if you keep releasing champions that have overloaded kits the game will never have consistent diversity because whoever is numerically stronger from patch to patch is who will be spammed.
Lissama74 votes
I Main Swain16 votesis not op
Anidan46 votesOP or not, his kit does damn near everything you need in a support, making him very good in almost every line-up. I think the only thing he really can't do is poke outside of auto-attacks.
I've heard a lot of support players say they hate Thresh just because of how prevalent he always is. He has not had a single weak period that I can remember since his release. He's always there, always strong, and never changing due to the nature of his kit itself unless they break his numbers.
Saianna3 votesThresh does have 1 weak point. But only in early game. He doesn't get armor per lvl, so you can hurt him very hard before he accumulates souls.
Yeah.. He's monster support
Loken Stoneheart12 votesThresh does have 1 weak point. But only in early game. He doesn't get armor per lvl, so you can hurt him very hard before he accumulates souls.
Yeah.. He's monster support
Actually, early game if he just picks up a soul or two, he has gotten armor before anyone has even leveled up. It only tanks a handful of souls to beat standard armor-per-level. Granted, it's still a potential weakness-- he has to step out of position.
IcyPepper5 votesHe's weak to poking supports who can capitalize this and defend themselves against hooks. 
is an excellent counter, from personal experience.
manbearswine6 votesHe's weak to poking supports who can capitalize this and defend themselves against hooks.
A simple rule of thumb,if competitive players feel confident picking it first before any other picks are made,there probably aren't any serious counters.
Aside from that people just like to misdudge thresh due to a lot of incompetent players picking him(cause #lcsbigplays),and his laning phase is rather tricky and different than most supports,so ofc instead of realizing they are facing a bad thresh,they instead choose to believe that they are good(for the ego boost of course).
I Main Swain2 voteswhile his kit has just about everything a support needs, he also has very definite weaknesses and takes a lot of skill to play him well. also, his weaknesses aren't just things he doesn't have in his kit. his q is relatively easy to dodge usually, and his ult is harder to use properly than most people think. his e is the only ability I think doesn't really have counterplay. just because he hasn't had a weak period doesn't mean that he is op. sure, it would be nice to see some other champs more often, but that certainly doesn't merit a nerf.
Anidan11 votesI never said he needed a nerf. Only that his kit is extremely versatile to the point of being frustrating - especially over time when you see him over and over and over and over and over and over again.
I Main Swain2 votesya I know, I was just saying that as a general term because so many people cry OP which would imply that they want him nerfed. I agree though (as a thresh player) that I do get pretty tired of seeing 90% the same supports ( 
) and I would love to see some of the less popular picks become popular like taric and zilean.
Shinjusuke17 votesHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAH...
People are complaining about thresh for literally the exact same reasons junglers have been complaining about Lee Sin for 3 years now.
I wouldn't expect changes. Thresh is flashy. Riot doesn't mess with flashy champs that look like they require "high skill", regardless of how much skill they actually require to play.
I Main Swain7 voteslet me ask you this, because you seem like exactly the kind of rager the community hates and im pretty sure you are.
have you ever actually played thresh? against a person who had functioning eyes and a working mouse with which to click away? ask any support main, thresh is a difficult champion to master, more difficult than most. sure he can make "flashy" plays, but that doesn't automatically make him op anymore than ezreal being able to make flashy cross-map executes makes him op. cross map ults are hard as butthole to land, and thresh is pretty frikin hard to play well against someone who knows what to look for when a thresh wants to hook.
please enlighten me on the way that thresh's complaints are exactly the same as lee sin's complaints. because as far as I've seen, thresh doesn't drown out other supports even a little bit, aside from the ones he counters (obviously). to be perfectly honest, thresh is less oppressive than blitz and Leona, and actually takes less skill to play against.
so, to end, I will respond to a douchey post with an equally douchey response. spend less time being butthurt about losing to champions and more time learning how to play. almost literally all you have to do is dodge the q, and the e can be worked around.
Shinjusuke24 votesChrist man, sit down and take a couple midol.
The only "douchey post" here is the arrogant dick who decided to make a fight out of nothing.
So the next time you opt to "respond to a douchey post", you might wanna get your facts straight and take a cold shower before whipping out your E-peen and raging at people.
You're all over this thread picking fights with people who think thresh needs changed. Seems like you're the asshole. Self awareness does wonders.
