If you're in range of any of her abilities, she can instantly hit you with them without any need to lead a shot or read the opponent's movement. For the incredible damage output, its ridiculous how much reliability she has.

Ryze had the same problem before and he got a rework, now he's got windows of weakness and you can play around him. Annie is a dated design from league's early days and I really think they just need to take a look at her kit and make her a little more modern.

GoldenMeanOct 3, 20151 votes

I'm in bronze 2, and people miss their skillshots (including annie cone and cho cone etc) all the time. Oddly enough, I'd say that bronze 2 is "reasonably skilled" also, because even though it's a complete joke, relatively it's pretty high skill in the player pool, probably around average.

That said I don't use reticles, just pure hot keys and intuition.

Saying that they need to make a kit more modern (especially with the mobility creep inherent in new champs) is murky thinking; you're not saying much when you say that.

EpicusmaximoOct 1, 20151 votes

when someone thinks annie is OP it's a sad day for humanity :(

SIaytonOct 1, 20152 votes

I don't think she's op. I think she's poorly designed with low windows for counterplay and also for outplay on her part. She just does her annie things and it either kills you or it doesn't with 100% reliability.

EpicusmaximoOct 1, 20151 votes

{quoted}

I don't think she's op. I think she's poorly designed with low windows for counterplay and also for outplay on her part. She just does her annie things and it either kills you or it doesn't with 100% reliability.

I think she's designed quite well, especially for new players. In order for League to remain competitive with other games it must attract new blood, if every champion has the skill floor of Orianna or Zyra it would be detrimental to the overall health of the game.

Sightless66Oct 1, 20151 votes

You're correct, and that is a problem that needs to be fixed, but your solution wouldn't leave Annie in a healthy spot. Just putting a delay on her bear or making her Q a skillshot won't put Annie in a good spot. The problem is that Annie's entire value is tied up in the reliability of her damage/stun. That's all she has over other champions. If she doesn't have reliability, she doesn't have anything that is worth picking her for.

If we want to make her a less binary champion, then we need a larger redesign. We can't just take away the only major advantage she has. If we want to take the reliability away, we have to give her something else, something unique that makes her worth picking over similar champions.

ShénzhìOct 1, 20151 votes

It's the instance of her nuking and cc. Where some champions can burst abilities and others can nuke I think Annie does both (or used to; never played Annie) and that to me is not tolerable.

Mage Nuker Mage Burster

If they ever finally identify some mages as Nukers and rework their gameplay to fit a common archetype: Nuker template, that'd be great. My idea of a Mage Nuker would be a variation of a Mage Burster (imagine Kassadin).

Nuker-Burster Difference: long range cc and high-powered nuke compared to short range kablam ability spam.

Ya get meh, bruh?