Have fun responding, just gonna look for your name and ignore it <3
DrCyanide10 votes
- Thresh isn't hard. The hardest part of Thresh is convincing people to click your lantern. The rest is a binary playstyle revolving around a combo, or generic peel (which is an easier peel to do than the majority of supports, if you don't know).
That alone is worth the +1.
Honestly, I think Thresh is easier than Blitzcrank. Personal experience with both, Thresh has been a lot easier to learn and do well with. It also helps that you have a tool for every situation, rather than one combo for every situation.
IcyPepper11 votesThe hardest part of Thresh is convincing people to click your lantern.
I dedicated part of my training to clicking the lantern.
It has saved my life so many times.
But sometimes...
Some part of me doesn't want to click the lantern.
But I know I need to.
Le Honkler6 votesSometimes I click it even when it's not necessary, just to make my supp feel like he's helping.
Laughing Fish5 votesGood guy adc
DeloricVI6 votesLULU!
Seriously, why does no one like to play Lulu? She has a kit that does a lot. It's not Thresh levels of utility, but her kit has a lot jammed into it.
manbearswine2 votesLULU!
Seriously, why does no one like to play Lulu? She has a kit that does a lot. It's not Thresh levels of utility, but her kit has a lot jammed into it.
Insane mana costs,causing a very rough laning phase,that about covers it.
In fact,her kit has janna levels of fitting into the meta,if she wasn't nerfed over top lane she would've been spammed as support in competitive.
The comparison to thresh is also not very fitting,lulu has a lot of utility sure,but she needs to chose between it,if she speedboosts she has no hard cc,if her ult is used to intiate(or chained into it) you can't use it for peel,and if her e is used to shield it can't damage.
thresh doesn't really have any meaningful choices,his lantern will generally be used for a free dash(unless it starts being critical to the trade),e will be chained into hook or used for peel,and his ult intiates and disengages at the same time(it's immensely stupid the way it works right now).
SpecterVonBaren2 votesHey! He doesn't have sustain!
F$%K!
Rikari24 votesHis kit is versatile not overloaded or overpowered. His popularity justifies his win and ban rate. I mean look at his kit. His only (skillshot) engage has a windup and everything else is in melee range. Maybe you just rage when he uses his dark passage.
Overloaded looks like...
(pretty balanced out though)
TotalJerk3 votesHow are Kalista and Udyr overloaded?
Rikari8 votesEvery one of Udyr's abilities have active and passive effects. Kalista has 2 passive effects,An endlessly stacking effect and the ability to engage/save the soul bound's life WHILE PERMANENTLY STAYING SAFE. Even Ezreal is less safe than her. Any sole ability of these or maybe two would be enough to justify a champion's kit.
Chromatic Eagle23 votesI don't think Udyr is that bad. He's supposed to be a stance dancer. I think he's a healthy generalist.
Shinjusuke5 votesThe only bad thing about Udyr is that his success is binary, because he doesn't bring anything to the table beyond a stun, and frontline/damage, which encourages a heavy amount of farming just to be relevant.
Either Udyr is a super fed monster (which is still incredibly easy to peel), or he's essentially a non-factor in a game.
His kit is fun and I think it's well-designed considering it's age, but I think he's well overdue for some kind of update to give him usefulness when he's not super fed.
Chromatic Eagle7 votesKalista: High sustain damage, scouting potential, constant dashing with autos, wall jump with Q, a knock-up that can save her teammate.
killd0zer4 votesKalista has no innate sustain, dw I still hate her.
Chromatic Eagle4 votesI meant sustain damage.
A Miss Fortune6 votesI wouldn't call Thresh overpowered, though I think he hurts support diversity. Him and Blitzcrank are both extremely annoying, while I would say Blitzcrank is just flat out overpowered (having 3 forms of crowd control with high damage including an extremely low cooldown AoE silence-damage ult on top of a perma-movement speed/attack speed buff at max rank with a life saving passive) they both hurt the support diversity and I would like to see it changed.
Right now the only supports I see (as an ADC main) are:
Why? Because they all have extremely reliable engages. I don't really remember the last time I had a 
support and the only times I've seen them support are on free week rotation or when I play them myself. Even when Dj Sona was released the like 99% Sona pick rate as a support died in a couple of days.
I think the game could see major improvements if champions with very easy and reliable all-in/engaging abilities were changed or at least some of the lesser picked supports had more engaging capabilities.
Feel free to agree or disagree these are just my opinions and my views from what I've seen as a frequent bot lane player.
aperson15 votesI don't think Janna is an engage support... But she is pretty good against most of them.
IcyPepper5 votesI think he forgot to add a note saying she's unique in the list as the counter to engage supports, but it's understandable why she's on the list.
Ehkrickor2 votesI agree for the most part but it depends. I play 
alot because she has a fairly long range aoe stun, a knock up, and a huge slow if she builds ap. plus the move speed she brings to her allies so i play her anytime i have to support. ON the other hand most people don't see her cause there aren't alot of support mains so everyone who gets forced into the role picks one of the ones they've heard of before....
I Kill Commies24 votesI'd personally like to see more champs that have extreme specialties. I.E very strong niche picks. Would be pretty cool.
DanofDemacia5 votes[deleted]
Saianna15 votesShe also jumps on targets, is immune with blinds, have lifesteal & spellvamp built in and her ultmate kicks ppl with 2.0 ad ratio on uber low cooldown, has one of highest base movement speed, can dash to wards/friends/anything, has low CD shield, 1 of her abilities deal magic damage, so u can't even build properly against her, can go 1 ad item, rest tank and still be considered heavy dmg threat................ Yea
DanofDemacia3 votes[deleted]
Saianna11 votesLissandra does not have overloaded kit.
By overloaded kit think of abilities with passive and second actives, like: Lee with 7 abilities, 2 passives, or Yasuo with 4 abilities and 4 passives, or Kalista with 4 abilities and like 5 passives or Nidalee 6 abilities, 2 passives
Anidan13 votesLissandra's kit isn't overloaded, which is why you're getting downvotes from people who actually care to downvote.
Passive: Ocasionally a free spell. A bit more often if she slows enemies.
Q - Shoots a linear projectile at a champion that turns into a cone upon collision to extend its range, Collateral Damage-style. W - AoE damage and root. E - long cooldown blink with damage attached to the travelling fingers of frost projectile. R - Self-targetted: Zhonya's-like invincibility/immobilization plus damage; enemy-targetted: stun with the same spreading damage as if self-targetted.
That's not overloaded. In fact, it's fairly simplistic. It's effective, but it's definitely not overloaded. Not by quite a margin.
DanofDemacia1 votes[deleted]
LankPants4 votesName other mages that have 2 soft ccs, 1 hard cc, a blink and a spammable strong move. Go ahead ill be waiting.
Gragas has 2 Hard CCs, an on demand dash (Liss's claw is a blink but it's delayed) and a soft CC.
Leblanc's a little hard to quantify because of her ult but when she double chains she has 2 soft CCs, 2 hard CCs a dash and a blink.
Loken Stoneheart3 votesName other mages that have 2 soft ccs, 1 hard cc, a blink and a spammable strong move. Go ahead ill be waiting.
That exact combination? No.
Hows about Orianna, Gragas, LeBlanc, Swain, Anivia, Blitz, Janna, Kennen, Lulu, Lux, Malz, Ryze, or Velkoz. All have a few CCs, and all of them have low CD powerful moves. Most of them have mobility or more range. Oh, and I only included potential magic damage midlaners.
Anidan14 votesName other mages that have a 2 long-duration CCs, a soft CC, good AoE waveclear, and temporary CC immunity that isn't even restricted to themselves.
Name other mages with 2 soft CCs, a hard CC, a physical environmental wall, spammable AoE ult, "critting" spells, and a revive passive.
If you boil things down like that, everything sounds ridiculous.
aperson12 votesNot overloaded.
Her niche is Short-ranged Mage with heavy lockdown CC who wants to be in the middle of the fight. She has no abilities that don't conform to that besides her passive, which is mostly irrelevant to her play pattern in the grand scheme of things.
If you think "oh well then every champion kit can be described that broadly" then answer this: What is Lee Sin's niche among junglers (or even champions in general)? What is Thresh's niche among supports? What is Kalista's niche among ADC's?
Bolwinkel3 votesShe also jumps on targets, is immune with blinds, have lifesteal & spellvamp built in and her ultmate kicks ppl with 2.0 ad ratio on uber low cooldown, has one of highest base movement speed, can dash to wards/friends/anything, has low CD shield, 1 of her abilities deal magic damage, so u can't even build properly against her, can go 1 ad item, rest tank and still be considered heavy dmg threat................ Yea
I didn't know lee sin was a girl
Saianna2 votesThat's overloaded kit for ya
, and it isn't 
